1 shot kills - which weapons?

(Hundopercent) #21

[QUOTE=Kordin;432347]No, not even at close range. With the hit area of a shotgun, its not a big deal to do Headshots imo, so oneshot kills are just to strong.

U are right, balancing shotguns is really hard and tbh i dont know what could help balancing them at the moment. Normally i would say, just make them underpowered which makes them to a fun weapon for pub that wont be used often would be the best. But the problem is the loadout system. If there is a loadout with shotgun only, the shotgun has to be usefull, otherwise the whole loadout is crap…

I think the RoF is already pretty high and shouldnt be increased at all. Even if its not super close range u dont have any chance against a good shotgun player that hits his 2 shots at the moment. Increasing the RoF and removing the oneshot kills would be still bad…[/QUOTE]

Well, perhaps the magic number is 3 then at close range. The nature of a skilled shotgun user would be to hide behind some sort of wall and take quick pop shots in order to take minimal damage while doing hard heavy shots. You can remove the HS modifier, make it 3 shots to the body, and it will still be a solid gun at close range with the scenario I provided.

If the shotgun user is not in his ideal setup (more out in the open/medium range) he can use his secondary and still perform well.

Perhaps fixed loadouts isn’t a good direction? Maybe their should just be the class and you buy the weapons and customize your loadout the way you want. That will put the power in the players hands and the money in SDs pocket.

Then you could pick Engy and have a custom load out, pay $2.50 and open up another load out slot. Each class can have 5 load outs customized the way you like it.

This I think would satisfy both competitive and casual players. It would also make competitive play a lot more interesting as some maps maybe you would want a shotgun but not lose the mine/turret or whatever your play style is.

(OwNLY) #22

[QUOTE=strychzilla;432350]Well, perhaps the magic number is 3 then at close range. The nature of a skilled shotgun user would be to hide behind some sort of wall and take quick pop shots in order to take minimal damage while doing hard heavy shots. You can remove the HS modifier, make it 3 shots to the body, and it will still be a solid gun at close range with the scenario I provided.

If the shotgun user is not in his ideal setup (more out in the open/medium range) he can use his secondary and still perform well.
[/QUOTE]

This. 3 Shot in close range would be good.
Engi camps in a corner, you rush in -> 1st shot hits you. You turn at him and start shooting -> 2nd shot hits you.
Who will win the firefight? You have bad movement + miss too often -> 3rd shot hits you.
Seems pretty balanced, just have to adjust the RoF to match a normal TTK like the rest of the guns.

Give the sniper less damage for bodyshots (50, max. 60), but still make it 1HK for headshots.

(rookie1) #23

if a shotgun dont do what a shotgun supose to do than …take them out …im for leaving them

(tokamak) #24

Two things:

  • No headshot modifier for a shotgun
  • Make the damage of each pellet per shot stack so the damage for the amount of pellet hits per shot climbs exponentially.

I’m not going to write the accumulation formula here but for each shot take each subsequent pellet hit, add 10 and multiply with 1.2.

1 pellet hit = 10 damage
2 pellet hit = 24 damage
3 pellet hit = 41 damage
4 pellet hit = 62 damage
5 pellet hit = 86 damage
6 Pellet hit = 115 damage
etc

Accumulation rate and flat damage per pellet are of course fictional for example purposes and down to testing. But what this does is that it really rewards players that land full shots and harshly punishes players that land half shots or only connect a few pellets per shot. I think this is the most elegant way of balancing the shotgun and it also seems the most realistic. The shotgun is meant to kill someone with the total force causing a shock-wave and rupturing organs rather than to penetrate with a single bullet.

Developers of course need to be careful that this is counted per target otherwise the damage would multiply with the amount of targets in each shot which would be… bad.

(nailzor) #25

1 shot(presuming you mean head shot) at long range is a kill but short range is not? =/

I’d imagine that shot at either range should kill.

(Humate) #26

1.sniper long range, but not short range.

Like nailzor said, this doesnt quite make sense.
Also its quite difficult to do.

(INF3RN0) #27

This game is fast paced enough and the sniper is functional to the extent, that anyone who is killing someone at close range with sniper deserves it. You will rarely see more than 1 kill at super close range for the general population. Even if you have really good range as well, it’s very challenging to use it more efficiently than a regular rifle.

(OwNLY) #28

In the moment a sniper just sets you up at a corner, bodyshots (75 dmg) you,
then does a quickswitch to his MP (12 dmg per shot, highest RoF) and finishes you off.

If you weren´t damaged before, you might have a little chance.
In the moment the scope feels pretty strong already.

Keep the oneshot for the head, but nerf the damage against the body to 50-55 dmg.

(scre4m.) #29

Why should one not be possible to one-shot an enemy with sniper at close range?
It’s not really easy and makes sniper too much underpowered in close combat as he already is

(INF3RN0) #30

Legitimate question; how many times does a sniper usually win close quarters fights in alpha or get a ridiculous amount of frags? This is definitely not like the shotgun scenario.

(Apoc) #31

Sniper headshot, from anywhere, the idea that shooting someone from 1m away in the head with a sniper rifle and it not kill them is a bit silly.

(iwound) #32

[QUOTE=nailzor;432496]1 shot(presuming you mean head shot) at long range is a kill but short range is not? =/

I’d imagine that shot at either range should kill.[/QUOTE]

i asked a similar question on the other thread so ill just use that. whatever fits to make the game balanced, maybe not real world, whatever works.
i think as long as the rifle is that difficult to use continually at short range the close head shot would be ok.
i know the first time i tried it i got 2 insta kills, 3rd missed then bored of it as its slow to use.

its the same as anything, you dont want it over used.

(Hundopercent) #33

[QUOTE=iwound;432549]i asked a similar question on the other thread so ill just use that. whatever fits to make the game balanced, maybe not real world, whatever works.
i think as long as the rifle is that difficult to use continually at short range the close head shot would be ok.
i know the first time i tried it i got 2 insta kills, 3rd missed then bored of it as its slow to use.

its the same as anything, you dont want it over used.[/QUOTE]

Deth stood right infront of me during warm up and I fired 2 unscoped sniper shots and they both missed, the third one landed, but at the range he was at all 3 should have hit his head (he was literally right in my face and niether of us were moving.)

(Hundopercent) #34

[QUOTE=OwNLY;432503]In the moment a sniper just sets you up at a corner, bodyshots (75 dmg) you,
then does a quickswitch to his MP (12 dmg per shot, highest RoF) and finishes you off.

If you weren´t damaged before, you might have a little chance.
In the moment the scope feels pretty strong already.

Keep the oneshot for the head, but nerf the damage against the body to 50-55 dmg.[/QUOTE]

I think that change would ruin the sniper for comp play. I’m not a selfish sniper so I just tag whoever I can and if I can land a HS I will go for it. With what you’re suggesting it would take most classes 4 bullets to finish off a sniped target and that’s just not worth it. You’re better off running LT/Sold.

(ice---) #35

the bodydmg from the sniper should not be nerfed…as a sniper you often get sprayed down from 100m with a normal medic gun…so you need this power to “answer”…the sniper is not too strong in infights…maybe 5 of 100 players are able to win a close range 1on1 situation against a normal gun…so its not the problem. but please take the holdbreath out and give the sniper a ability to make objectives…

(Samurai.) #36

Yea for sure, sniper has a pretty damn hard time at the moment with this “hold breath” mechanic aswell as the insane ‘kick’ you receive while taking damage, therefore HS should always = kill no matter the range (its not like we have battlefield maps here), Also i feel like the sniper is one of the most balanced guns at the moment in the game, the body damage seems fine i mean it requires an actual skill learning how to qs in this game, and to be consistant should reward those who spend the time to master it. I also feel like the time to hit with sniper + change to SMG gives enough of a chance for the other player to get a kill if they are quick/accurate. If you were to reduce anything then maybe low the body shot damage over distance but still 2 body shot’s over distance should = kill.

I wouldn’t mind the noscope of the sniper to be more random to minimise luck shots and i find if you try to qs twice it is kinda bugged, it unscopes then noscopes the 2nd shot… i don’t know if this was intended but i’d quite like a smoother qs

Shotguns i feel should never 1shot anyone, the maps are very close quarters a lot of the time, and its just so easy to get a full shot off on people. But like everyone else i have no idea about how you go about balancing a shotgun. :rolleyes:

(Bangtastic) #37

well a sniper shoots bullets, not kisses. Without HS/one shot, who needs it then? you will be better with every other weapon in the game lol. It isnt a one shot auto sniper, is it? ^^

(Ashog) #38

sniper at any range, shotty at within 3 meters

(Mao.) #39

Just hs with sniper.
No with shotgun please!:tongue:

(iwound) #40

[QUOTE=Mao.;433874]Just hs with sniper.
No with shotgun please!:tongue:[/QUOTE]

afaik there is no hs multiplier with the shotgun, you just have to get up nice and personal with it.
so keep your distance if you want to stay in that fight.