@bgyoshi said:
180 RPM / 60 seconds = 3 / 1 second * 40 = 120 body DPS. I think my math is fine
No its not, you’re not counting the first shot. See, you need to count 1 shot, then add 333 for each shot after that. Which gives you 4 shots, 160 damage. My evidence is pretty simple, if you hit Aura in the head, is the ttk 0.33 or instant?
I made a post about that months ago when burst rifles were the topic of discussion.
@bgyoshi
M4 deals 80 headshot damage in .312 seconds (535RPM / 60 = 8.9 shots * 28 dmg = 249.99 dmg/sec / 80 damage = 3.12 shots * 100ms = .312
Crotzni deals 80 headshot in .325 seconds
BR 16 is 720 rpm with a bullet delay of .075s @ 34 damage per headshot for a headshot DPS of 408. So it deals 80 headshot damage in .051 seconds, roughly 1 full burst of 2 headshots and 1 bodyshot.
All of them only require 2 or 3 shots to land and all of them send about 8 - 11 bullets in the same amount of time the Grandeur can send 3.
So “burst” damage in this case isn’t as extreme as people think. It just feels that way because, as I’ve said 100000 times before, you really only fire it when your aim is aligned and there’s no sustained tracking.
Still not accurate, because now you’re mixing bodyshots and headshots. So let me straighten this out for you. I’m comparing apples to apples, the damage the Grandeur does, and the time it takes for the guns to deal said damage.
Grandeur
2 bodyshots: 80 damage, 0.33
50/50: 120 damage, 0.33
2 headshots: 160 damage
So we are going to compare those 3 damage amounts, and compare. Basically the min number of headshots and bodyshots to deal equivalent damage.
M4
84 damage, 0.22-0.56 seconds
126 damage, 0.45-0.9 seconds
168 damage, 0.56-1.23 seconds
Crotzni
84 damage, 0.27-0.55 seconds
126 damage, 0.45-0.91 seconds
168 damage, 0.54-1.09 seconds
Dreiss
81 damage, 0.2-0.4 seconds
135 damage, 0.4-0.8 seconds
162 damage, 0.4-1.0 seconds
BR-16
85 damage, 0.17-0.33 seconds
136 damage, 0.33-0.75 seconds
170 damage, 0.42-0.9 seconds
And all of this is backed up by this sheet
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1lfrz5hOUaihkviy1VIPo4-aCy7hKnMm8y7W4g269t6E/htmlview#gid=0
What’s ironic about the burst damage argument though, is you think the MOA has high burst damage to the body. Yet the Grandeur can outpace even that, where’s your consistency here? Just thought I’d point that out.
@bgyoshi
It’s almost like they’re the light fast classes with low HP that have an explicit downside of being killed to a single headshot with the upside of being the hardest class in the game to shoot
And if you read my post, you’ll notice how I am not neccessarily nerfing the ability to do that, just up to a certain distance. It’s a small nerf given the ranges you’d typically fight Aura at, if anything it’d only be a buff to Sparks, but she’s screwed if she gets within close range anyhow.
Also, we have the PDP for that sort of thing, sniping light mercs.
@bgyoshi
Assuming you’re 100% accurate, congrats, you’re a god
Average accuracy on semi-auto sniper rifles is just under 50% so in reality you’re looking at approx 4-5 shots to kill, assuming at least one headshot.
Again, you’re nerfing the gun into oblivion because you don’t understand weapon stats and figure them in a pure vacuum. You can review the vacuum yourself http://dirtybomb.gamepedia.com/Weapons
All of the weapons at 100% accuracy are pretty balanced. Only the BRs stand out due to the way they function.
It’s really not that difficult if you’ve been playing this game long enough. Here’s some clips to show how I play.
And if you’re assuming 50% accuracy with the semi autos you have to assume the same of the other guns as well, but you’re arguing player ability here, not the weapon itself.
@bgyoshi
I know, I laugh every time. If you’re switching it from a sniper rifle to a DMR then it has to range out at least to 30m, same fall off modifier it already has, double the RPM, nearly halve the damage all around so it’s more like 25 body/50 head. It -might- be able to compete with the Dreiss at that point.
The only true problem is people can use it without sighting, that’s the complaint. If you can iron sights a bunny-hopping Aura from across the map, you deserve a 1 shot kill. Bringing back the accuracy reduction for hip fire fixes that but makes the weapon unusable. Putting a scope on it makes it s PDP part 2. If you’re serious about switching it into a DMR, you have to pretend it’s got DMR accuracy and speed. It can’t just be a trash sniper rifle. I know you’re smart enough to give it a real shot without adding a randomly worse fall off than every gun in the game.
Research the stats and make a real attempt at it. What you’ve suggested is about as strong as a pistol.
Actually no, I just think it should have some degree of fall off since it’s a Battle Rifle and not a Sniper Rifle, the fact you can hipfire with it is part of that assumption. If you’re allowed to hipfire with it, with the accuracy I’ve shown above, I see no reason it shouldn’t have fall off as it’s essentially a cross between a Sniper Rifle and an Assault Rifle, a middle ground. The double headshots are it’s bread and butter, I don’t think the hipfire should be removed, period. I just think with the fall off added people would have less to complain about in regards from being hit across a map repeatedly by an enemy they can’t see through the smoke. And a chick who can debuff them and deal extra damage with no trouble.
When you consider the burst damage numbers shown above, and the fact it simply does not lose damage out to extreme distances, it’s easy to see why it’s so powerful. It’s currently the quickest killing gun at any range aside from an instant kill from the MOA. Asking for falloff is hardly a unreasonable change.
All I want is fall off added, faster spread recovery, and a better sight, that’s it. After that any complaints would just be ridiculous in my book.
Even when you consider the other guns Aimee and Red Eye use, the Grandeur really sits comfortably between the options available for them both. You can only spam while sighted, and with hipfire you have to have a careful hand to use it.
