Figured I’d make this a topic on its own since its not merc specific, but rather a game specific mechanic. Why, after killing someone, does it take the same number of shots to finish them off?
Why not 50%? Why is it like it is currently, where a downed fragger has the same health as a normal one?
This definitely needs to be changed as it’s currently too hard to prevent a medic from reviving.
As an answer (or reason) to the question; why does it take so long to gib?
To promote teamwork and discourage lone wolfing and camping. To encourage close quarter combat, since gibbing is instant at that range, and force you to prioritize your targets.
Gibbing at anything but long range is super fast and if you have a teammate joining you, no medic stands a chance to stop you, no matter how close he is.
They have the same health pool as they would if they were freshly spawned , Aura gibbed has 80hp for example , aim for the head/knife for a quicker down incase you didnt know , i think that health poools should be halfed for gibbed players buy oh well everyone has an opinion.
It’s easy when you shoot them in the head, and yes, it’s to encourage teamwork. Otherwise medics would have a really hard time even reaching close targets with revives. Also, it’s intended that more than 1 person shoots a downed target. I also think that the that because the knife 1-hit gibs, it’s supposed to be like a risk/reward type thing. Finish them of close fast or do it from a safe place but waste ammo.
I like how it is.
Finishing someone and preventing his revive is not supposed to be that easy, so you have to put a little ammo for a long range finish. But you can directly finish an opponent with a single knife swipe (a cricket bat is fine too). You don’t even need to crouch.
TTK for downed targets is good as it is IMO. Instant at short range, longer at long ranges. Headshots also counts when you finish targets, so if you can’t finish someone with a melee weapon, keep aiming for the head. Some mercs are more suited to finish players than others : this is part of the balance.
Protip : don’t use your quickmelee ! Quickmelee use the stab animation, and while it deals a lot of damage, It takes too much time to make the animation while a small slash takes a much shorter time and will instakill a downed target anyway. Have the good reflex : switch to melee and make a small swipe. Don’t crouch, don’t even stop. Just hit the guy.
it’s somewhat annoying how much bullets a downed fragger can take (now imagine Rhino, gulp), maybe make it the same for every merc?
I can’t quote on my phone but I’ll try to respond the best I can.
If anything rubeforce your argument can go both ways since the health as it is means people can camp quite easily as long as there is a medic with them, since it takes little to no time at all to revive them quickly. And as for discouraging lone wolfing…when the sniper is the only one that can kill instantly and deny a revive, with his primary, I think that, if anything, encourages lone wolfing players to play Sniper and contribute nothing to the team.
Encouraging close quarters, not every fight can be close quarters due to map design, so that really does not work.
You can kill a guy, and by the time you close in to knife him he gets revived, now you’re fighting 2 people instead of one. Or how about fighting Vasili at a distance, if he misses his shots and gets downed, he could get right back up, over and over if a med is sticking with him. Or how about this, if I kill someone, typically I wanna reload to avoid running out of ammo in my next fight, and right as I am reloading, a med comes and revives him.
My points I think are pretty valid and fair, and I think it’s fair to say that if a Medic is sticking with his team, he should have no trouble reviving them, even if the health is reduced to 75 or 60 percent, so 2-3 headshots with most guns. As it is it is way too forgiving, and there are far too many scenarios that are unfair to someone who earned a kill.
I do believe they should normalize a downed bodies HP and give them all a static amount. Especially if they are going to keep the twisting and spinning animations while on the ground (that look creepy). It makes going for the head pretty impossible until they stop and allows medics even more time to revive in many cases.
There are times where you should camp, like when defending a fortified position.
I agree that the snipers to a certain extend encourage camping and lone wolfing playstyle. It is a speciality role. I don’t agree on that it can’t contribute; with a well aimed shot you can take a player completely out for the remainder of his spawnwave.
So try this: since you are already running with the knife out, go for a couple of swings on the medic, or if you are feeling real snazzy you could try with a leaping backstab to the face, then turn for the guy he just revived, asuming he did, which should have his respawn protection shield about to fade, and take him out. Now you have ended up with three kills and two gibs.
And so what? No loss for your team if the medic wants to hang around his lone wolf, not aiding the rest of his team.
And so what? This scenario sound more like a case of ‘you fucked up and forgot to prioritize your actions and targets.’
It’s not about ‘YOU,’ it’s about TEAMWORK. DB is a team game.
Just to clarify, you score a kill when you incap a player. You recieve a death when you get gibbed.
Downed players will have a “reserve” health bar that is half their max health.
Bullets do the same amount of damage, but melee has a bonus multiplier.
OP’s scenario sounds like he downed a Fragger with Headshots but finished with bodyshots, which would in fact take the exact same amount of bullets.
definitely takes too long to gib bodies atm.
YOu kill a skyhammer with half your clip; fire the rest of the clilp, the dude survives; medic comes ; full HP revive; 2v1 against your reload.
Medic trains are a little too spammy atm.
You have to aim for the head…only problem is when i down someone their ragdoll flops around making it impossible… remove ragdolls?
sometimes the head is just not visible; making for a random scenario where one time you gib the body quickly, another time you need to fire half a clip.
Imo if you keep on firing at a just-downed character at anything from mid-close range you should be able to get the gib unless the medic was literally waiting right next to the opponent with defibs out.
I’d like it to be faster to gib.
My experience from party matchmaking:
However, there are some strategies for dealing with this:
It’s usually literally easier to kill the live medic coming out to revive than it is to gib the person you just killed, due to the medic’s head always being actually visible and the medic often having less health than the character they’re following.
I don’t think having a lot of medics is broken or unbalanced, I just think gibbing is a less viable mechanic than it should be because of how random and slow it is.
[quote=“Runeforce;15907”]As an answer (or reason) to the question; why does it take so long to gib?
To promote teamwork and discourage lone wolfing and camping. To encourage close quarter combat, since gibbing is instant at that range, and force you to prioritize your targets.
Gibbing at anything but long range is super fast and if you have a teammate joining you, no medic stands a chance to stop you, no matter how close he is.[/quote]
false, even in scrims (=teamwork) people still get revived a lot, and it’s not because of a lack of teamwork, it’s because the medic is literally sitting right behind the to be downed player with his defib charged, so he can instantly revive his teammate before he hits the ground.
Gibbing is only super fast if the enemy falls with his head towards you which is random, else you’ll have to finish them with bodyshots and in both cases, a medic can revive them before you finish them. Sure, medics in 8v8 pubs don’t do this, but game shouldn’t be balanced around them.
also, the idea that teamwork = staying together and not camping is completely false, camping can be extremely useful to your team, so can splitting up (for example to flank someone)
Why is players being revived a bad thing? It’s an integral part of the game. You don’t just kill somebody, you overpower them. Any medic that is standing there with defibs out is a player who isn’t shooting at you, and also a medic who is vulnerable.
Many tactics revolve around medics and reviving, it’s not meant to be trivial to gib somebody. Especially not in a 1vs2. The only point I agree with is that the current (often dodgy) ragdoll physics add an element of randomness which could certainly be improved upon.
I do like the headshot gibbing mechanic in principle though, especially that you can already gib them before the body has even hit the ground. The hitbox follows the head perfectly.
[quote=“Zenity;16255”]Why is players being revived a bad thing? It’s an integral part of the game. You don’t just kill somebody, you overpower them. Any medic that is standing there with defibs out is a player who isn’t shooting at you, and also a medic who is vulnerable.
Many tactics revolve around medics and reviving, it’s not meant to be trivial to gib somebody. Especially not in a 1vs2. The only point I agree with is that the current (often dodgy) ragdoll physics add an element of randomness which could certainly be improved upon.
I do like the headshot gibbing mechanic in principle though, especially that you can already gib them before the body has even hit the ground. The hitbox follows the head perfectly.[/quote]
It just would be nicer if overextending got you punished more. Atm. the most efficient combat tactic is
CHAAAAAAAARGE
[quote=“Szakalot;16266”][quote=“Zenity;16255”]Why is players being revived a bad thing? It’s an integral part of the game. You don’t just kill somebody, you overpower them. Any medic that is standing there with defibs out is a player who isn’t shooting at you, and also a medic who is vulnerable.
Many tactics revolve around medics and reviving, it’s not meant to be trivial to gib somebody. Especially not in a 1vs2. The only point I agree with is that the current (often dodgy) ragdoll physics add an element of randomness which could certainly be improved upon.
I do like the headshot gibbing mechanic in principle though, especially that you can already gib them before the body has even hit the ground. The hitbox follows the head perfectly.[/quote]
It just would be nicer if overextending got you punished more. Atm. the most efficient combat tactic is
CHAAAAAAAARGE
[/quote]
I agree about the bit, but I really don’t think it’s overextending if you have the numbers advantage with or without medics. You’ll be punished if you run into a situation that you are not likely to win, but I see no reason to punish aggression by itself.
If anything the current mechanics punish overextending more, because just taking down one or two enemies isn’t worth much if you don’t manage to overpower the group.