What does Flinch accomplish in Shooters like Dirty Bomb?

(xRoger) #1

For me, it just makes the game more ‘head-glitch’ friendly and more luck based, and extremely Defender sided. Pushing someone in good head cover is suicide, because your aim shakes like crazy - to which there is no human counter. Nobody in the world is good enough to compensate for sudden random shaking of the screen.

Can someone tell me what purpose it serves from a game-mechanic perspective?

P.S. Flinch is the shake you get from being shot, it jars your screen a lot/a little depending on the Damage you receive.

(adeto) #2

The human counter to damage feedback is to learn to keep aiming(not compensate) while ignoring it. The perk I agree is quite useless, though for snipers I suppose it’s somewhat useful while scoped.

(xRoger) #3

You can’t learn to Counter something that happens in 1 frame my friend.

What you’re saying is that the player has to start aiming for the BODY instead of aiming at the HEAD, he has to make a compromise because the Map Design encourages headglitching and Defender sided maps.

Also, you can’t always aim for the body what about very long range angle holding around trucks? You can barely see the head.

(adeto) #4

You can’t learn to Counter something that happens in 1 frame my friend.

What you’re saying is that the player has to start aiming for the BODY instead of aiming at the HEAD, he has to make a compromise because the Map Design encourages headglitching and Defender sided maps.

Also, you can’t always aim for the body what about very long range angle holding around trucks? You can barely see the head.[/quote]

Read properly before replying… And don’t say 'what you’re saying’and then continue with a sentence that isn’t even close to what I said…

(Rhyno) #5

You could just kill the guy and stop complaining.

(xRoger) #6

You can’t learn to Counter something that happens in 1 frame my friend.

What you’re saying is that the player has to start aiming for the BODY instead of aiming at the HEAD, he has to make a compromise because the Map Design encourages headglitching and Defender sided maps.

Also, you can’t always aim for the body what about very long range angle holding around trucks? You can barely see the head.[/quote]

Bro, you need to read it. I said there is no human counter, at all. Not even aiming at them continuously, I’m not trying to be a dick or anything, but you seem quite angry. Just my opinion. Calm your tits.

I have no problem killing even Fraggers, but the issue arises in Competitive play when 5 good players play against 5 other good players. It makes Defending much too strong.

(Zenity) #7

The purpose of the mechanic is to give an edge to the player who gets the first shot in. Getting the jump on players with clever positioning or strategy is much less vital in a tracking based shooter like Dirty Bomb (long TTK), but the flinch balances this out a bit.

If you remove it, you will put more emphasis on raw aim and less on positioning. Some will like it, some not. But I think it’s pretty good as it is. The flinch was much more irritating in ET IMO.

An alternative mechanic would be “tagging” which slows you down after being hit as in CSGO, but I think I would find this even more irritating. The way it is now at least you can make a quick escape and try again from a better angle.

(xRoger) #8

[quote=“Zenity;17222”]The purpose of the mechanic is to give an edge to the player who gets the first shot in. Getting the jump on players with clever positioning or strategy is much less vital in a tracking based shooter like Dirty Bomb (long TTK), but the flinch balances this out a bit.

If you remove it, you will put more emphasis on raw aim and less on positioning. Some will like it, some not. But I think it’s pretty good as it is. The flinch was much more irritating in ET IMO.

An alternative mechanic would be “tagging” which slows you down after being hit as in CSGO, but I think I would find this even more irritating. The way it is now at least you can make a quick escape and try again from a better angle.[/quote]

I completely understand and thank you for your insight. I would like to say that Flinch is completely random, and it can change depending on the damage being taken/angle. If it was less jumpy and more consistent, I wouldn’t mind it that much.

However, do we really need to reward the Defensive player even more? The current meta, IMHO, is that the person holding an angle against 1 player usually has the edge. This is especially true when holding a sharp angle like a truck or the EV.

(Ardez1) #9

So first off your initial sentence contradicts itself. “Flinch is completely random, and it can change depending on the damage being taken/angle”.

Could you provide an example of how it is jumpy and not consistent? Like could you provide the recording that you took to study the aimpunch? I would assume you had some solid evidence to back up your argument and just forgot to include it with your original post. I would be excited to see your evaluations and thoughts on how the system could be improved :smiley: For example, can you confirm that the aimpunch lasts for only 1 frame? Also, what are the odds that 1 frame(the number you provided) of image will ruin your aim for the entire .5-2 second fight(general estimation of 1v1 encounter lengths at close-mid range)?

A 1v1 scenario general comes down to relative skill and not who is ‘holding an angle’. When I round a corner I don’t do it with my head where an enemies crosshair is most likely to be(usually). Also, if a player is purely camping a corner then they are playing the game quite wrong, as that is a sure way to die. Camping strategies in this game are foolhardy at best and any player that knows what they are doing should be able to outfox a stationary opponent. As long as we are just theorizing I hope you accept my opinion without solid evidence :smiley:

Finally, if it was consistent would it even be providing an advantage? The idea is that the player has to make up for the disadvantage. No amount of compensation will make up for the VERY momentary loss of accuracy, but how the player copes is what helps make this a skill based game instead of just a click2win game.

As a fun fact, did you know that this game has many thrown/projectile items that can also cause a flinch if it goes off too close? Many mercs will use them to clear campers or severely wound them on important routes and objectives :smiley: They are quite effective at giving the player that threw them the edge in the coming combat IF used properly.

(xRoger) #10

[quote=“Ardez;17231”]So first off your initial sentence contradicts itself. “Flinch is completely random, and it can change depending on the damage being taken/angle”.

Could you provide an example of how it is jumpy and not consistent? Like could you provide the recording that you took to study the aimpunch? I would assume you had some solid evidence to back up your argument and just forgot to include it with your original post. I would be excited to see your evaluations and thoughts on how the system could be improved :smiley: For example, can you confirm that the aimpunch lasts for only 1 frame? Also, what are the odds that 1 frame(the number you provided) of image will ruin your aim for the entire .5-2 second fight(general estimation of 1v1 encounter lengths at close-mid range)?

A 1v1 scenario general comes down to relative skill and not who is ‘holding an angle’. When I round a corner I don’t do it with my head where an enemies crosshair is most likely to be(usually). Also, if a player is purely camping a corner then they are playing the game quite wrong, as that is a sure way to die. Camping strategies in this game are foolhardy at best and any player that knows what they are doing should be able to outfox a stationary opponent. As long as we are just theorizing I hope you accept my opinion without solid evidence :smiley:

Finally, if it was consistent would it even be providing an advantage? The idea is that the player has to make up for the disadvantage. No amount of compensation will make up for the VERY momentary loss of accuracy, but how the player copes is what helps make this a skill based game instead of just a click2win game.

As a fun fact, did you know that this game has many thrown/projectile items that can also cause a flinch if it goes off too close? Many mercs will use them to clear campers or severely wound them on important routes and objectives :smiley: They are quite effective at giving the player that threw them the edge in the coming combat IF used properly.[/quote]

Wow, this is a response I needed, cheers. Just give me a while to reply, I might be playing a Cup soon. In fact, I might even provide some video evidence on how long the viewkick cycle actually is, and how much inaccuracy you get when Flinching. I’m motivated now :open_mouth:

P.S. By one frame I meant very quick, should’ve written that instead.

(Ardez1) #11

If you can point out a flaw in the system, then do it. I am all for this game being a fun and fair experience, but I have seen too much demands fly at the devs to fix/nerf/buff things without it being clearly shown what is wrong. There have been many remove or nerf aimpunch posts, but all of them were just arguing about it and not showing the problem. If you can seriously show me an issue then I will get behind you on it and try and get this noticed more by the devs or whoever decides to read these posts.

I haven’t felt the issue personally(as I just muddle through and try with taking issue with the system), so I am not aware of any big problem with aimpunch. I just take it as part of the game and work around/with it to the best of my ability.

(watsyurdeal) #12

Personally I feel flinch is a mechanic designed to counter Snipers specifically, which is fair imo, since even in close range a good Sniper can still get the kill, flinch allows you to throw off their aim just enough to where you survive with just a body shot or they miss entirely.

(Amerika) #13

I just shoot people in the head first and call it good. B)