Weapon damage stats - #Version 23680

(INF3RN0) #21

Also a thing to note here is that I think a reason why certain weapons are considered “too strong” or “too weak” or “too easy to kill with body shots” may actually just be due to weapon fall-off more so than actual weapon damage. Rifles and MGs both appear to only receive a fall-off penalty at long range?? It has been said before, but maybe we should have no fall-off penalty for headshots at mid-range at all and then have consistent fall-off reductions for body shots on all weapons. In that sense headshot aiming will feel more rewarding across all weapons the majority of the time.

(attack) #22

maybe the soldier class should be slower with mg shooting (tf2 style).

(trickykungfu) #23

Maybe thats 10% of the problem. But the main problem is that the TTK via Bodyshots vs. the TTK via Headshots is to little. Making Bodyhits only count 1/3 of a headshot should make a big difference and could solve the problem.

(INF3RN0) #24

With the fall-off I was referring more to the problem with the FOPS rifles and Soldier MGs being much easier to kill someone with just body shots because they don’t lose any damage at mid-range. That means in most engagements the FOPS and Soldier can deal max damage with both headshots and body shots versus 3/4 damage of SMGs. The SMG already has more spread and less overall damage, so fall-off ratios should be identical!!! Rifles and MGs should have the same fall-off ratio for body shots as all other main weapons. It would be okay if headshot damage across all weapons received fall-off at a different distance than body shots maybe (75% hs damage at long range instead). Only the sniper and perhaps secondary weapons should be the only weapons that don’t receive a bodyshot fall-off penalty if anything. It’s just really taking it too far with the weapon distinction to apply such significant fall-off advantage for weapons that already have superior damage and spreads.

(Smooth) #25

Here’s a snapshot of the current weapon stats sheet that (in part) drives our game packages. It’s a little newer but should be fairly accurate for the current build. I’ve hidden some of the more revealing data but it should give you a good idea of what’s what.

Please bear in mind that not all guns are created equal. We do want some to be better than others as the characters fill different roles, come as a package of weapon plus ability and we also need to factor in movement speed/health.

WeaponStats.jpg1526×557 493 KB

(DB Genome editor) #26

Glad to see that you guys have not yet written off Phoenix’s SMG and Aura’s MP :smiley: These two feel a little hamstrung with the recent weapon swaps.

I gather that the min / max damage and range values define the damage falloff curve, but could you give us an idea of it’s shape? Is it something as simple as max damage up to min range then linear reduction to min damage at max range and flat again from there on, or something more elaborate?

(trickykungfu) #27

great smooth XD

(Smooth) #28

Damage falloff is handled exactly in that manner :slight_smile:


(Smooth) #29

Ah, my mistake. I forgot to update that column. Will fix :frowning:

To clarify, Phoenix still has a Machine Pistol as primary, and Aura has Pistol as secondary.

(prophett) #30

Where is the headshot modifier/damage info?

(Smooth) #31

Headshots deal 200% damage in almost every single case. The only special cases are snipers / shotguns.

(trickykungfu) #32

why do you actually think 200% is ok? Are there other games with that multiplier?

(DB Genome editor) #33

[QUOTE=Smooth;472527]Ah, my mistake. I forgot to update that column. Will fix :frowning:

To clarify, Phoenix still has a Machine Pistol as primary, and Aura has Pistol as secondary.[/QUOTE]
Thanks for the clarification I guess… (you just dashed my hopes :()

But according to Rex’s data the snipers also do 200% damage for headshots :confused: Is it in the falloff area that the ratio changes? The tests didn’t even come close to that zone since based on the pics in the OP and the info in the Map Design Guidelines thread, the longest range tested was not even 2/3 of the SR’s min range :eek:

(Smooth) #34

We actually started Extraction with a lower HS multiplier and gradually increased it to a point where we felt getting a HS was beneficial enough, without introducing insta-kills.

Other games out there have 1.5x, 2x, 3x and more. Typically we’ve stuck to around 2x-2.5x in previous games and it seems to work well with our damage and speed.

(Mustang) #35

I’m actually quite impressed that to allow for finer balance control you went to the extent of having per weapon ranges.

I’d assumed it was done per weapon type.

(Smooth) #36

Snipers effectively don’t have damage falloff. We only include extra long range values to keep the game engine happy :stuck_out_tongue:

Some snipers can have slightly different headshot multipliers but in the version you’re currently playing I don’t think we’re doing anything different there :slight_smile:

(ailmanki) #37

[QUOTE=Smooth;472534]We actually started Extraction with a lower HS multiplier and gradually increased it to a point where we felt getting a HS was beneficial enough, without introducing insta-kills.

Other games out there have 1.5x, 2x, 3x and more. Typically we’ve stuck to around 2x in previous games and it seems to work well with our damage and speed.[/QUOTE]

In enemy-territory, smg = 18 body dmg and 50 headshot.dmg…

(prophett) #38

From what i remember, 40 dmg for a headshot on a person with a helmet, 50 on someone without one (in either case it is more than xT).

What about leg shots? Are they at 50% damage? (preferably less)

(Samurai.) #39

Some very useful statistics here, but at the same time i find it difficult to get my head around all the factors that play a part to analyze/compare weapons. All i can say is that the RoF values that i get the most enjoyment from the game, and the best feel for the weapons are around the 0.110 to 0.120 values which are linked to the Assault Rifles. So for me i’d like to see more characters across other classes (than just the Fops) have the option for an assault rifle load out for their primary with a typical RoF of 0.150 and Clip time around 4s.

(Volcano) #40

i always thought the helmet thing was a myth