Everyone knows that the MoA loadouts (especially the MO11) are the only ones worth using in competitive. However, here are two ways that the FEL-IX and PDP-70 loadouts could be made more viable:
To make the FEL-IX loadouts viable, remove the MOA’s ability to insta-gib players with headshots - meaning that the FEL-IX is the only gun that can kill and gib mercs with 1 shot.
[Edit - this wouldn’t take away the MOA’s 1 shot kill potential - it would just allow the headshotted player to then be able to be revived by his/her teammates instead of being instantly gibbed by the headshot]
2. To make the PDP-70 loadouts viable, give at least 1 of those loadouts (P21, P13, P92) the Mechanic augment. This would not only give those loadouts a bit of a different playstyle and strategy (getting to objectives rather than sitting back) it would also fit the PDP-70’s strength as Vassili’s best close range rifle.
I tried the fel-ix could be just me but the gun sucks, it seems to be impossible for me to properly hit people with it.
And the semi auto just is a big meh, sniping should be about precision shots not spraying your enemy full with bullets :p.
And uhhhh btw, you want a bolt action sniper to not be able to 1 hit headshot a normal merc, you realise the gun only has 6 bullets in a mag and I believe like 18 bullets in total when you spawn?
This would mean 2 bullets for lets say a skyhammer (if you headshot) and like what 4 per rhino?
And uhhhh btw, you want a bolt action sniper to not be able to 1 hit headshot a normal merc, you realise the gun only has 6 bullets in a mag and I believe like 18 bullets in total when you spawn?
This would mean 2 bullets for lets say a skyhammer (if you headshot) and like what 4 per rhino?[/quote]
Sigh… Please read more carefully next time. I said “insta-gib” - that means the ability for your MOA headshot to actually ‘gib’ the player at the same time as 1 shotting them. I’m not at all saying that the MOA needs to have its damage reduced.
For the record, the FEL-IX is actually still a very good gun - it’s just slightly outclassed in every aspect by the MOA. I got my first Cobalt the other day and it was a FEL-IX + S&W combo (which is probably the worst loadout Vas can get) but I used it anyway and still topped scoreboards in pubs with it.
After having build every Vassili-loadout at least in one skin in silver (and a few in gold) minus the MO11-one, plx tell me more about making other weapons viable.
Yeah I feel your pain - I’ve traded up for a total of 8 gold Vassilis and 1 cobalt - only 1 of those golds was in any way good (it was MO22 - not the best but still ok) and the cobalt turned out to be the F91 awful combo of the FEL-IX and the S&W magnum… Ew…
PDP, even after the recent nerf/buffs, has always been viable even at the competitive levels. It’s the FEL IX which has always been a poor man’s Moa. I do believe the Moa should lose the headshot gib and the FEL IX should keep it but lose a bullet in the mag and maybe a slower RoF. It would make the FEL IX the big dog gibbing rifle, the Moa would still be good but not have the headshot bonus and the PDP would be the suppressing rifle it currently is. It would make every rifle valuable and make them all a meaningful choice while also fixing the headshot gib issues at the highest levels of competition with the Moa.
Wait, are you saying that the FEL-IX needs to lose ANOTHER bullet in the mag and have an even SLOWER rate of fire? Cause that’s not going to help its status as the unused rifle…
Wait, are you saying that the FEL-IX needs to lose ANOTHER bullet in the mag and have an even SLOWER rate of fire? Cause that’s not going to help its status as the unused rifle…[/quote]
Read the other changes in regards to the Moa. I don’t want to see the FEL IX nerfed the way it is now with the current Moa having the properties it has. If you nerf the Moa without changing something with the FEL IX it will simply become the new standard as opposed to being a meaningful choice. The FEL IX sucks now since the Moa can headshot. But if the Moa loses that then it just becomes the new Moa with only a small loss. But if you nerf the FEL IX a bit more (not a ton) then it becomes the big heavy hitter rifle, the Moa is the medium hitter and the PDP is the hallway/cqc suppressor.
Wait, are you saying that the FEL-IX needs to lose ANOTHER bullet in the mag and have an even SLOWER rate of fire? Cause that’s not going to help its status as the unused rifle…[/quote]
Read the other changes in regards to the Moa. I don’t want to see the FEL IX nerfed the way it is now with the current Moa having the properties it has. If you nerf the Moa without changing something with the FEL IX it will simply become the new standard as opposed to being a meaningful choice. The FEL IX sucks now since the Moa can headshot. But if the Moa loses that then it just becomes the new Moa with only a small loss. But if you nerf the FEL IX a bit more (not a ton) then it becomes the big heavy hitter rifle, the Moa is the medium hitter and the PDP is the hallway/cqc suppressor.[/quote]
…But at the moment Vassili is pretty well balanced in terms of mercs (not in terms of his variety of weapons/loadouts) - there’s no reason to need to nerf the FEL-IX at all. I don’t see your logic at all.
And you’ve been mentioning the “headshot gib issues at the highest levels of competition with the Moa”… I don’t think anyone has been complaining about those “issues” in competitive play. In fact, it makes Vassili fill a niche gap - being good against teams with good medics, but it doesn’t in any way make him overpowered and requiring of a nerf.
Sounds nice, but they would have to get rid of the moving and “rotating” corpses first. Atm trying to hit some corpse’s head you only killed with a bodyshot before the medic is reviving, is often quite some… thing.
But I really think, that’s some point to distinguish the snipers, after they know where to go with the let’s say “maximum power” for a specific weapon-class, like the whole smg-stuff they are doing atm, without making them all the same.
Yeah removing Moa insta-gib could work, or maybe dropping the Moa’s damage so it can only insta-gib the lighter and medium mercs. Down to 110 damage on headshot or maybe 120 depending on how many mercs have more than 120hp. Would keep the Moa easy to use but in this case have it trade it off for killing power. Would recommend keeping the insta-gib or the moa might just get outclassed by the PDP
While probably do things similar to what amerika suggested to the fel-ix and keep it as a heavy hitter but make it harder to use to emphasize the killing potential even on heavy mercs.
PDP, I just feel an automatic, low recoil rifle goes completely against what a sniper is supposed to be, going from a precision weapon to spray and praying. Really not sure how to balance such a gun in this game, it doesnt really have the mechanics to really do so well, only simulation shooters have made it work that i’ve seen so far.
Actually when I started playing this game I thought that was the case and was surprised that Moa had instagib ability and was more useful than FEL IX in every way possible.
I agree, that way each gun would have their usage.
Oh my god guys please stop confusing insta-gib with insta-kill. They are NOT mutually exclusive!
I’m NOT suggesting that we lower the MOA’s damage and its ability to 1 hit kill enemies with headshots (except Rhino) - I’m talking about the ability that means that if you DO kill someone with a headshot using the MOA or the FEL-IX, that dead player becomes instantly ‘gibbed’ meaning that they are unrevivable. THAT’s what I’m suggesting we remove from the MOA, but leave on the FEL-IX.
Wait, are you saying that the FEL-IX needs to lose ANOTHER bullet in the mag and have an even SLOWER rate of fire? Cause that’s not going to help its status as the unused rifle…[/quote]
Read the other changes in regards to the Moa. I don’t want to see the FEL IX nerfed the way it is now with the current Moa having the properties it has. If you nerf the Moa without changing something with the FEL IX it will simply become the new standard as opposed to being a meaningful choice. The FEL IX sucks now since the Moa can headshot. But if the Moa loses that then it just becomes the new Moa with only a small loss. But if you nerf the FEL IX a bit more (not a ton) then it becomes the big heavy hitter rifle, the Moa is the medium hitter and the PDP is the hallway/cqc suppressor.[/quote]
…But at the moment Vassili is pretty well balanced in terms of mercs (not in terms of his variety of weapons/loadouts) - there’s no reason to need to nerf the FEL-IX at all. I don’t see your logic at all.
And you’ve been mentioning the “headshot gib issues at the highest levels of competition with the Moa”… I don’t think anyone has been complaining about those “issues” in competitive play. In fact, it makes Vassili fill a niche gap - being good against teams with good medics, but it doesn’t in any way make him overpowered and requiring of a nerf.[/quote]
Pretty much every single one of the high end Vassili players that played DB in the Dirty Cups agree that the instant gib on Moa headshots is ridiculous and most agree it should be removed. It’s just too good at the high level with a super competent player as it is a deciding factor in many matches. I’m not talking about ranked matchmaking. I’m talking about tournament cups and the players who have won/placed highly in them.
If you don’t touch the FEL IX (slightly slower re-chamber time and 1 less round in the mag would be my suggestion) it would mean it would just become the new competitive standard and replace the Moa. But nerfing it slightly makes you have to think about it a bit more and would separate the three rifles quite a bit and let people specialize. You can disagree with the need to nerf but I’m pretty confident in my logic. I’d personally be fine with buffing the FEL-IX’s headshot damage to make sure it could headshot even Rhino (200hp) and Thunder (160HP) to help offset the slight nerfs and emphasize it being the heavy hitter sniper rifle.
Sounds nice, but they would have to get rid of the moving and “rotating” corpses first. Atm trying to hit some corpse’s head you only killed with a bodyshot before the medic is reviving, is often quite some… thing.
But I really think, that’s some point to distinguish the snipers, after they know where to go with the let’s say “maximum power” for a specific weapon-class, like the whole smg-stuff they are doing atm, without making them all the same.
[/quote]
Rotating corpses was mostly removed a few patches ago. Where have you been?
Mostly. Correct.
And even if they are completly fixed, we still have the hovering/moving corpses to get fixed, not only for Vasilis, but for all those Sparksies, too.
The corpses falling below the line of sight, the horizont, so to speak, will stay, tho.
Wait, are you saying that the FEL-IX needs to lose ANOTHER bullet in the mag and have an even SLOWER rate of fire? Cause that’s not going to help its status as the unused rifle…[/quote]
Read the other changes in regards to the Moa. I don’t want to see the FEL IX nerfed the way it is now with the current Moa having the properties it has. If you nerf the Moa without changing something with the FEL IX it will simply become the new standard as opposed to being a meaningful choice. The FEL IX sucks now since the Moa can headshot. But if the Moa loses that then it just becomes the new Moa with only a small loss. But if you nerf the FEL IX a bit more (not a ton) then it becomes the big heavy hitter rifle, the Moa is the medium hitter and the PDP is the hallway/cqc suppressor.[/quote]
…But at the moment Vassili is pretty well balanced in terms of mercs (not in terms of his variety of weapons/loadouts) - there’s no reason to need to nerf the FEL-IX at all. I don’t see your logic at all.
And you’ve been mentioning the “headshot gib issues at the highest levels of competition with the Moa”… I don’t think anyone has been complaining about those “issues” in competitive play. In fact, it makes Vassili fill a niche gap - being good against teams with good medics, but it doesn’t in any way make him overpowered and requiring of a nerf.[/quote]
Pretty much every single one of the high end Vassili players that played DB in the Dirty Cups agree that the instant gib on Moa headshots is ridiculous and most agree it should be removed. It’s just too good at the high level with a super competent player as it is a deciding factor in many matches. I’m not talking about ranked matchmaking. I’m talking about tournament cups and the players who have won/placed highly in them.
If you don’t touch the FEL IX (slightly slower re-chamber time and 1 less round in the mag would be my suggestion) it would mean it would just become the new competitive standard and replace the Moa. But nerfing it slightly makes you have to think about it a bit more and would separate the three rifles quite a bit and let people specialize. You can disagree with the need to nerf but I’m pretty confident in my logic. I’d personally be fine with buffing the FEL-IX’s headshot damage to make sure it could headshot even Rhino (200hp) and Thunder (160HP) to help offset the slight nerfs and emphasize it being the heavy hitter sniper rifle.
Sounds nice, but they would have to get rid of the moving and “rotating” corpses first. Atm trying to hit some corpse’s head you only killed with a bodyshot before the medic is reviving, is often quite some… thing.
But I really think, that’s some point to distinguish the snipers, after they know where to go with the let’s say “maximum power” for a specific weapon-class, like the whole smg-stuff they are doing atm, without making them all the same.
[/quote]
Rotating corpses was mostly removed a few patches ago. Where have you been?
[/quote]
Is the insta-gib on the MOA so good that if we removed that insta-gib ALL the pros would use the FEL-IX isntead? I kind of assumed that if the MOA’s insta-gib was removed then it would be an equal trade off between the two rifles, in both competitive and public gameplay.
Wait, are you saying that the FEL-IX needs to lose ANOTHER bullet in the mag and have an even SLOWER rate of fire? Cause that’s not going to help its status as the unused rifle…[/quote]
Read the other changes in regards to the Moa. I don’t want to see the FEL IX nerfed the way it is now with the current Moa having the properties it has. If you nerf the Moa without changing something with the FEL IX it will simply become the new standard as opposed to being a meaningful choice. The FEL IX sucks now since the Moa can headshot. But if the Moa loses that then it just becomes the new Moa with only a small loss. But if you nerf the FEL IX a bit more (not a ton) then it becomes the big heavy hitter rifle, the Moa is the medium hitter and the PDP is the hallway/cqc suppressor.[/quote]
…But at the moment Vassili is pretty well balanced in terms of mercs (not in terms of his variety of weapons/loadouts) - there’s no reason to need to nerf the FEL-IX at all. I don’t see your logic at all.
And you’ve been mentioning the “headshot gib issues at the highest levels of competition with the Moa”… I don’t think anyone has been complaining about those “issues” in competitive play. In fact, it makes Vassili fill a niche gap - being good against teams with good medics, but it doesn’t in any way make him overpowered and requiring of a nerf.[/quote]
Pretty much every single one of the high end Vassili players that played DB in the Dirty Cups agree that the instant gib on Moa headshots is ridiculous and most agree it should be removed. It’s just too good at the high level with a super competent player as it is a deciding factor in many matches. I’m not talking about ranked matchmaking. I’m talking about tournament cups and the players who have won/placed highly in them.
If you don’t touch the FEL IX (slightly slower re-chamber time and 1 less round in the mag would be my suggestion) it would mean it would just become the new competitive standard and replace the Moa. But nerfing it slightly makes you have to think about it a bit more and would separate the three rifles quite a bit and let people specialize. You can disagree with the need to nerf but I’m pretty confident in my logic. I’d personally be fine with buffing the FEL-IX’s headshot damage to make sure it could headshot even Rhino (200hp) and Thunder (160HP) to help offset the slight nerfs and emphasize it being the heavy hitter sniper rifle.
Sounds nice, but they would have to get rid of the moving and “rotating” corpses first. Atm trying to hit some corpse’s head you only killed with a bodyshot before the medic is reviving, is often quite some… thing.
But I really think, that’s some point to distinguish the snipers, after they know where to go with the let’s say “maximum power” for a specific weapon-class, like the whole smg-stuff they are doing atm, without making them all the same.
[/quote]
Rotating corpses was mostly removed a few patches ago. Where have you been?
[/quote]
Is the insta-gib on the MOA so good that if we removed that insta-gib ALL the pros would use the FEL-IX isntead? I kind of assumed that if the MOA’s insta-gib was removed then it would be an equal trade off between the two rifles, in both competitive and public gameplay.[/quote]
If insta-gibs were removed entirely the FEL IX would be in the same position it is now…a crappy version of the Moa. Leaving insta-gibs but making it the heavy hitter would make people have legit reasons for using it right now compared to the Moa while also not making it just the replacement for the Moa on competitive levels. And after thinking about it I really like the idea of buffing the FEL-IX’s headshot damage to let it kill Rhino and Thunder’s to further differentiate it AND offset the other minor nerfs. I wouldn’t mind if it didn’t even gib a Rhino or Thunder but did put them down while gibbing the rest.
