Thunder's flash, Annoying or OP?

(watsyurdeal) #41

No, he has 170 health, and if his mk46 is buffed a very powerful weapon.

He doesn’t need the flash, especially since its practically impossible to avoid, this isn’t counterstrike, where you have the luxury of being able to turn away from the flash.

(GatoCommodore) #42

[quote=“Watsyurdeal;c-216191”]No, he has 170 health, and if his mk46 is buffed a very powerful weapon.

He doesn’t need the flash, especially since its practically impossible to avoid, this isn’t counterstrike, where you have the luxury of being able to turn away from the flash.[/quote]

but you have the luxury to turn away…

(watsyurdeal) #43

[quote=“sweetColumn;c-216195”][quote=“Watsyurdeal;c-216191”]No, he has 170 health, and if his mk46 is buffed a very powerful weapon.

He doesn’t need the flash, especially since its practically impossible to avoid, this isn’t counterstrike, where you have the luxury of being able to turn away from the flash.[/quote]

but you have the luxury to turn away…[/quote]

You are moving way too fast in this game, and the fights are too long compared to Counter Strike.

In a game that’s basically first person chess, the Flashbang is fine, but this is not the case, you are often in the middle of fights when the flash is thrown, and you can’t possibly see it coming before it hits the wall or the ground and explodes. If it were so easy to deal with you would not see even higher level players complaining about it so much.

There is no reason for someone as tanky as Thunder to be able to have so much control over your perception, he does not need the Flashbang effect, what he needs is a buffed primary weapon. It simply does not fit in the classic shooter style that Dirty Bomb is after.

(hoyes) #44

[quote=“Watsyurdeal;c-216197”][quote=“sweetColumn;c-216195”][quote=“Watsyurdeal;c-216191”]No, he has 170 health, and if his mk46 is buffed a very powerful weapon.

He doesn’t need the flash, especially since its practically impossible to avoid, this isn’t counterstrike, where you have the luxury of being able to turn away from the flash.[/quote]

but you have the luxury to turn away…[/quote]

You are moving way too fast in this game, and the fights are too long compared to Counter Strike.

In a game that’s basically first person chess, the Flashbang is fine, but this is not the case, you are often in the middle of fights when the flash is thrown, and you can’t possibly see it coming before it hits the wall or the ground and explodes. If it were so easy to deal with you would not see even higher level players complaining about it so much.

There is no reason for someone as tanky as Thunder to be able to have so much control over your perception, he does not need the Flashbang effect, what he needs is a buffed primary weapon. It simply does not fit in the classic shooter style that Dirty Bomb is after.[/quote]

Then increase the fuse timer to 1.2 seconds so you have a bit more time to avoid it, aswell as more time to take out the Thunder that threw it. When a Thunder throws a conc mid firefight he is taking a risk, albeit a small one considering his hp and the concs fuse time, but if the fuse time was increased you would have a higher likelihood of beating the Thunder before the flash goes off, as well as giving you a bit more time to look away and just have the conc effect.

A couple months ago, when the conc was bugged and wouldn’t flash I felt like Thunders intended purpose was tarnished dramatically. I remember a time where there were two people in the building next to the container on trainyard, and I threw a conc inside, in order to give me the one up on them. I stepped inside and was outgunned dramatically, they all got perfect headshots on me, both at the same time (one had kek, other m4) and I only managed to kill the weaker one, which was a phoenix who immediately res’d himself.

Yes, it was easier to get headshots on them, but because the waviness of the concussion is pretty much non-existent, it really felt like the conc did barely anything/nothing to my odd of winning the firefight. I am not saying I should have won it, but I am saying that for something that is supposed to disable you, it really did jack all.

(watsyurdeal) #45

[quote=“Jokder;c-216226”][quote=“Watsyurdeal;c-216197”][quote=“sweetColumn;c-216195”][quote=“Watsyurdeal;c-216191”]No, he has 170 health, and if his mk46 is buffed a very powerful weapon.

He doesn’t need the flash, especially since its practically impossible to avoid, this isn’t counterstrike, where you have the luxury of being able to turn away from the flash.[/quote]

but you have the luxury to turn away…[/quote]

You are moving way too fast in this game, and the fights are too long compared to Counter Strike.

In a game that’s basically first person chess, the Flashbang is fine, but this is not the case, you are often in the middle of fights when the flash is thrown, and you can’t possibly see it coming before it hits the wall or the ground and explodes. If it were so easy to deal with you would not see even higher level players complaining about it so much.

There is no reason for someone as tanky as Thunder to be able to have so much control over your perception, he does not need the Flashbang effect, what he needs is a buffed primary weapon. It simply does not fit in the classic shooter style that Dirty Bomb is after.[/quote]

Then increase the fuse timer to 1.2 seconds so you have a bit more time to avoid it, aswell as more time to take out the Thunder that threw it. When a Thunder throws a conc mid firefight he is taking a risk, albeit a small one considering his hp and the concs fuse time, but if the fuse time was increased you would have a higher likelihood of beating the Thunder before the flash goes off, as well as giving you a bit more time to look away and just have the conc effect.

A couple months ago, when the conc was bugged and wouldn’t flash I felt like Thunders intended purpose was tarnished dramatically. I remember a time where there were two people in the building next to the container on trainyard, and I threw a conc inside, in order to give me the one up on them. I stepped inside and was outgunned dramatically, they all got perfect headshots on me, both at the same time (one had kek, other m4) and I only managed to kill the weaker one, which was a phoenix who immediately res’d himself.

Yes, it was easier to get headshots on them, but because the waviness of the concussion is pretty much non-existent, it really felt like the conc did barely anything/nothing to my odd of winning the firefight. I am not saying I should have won it, but I am saying that for something that is supposed to disable you, it really did jack all.[/quote]

So absolute disablement on top of his health is better?

I mean what would make more sense? 1 Flashbang/Concuss Nade, or 2 Concussion Nades so if you go into a room and not everyone is disabled, you can throw another to cover your escape.

I just don’t think it’s remotely balanced to have

  1. Some of the best automatic weapons in the game
  2. A concussion that slows movement and impairs vision
  3. A Flash bang that blinds anyone near or looking at the concussion when it goes off
  4. 170 health, 2nd from having the most health in the game

All on one character

I don’t think the problem in that situation was the concussions, but the lack of power on the MK46, it really should have the 12 damage it had before. But for the sake of argument, we could easily argue for removing the Flash, for other impairments, such as.

  1. A mouse look speed cap that wears off
  2. A inverted mouse look, so all of your actions are reversed for a brief time while concussed.
  3. A slightly more extreme concussion, as in the blurring of the concussion being more extreme so it’s harder to see Thunder coming in to kill you.

Plus without the Flash, Thunder can safely use his concussions in close range or open situations without fearing blinding himself, he only needs to worry about being too close to them when they go off, same as Fragger.

(hoyes) #46

Well, following on from what I just said, perhaps they could remove the flash but make the concussion effect more wavy and disorienting, much more. If you have played the game Rainbow Six siege and the operator Echo, the effect from his drone would be better for people facing the explosive, and a bit worse for people not.

(GatoCommodore) #47

[quote=“Watsyurdeal;c-216197”][quote=“sweetColumn;c-216195”][quote=“Watsyurdeal;c-216191”]No, he has 170 health, and if his mk46 is buffed a very powerful weapon.

He doesn’t need the flash, especially since its practically impossible to avoid, this isn’t counterstrike, where you have the luxury of being able to turn away from the flash.[/quote]

but you have the luxury to turn away…[/quote]

You are moving way too fast in this game, and the fights are too long compared to Counter Strike.

In a game that’s basically first person chess, the Flashbang is fine, but this is not the case, you are often in the middle of fights when the flash is thrown, and you can’t possibly see it coming before it hits the wall or the ground and explodes. If it were so easy to deal with you would not see even higher level players complaining about it so much.

There is no reason for someone as tanky as Thunder to be able to have so much control over your perception, he does not need the Flashbang effect, what he needs is a buffed primary weapon. It simply does not fit in the classic shooter style that Dirty Bomb is after.[/quote]

mk46 in close quarter TTK is already very short if you get 2-5 headshot.
mk46 is pretty decent in medium-long range.[quote=“Watsyurdeal;c-216227”][quote=“Jokder;c-216226”][quote=“Watsyurdeal;c-216197”][quote=“sweetColumn;c-216195”][quote=“Watsyurdeal;c-216191”]No, he has 170 health, and if his mk46 is buffed a very powerful weapon.

He doesn’t need the flash, especially since its practically impossible to avoid, this isn’t counterstrike, where you have the luxury of being able to turn away from the flash.[/quote]

but you have the luxury to turn away…[/quote]

You are moving way too fast in this game, and the fights are too long compared to Counter Strike.

In a game that’s basically first person chess, the Flashbang is fine, but this is not the case, you are often in the middle of fights when the flash is thrown, and you can’t possibly see it coming before it hits the wall or the ground and explodes. If it were so easy to deal with you would not see even higher level players complaining about it so much.

There is no reason for someone as tanky as Thunder to be able to have so much control over your perception, he does not need the Flashbang effect, what he needs is a buffed primary weapon. It simply does not fit in the classic shooter style that Dirty Bomb is after.[/quote]

Then increase the fuse timer to 1.2 seconds so you have a bit more time to avoid it, aswell as more time to take out the Thunder that threw it. When a Thunder throws a conc mid firefight he is taking a risk, albeit a small one considering his hp and the concs fuse time, but if the fuse time was increased you would have a higher likelihood of beating the Thunder before the flash goes off, as well as giving you a bit more time to look away and just have the conc effect.

A couple months ago, when the conc was bugged and wouldn’t flash I felt like Thunders intended purpose was tarnished dramatically. I remember a time where there were two people in the building next to the container on trainyard, and I threw a conc inside, in order to give me the one up on them. I stepped inside and was outgunned dramatically, they all got perfect headshots on me, both at the same time (one had kek, other m4) and I only managed to kill the weaker one, which was a phoenix who immediately res’d himself.

Yes, it was easier to get headshots on them, but because the waviness of the concussion is pretty much non-existent, it really felt like the conc did barely anything/nothing to my odd of winning the firefight. I am not saying I should have won it, but I am saying that for something that is supposed to disable you, it really did jack all.[/quote]

So absolute disablement on top of his health is better?

I mean what would make more sense? 1 Flashbang/Concuss Nade, or 2 Concussion Nades so if you go into a room and not everyone is disabled, you can throw another to cover your escape.

I just don’t think it’s remotely balanced to have

  1. Some of the best automatic weapons in the game
  2. A concussion that slows movement and impairs vision
  3. A Flash bang that blinds anyone near or looking at the concussion when it goes off
  4. 170 health, 2nd from having the most health in the game

All on one character

I don’t think the problem in that situation was the concussions, but the lack of power on the MK46, it really should have the 12 damage it had before. But for the sake of argument, we could easily argue for removing the Flash, for other impairments, such as.

  1. A mouse look speed cap that wears off
  2. A inverted mouse look, so all of your actions are reversed for a brief time while concussed.
  3. A slightly more extreme concussion, as in the blurring of the concussion being more extreme so it’s harder to see Thunder coming in to kill you.

Plus without the Flash, Thunder can safely use his concussions in close range or open situations without fearing blinding himself, he only needs to worry about being too close to them when they go off, same as Fragger.[/quote]

but fragger is allowed to have 160 dmg direct hit grenade that can potentially clear a room.

kek
nice going

(watsyurdeal) #48

[quote=“sweetColumn;c-216284”]
but fragger is allowed to have 160 dmg direct hit grenade that can potentially clear a room.

kek
nice going[/quote]

Potentially maybe, but in reality those kind of kills are very rare, most of the time you’re getting about 1 kill at the most, and you have to time it just right.

Fragger is not as powerful as he was, and considering you are basically guaranteed to kill people that are stunned most of the time unless you’re being very stupid, I don’t see the issue.

Like I said before, remove the flash and make the Concussion more disorienting, like reversing your aim would be a great step.

(GatoCommodore) #49

[quote=“Watsyurdeal;c-216291”][quote=“sweetColumn;c-216284”]
but fragger is allowed to have 160 dmg direct hit grenade that can potentially clear a room.

kek
nice going[/quote]

Potentially maybe, but in reality those kind of kills are very rare, most of the time you’re getting about 1 kill at the most, and you have to time it just right.

Fragger is not as powerful as he was, and considering you are basically guaranteed to kill people that are stunned most of the time unless you’re being very stupid, I don’t see the issue.

Like I said before, remove the flash and make the Concussion more disorienting, like reversing your aim would be a great step.
[/quote]

while fragger guaranteed a kill or assist with right timing, why thunder are not allowed to blind people? its not like it kill people and thunder can only do maximu potential in defending team while fragger pretty much viable on both side with lazer m4.

MK46 currently pretty fine for a mopping gun plus 170hp is not easy to kill.

(watsyurdeal) #50

[quote=“sweetColumn;c-216328”][quote=“Watsyurdeal;c-216291”][quote=“sweetColumn;c-216284”]
but fragger is allowed to have 160 dmg direct hit grenade that can potentially clear a room.

kek
nice going[/quote]

Potentially maybe, but in reality those kind of kills are very rare, most of the time you’re getting about 1 kill at the most, and you have to time it just right.

Fragger is not as powerful as he was, and considering you are basically guaranteed to kill people that are stunned most of the time unless you’re being very stupid, I don’t see the issue.

Like I said before, remove the flash and make the Concussion more disorienting, like reversing your aim would be a great step.
[/quote]

while fragger guaranteed a kill or assist with right timing, why thunder are not allowed to blind people? its not like it kill people and thunder can only do maximu potential in defending team while fragger pretty much viable on both side with lazer m4.

MK46 currently pretty fine for a mopping gun plus 170hp is not easy to kill.[/quote]

Because you already have the concussion nade which affects all people within it’s radius, there is no reason to have the Flash except for Overkill, especially since you can’t avoid it most of the time, but you can avoid the Concussion.

(Herr_Hanz) #51

random note: The MK46 is NOT fine as it is now, its need a magazine size buff + (spread/damage) buff

(GatoCommodore) #52

owned by a merc with higher health than 120hp fire support
manageable recoil when shooting at far targets
lazer gun in short range
85rnds can mow 4 people or severely damage entire team
plus

concussion and blinding making sure targets stay still which then gets shot brutally with higher rpm machinegun

if were gunna buff a gun its K121. Pretty useless compared to M4 and BR-16 at the moment.

(hoyes) #53

The mk46 was absolute garbage before the Thunder buff, because it had no way of hiding its weaknesses. The conc is overshadowing how weak the gun really is due to how frequently you can use the conc. If the CD were to be nerfed, then the mk46 will have to be buffed, since it is absolutely garbage at anything other than close range, due to the poor poor accuracy, whereas the timik and the stark do not need the conc to be good weapons.

The point of the conc is to make it easier to kill enemies.
But with the Mk46, it is the only way you can kill enemies efficiently.

But yeah the k121 needs a bit of a buff aswell.

(Chilled Sanity) #54

Premature concussilation ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

(sonsofaugust5) #55

LMG guns have a huge weakness in that you are so much slower with them. I love the k121 but I move so slow with it. In 5v5, the crossfire is real and being so slow means I cant get out or adjust fast enough. I always go with m4 now. LMG’s should be better than every other gun, they have such a large disadvantage of movement speed on slow mercs. Having more bullets is nice because you can gib and keep shooting the next enemy but thats about it. I’ve never seen an lmg Thunder in comp, but then again everyone bans thunder. Thunder is even slower than fragger, I wouldn’t dare use the mk46 but then again the flash can affect such a large range.

(Icecoal) #56

Just do something about his flash , too many times I see really bad people playing thunder and killing nothing, but they concuss you so ez the better players just pick you off. A bad Nader or fragger isn’t nearly as frustrating to deal with

(GatoCommodore) #57

(Icecoal) #58

Just getting back to topic , LMG’s are not the issue here :tongue:

(Dysfnal) #59

to OP; Both.