The king of all "concern" threads.

(Seyu) #1

I don’t intend this post to be one about ranting, whining or bitching. I am curious about the opinions of those on the forums on this. First off, I want to state that I’m not pissed off at the approach Splash Damage is taking for Brink. It should be obvious to everyone that with rising development costs for making AAA titles, SD needs to reach out to the larger, mainstream console user base to make Brink a commercial success. Keeping this in mind, I want to know if it will accommodate the needs of the somewhat niche player base of SD’s previous titles.

Including me, there are a fair number of people opposed to features like rim lighting. An option may have been added to turn it off but its being on as default and inclusion in the first place sends a bigger message. I for one don’t oppose a this mechanic on the sole reason that it will spoil the game, maybe it will but that can only be determined on May 17. My main issue with rim lighting is that it detracts from the experience the two ET games provided. Personally, I wanted Brink to an evolution of the work SD had done previously, not an ET3 but something that adds on to the experience, rather than a fancy, more accessible, bastard child of those two games. I think SD should be honest about this and state, “Vets, this ain’t the game you were expecting. Maybe next time, eh?”, if that really is the case. I trust SD, I wouldn’t have joined SD’s forums and shared my opinions otherwise. Despite that, I feel that what the studio says seems different from what I notice in videos.

I can’t help but draw parallels with what Bioware has done with Dragon Age 2. Throughout its development period Bioware kept reassuring the pc player base that the game would have everything that they loved about the first Dragon Age. When the game did come out, it was something else, not what players had been expecting or had wanted. After all the assurances, Bioware just gave Dragon Age’s core audience the middle finger.

I appreciate how features like SMART have been implemented, ones that don’t negate skill and make the game more accessible but still allowing players to do all of that by themselves. I would have wished for something similar in philosophy instead of rim lighting. I am sure Brink will be an excellent multiplayer game, I just want to know whether it will be a game for me.

(Linsolv) #2

Firstly, when I actually watch the higher-quality footage out of PAX, I don’t mind the enemy lighting. It’s less of a “rim” and more like they’re being shined on by red lights instead of white—an elegant solution, and it helps identify downed but not dead enemies.

The “rim” lighting in the truest sense seems to apply to friendlies and NPCs, which is different. If you want it to go away, and you refuse to turn it off with the option (or, worse! It’s not an option and Badman lied to all of us!) you can just hit Square, X, or whatever the button will be for PC to buff them, and the rim goes away.

If it’s exactly the game you were hoping for, what should they do? Should they “ruin” everyone else’s game so that it can be perfect for you out of the box instead of the masses, when both of you can choose to customize it?

Will it be QUAKE Wars but better? Maybe. I can’t say if it will or won’t, because I haven’t played it. But stop whining about how cosmetic features or default settings are “ruining” the game for you.

EDIT: Incidentally, I haven’t heard console players saying they liked Dragon Age 2 better. I’ve pretty much heard everyone say DA2 is uhh… well, it’s no Dragon Age.

(xTriXxy) #3

we will see in may. ± 60 days. you can wait for final reviews after brink release.
for me, every “review” or “impression” or “experience” , simply whatever coming from people they played brink in roadshows is only rumor. i need to play game by myself to make decision, if its game for me, or not.

i think, no one can confirm, if brink is game for you .

(Seyu) #4

Linsolv, halos on friendlies and npcs isn’t a problem for me. I don’t care much about the aesthetics, perhaps they may be marred by the halos and rim lighting but that’s a non-issue for me. See, ET games have always been about cognition rather than reflexes. My twitch skills are mediocre but that was never a negative factor in my performance at Quake Wars or Wolf:ET. By making enemy players stick out SD is making shooting enemy players the primary focus. This, I think, is going to foster a style of play different from that of the ET games, something that made them hardcore, and make the gameplay similar to that of every other generic shooter out there. ET games at their core were never about shooting people, funny yea, but were rather like chess where how many of your opponent’s pieces you manage to take down remains irrelevant.

Edit: Eh, used a mobile phone to post this one. Edited

(Linsolv) #5

Well, take some solace in the fact that so far we’ve heard dozens of impressions from the community out of PAX. Those who want what you want, and come from the ET community, have said it’s good. Those who want another CoD have said that it’s alright but not their style. Is it proof? No, but I also don’t have proof that I won’t be shot dead on the streets when I go to dinner tonight (mmm, corned beef…). But I won’t let it stop me from going to enjoy myself. :slight_smile:

(Senethro) #6

Noone makes games for vets but vets think all games should be exclusively for them.

(INF3RN0) #7

Well always remember that unlike other ports, PC is able to allow for some pretty good patching. It’s too late to worry now, if the game is good, it’s good. If not, well than that’s that. I think SD cares a little more about their fan base than other developers, so cross your fingers. I am a fan of SD’s old work, but I find it very refreshing how innovative Brink is, but just because it’s a bit different doesn’t mean it won’t be just as great.

(SockDog) #8

I’d like to think a quality developer (read one who still makes games to make games, not just profit) would facilitate and support existing communities. Lets not forget that many changes in Brink are not brought about by sheer improvement of design, they’re there to support a different hardware platform or gamer.

BTW - I don’t feel “entitled” about this. If SD wanted to do an Infinity Ward and make a hugely popular game I totally understand. But like IW, I wouldn’t support such a developer as I feel they’re also not supporting the gamers who buy their games.

Oh and Locki, how about you adopt the 80:20 rule and let your team knock out some mods and projects. Would be stunning to see more indie work released without the publisher nipping at your heels.

(Ajax's Spear) #9

What platforms are you referring to that have these alleged sub-standard patches?

(Shadowcat) #10

I fail to see how this is “the king of all concern threads”

Seems like this is just taken directly from the other rim lighting thread, with some extrapolated guesses about SD thrown in.

Other than the rim lighting, you failed to mention any other problems you have with the direction the game is going.

Yes, the game is intended so that anyone can pick it up, understand it, and have fun right away. That doesn’t necessarily mean they have changed the core gameplay or made it more simple. It seems to me that they have just made the game a lot more intuitive, as well as offering information to the player in simpler more obvious ways.

Instead of having to know the maps like the back of your hand, you can just pick a mission on the objective wheel, and it will lead the way. Instead of requiring players to learn to guess where their legs are and what they have to avoid getting stuck on, the game offers SMART. Instead of having to learn all the different resistance and security costumes to tell them apart, the game tells you friend from foe.

(Cankor) #11

Not worried.

(Apples) #12

And one day, everyone will play with autopilot and autoaim, and everyone will be happy and buy bazzilions of copies.

I’m not really worried as I wont have the monies for my new rig yet, so I will have plenty of time to hear if the game is good or not, plus I’m playing less and less lately. Has it been confirmed that the rim stuff wont be serverside cvar dependant?

Peace

(Humate) #13

Instead of having to know the maps like the back of your hand, you can just pick a mission on the objective wheel, and it will lead the way. Instead of requiring players to learn to guess where their legs are and what they have to avoid getting stuck on, the game offers SMART. Instead of having to learn all the different resistance and security costumes to tell them apart, the game tells you friend from foe.

Also players can look at the radar screen and wait till someone is spotted, if they are too afraid.
You know what splash damage should do - they should create a training bot, and new players can just sit there and watch it play.

(H0RSE) #14

Also players can look at the radar screen and wait till someone is spotted, if they are too afraid.
You know what splash damage should do - they should create a training bot, and new players can just sit there and watch it play.

They could do that with the regular bots in the game. Having bots able to do all the things players can and should do, is a great way to learn the ropes while you play.

(Shadowcat) #15

[QUOTE=Apples;270926]And one day, everyone will play with autopilot and autoaim, and everyone will be happy and buy bazzilions of copies.

I’m not really worried as I wont have the monies for my new rig yet, so I will have plenty of time to hear if the game is good or not, plus I’m playing less and less lately. Has it been confirmed that the rim stuff wont be serverside cvar dependant?

Peace[/QUOTE]

The difference between what SD has done here and “autopilot and autoaim” is that SD is mostly just giving players more information to base their decisions off of. If anything, information increase strategy, rather than diminishing it. Take a look at chess, a game with perfect information; i wouldn’t call that autopilot.

The only thing that gets anywhere close to doing things for the player is SMART, which is mostly a case of removing obstacles and distractions to the player, rather than doing actions for them. The player is still in control, its just a streamlined way to make the game do what you want with less thought.

(INF3RN0) #16

I find PC has more room for modding and tweaking than consoles. That is community patch wise, was my meaning.

(Ajax's Spear) #17

Better. Gotcha.

(Seyu) #18

Shadowcat, the title wasn’t meant to be taken seriously.
There are other, relatively minor issues like how SMART handholds you to the objective but I am willing to overlook them. It’s not just the rim lighting that gets my goat but it’s the reasoning behind adding it. It may be possible to disable it but that doesn’t negate the purpose for which it was added or the new style of play, with a different focus, that will be born from it. I feel that the rim lighting is basically just one of the gears in the machine.

What? Chess is about unpredictability, you are required to to decipher information and patterns from your opponent’s previous moves. No information in chess is ever handed over to you. It’s the fact that the opponent’s intentions and weaknesses remain unknown unless you understand his previous moves is what makes cognitive psychology the most important aspect of the game.

Now think how chaotic and random chess would be each player knew what moves the other would make with his pawns.

Is that it? You read the post and this is the conclusion you came upon?

(asmo) #19

[QUOTE=Seyu;270890]I don’t intend this post to be one about ranting, whining or bitching. I am curious about the opinions of those on the forums on this. First off, I want to state that I’m not pissed off at the approach Splash Damage is taking for Brink. It should be obvious to everyone that with rising development costs for making AAA titles, SD needs to reach out to the larger, mainstream console user base to make Brink a commercial success. Keeping this in mind, I want to know if it will accommodate the needs of the somewhat niche player base of SD’s previous titles.

Including me, there are a fair number of people opposed to features like rim lighting. An option may have been added to turn it off but its being on as default and inclusion in the first place sends a bigger message. I for one don’t oppose a this mechanic on the sole reason that it will spoil the game, maybe it will but that can only be determined on May 17. My main issue with rim lighting is that it detracts from the experience the two ET games provided. Personally, I wanted Brink to an evolution of the work SD had done previously, not an ET3 but something that adds on to the experience, rather than a fancy, more accessible, bastard child of those two games. I think SD should be honest about this and state, “Vets, this ain’t the game you were expecting. Maybe next time, eh?”, if that really is the case. I trust SD, I wouldn’t have joined SD’s forums and shared my opinions otherwise. Despite that, I feel that what the studio says seems different from what I notice in videos.

I can’t help but draw parallels with what Bioware has done with Dragon Age 2. Throughout its development period Bioware kept reassuring the pc player base that the game would have everything that they loved about the first Dragon Age. When the game did come out, it was something else, not what players had been expecting or had wanted. After all the assurances, Bioware just gave Dragon Age’s core audience the middle finger.

I appreciate how features like SMART have been implemented, ones that don’t negate skill and make the game more accessible but still allowing players to do all of that by themselves. I would have wished for something similar in philosophy instead of rim lighting. I am sure Brink will be an excellent multiplayer game, I just want to know whether it will be a game for me.[/QUOTE]

YOUR concerns has been noted :smiley:

shiny red light however is great idea and it must stay !

(Jess Alon) #20

Bethesda mods would be having a field day right now.