[SUGGESTION] - Who Attacks and who Defenders first...

(Glottis-3D) #21

[QUOTE=PixelTwitch;496374]I have not said balance with w/l… All I have said is the team with the higher w/l percentage should attack first…
I really don’t get how people are overcomplicating possibly one of the most simplistic ideas in the history of mankind >.< lol[/QUOTE]

i myself like to try to overcome difficulties. and in these terms 15 minuts of attack vs much stronger team is MUCH better than being washed away by attackers in 2 minuts. those 2 minuts are useless, unlike those 15. imo.

plus it is mostly unbalanced maps with lots of chokepoints and very little side routes that make games not fun.

(Protekt1) #22

[QUOTE=PixelTwitch;496374]I have not said balance with w/l… All I have said is the team with the higher w/l percentage should attack first…
I really don’t get how people are overcomplicating possibly one of the most simplistic ideas in the history of mankind >.< lol[/QUOTE]

They are the same thing.

You might want to rethink the way you receive criticism.

I think it is a terrible idea because the team going defense first will always think they are at a disadvantage because clearly they are the team with a lower win rate.

(PixelTwitch) #23

[QUOTE=Protekt1;496382]They are the same thing.

You might want to rethink the way you receive criticism.

I think it is a terrible idea because the team going defense first will always think they are at a disadvantage because clearly they are the team with a lower win rate.[/QUOTE]

No I can take criticism very well (heck I get dozens of death threats and “die in a fire” comments daily on YouTube) .
What I am struggling to understand is why people are so against such a simple idea…

Infact you yourself I feel are the first person to actually come up with VALID reason to why it could be a bad thing and that is the effect on people that defend first. Also its not balancing in the slightest… It has no effect what so ever on the outcome of a match… Just the time it takes the match to play out…

Apart from the fact that some people love feeding on players that are not as good as they are…
I cannot see any reason for wanting to sit there for 15 min “bashing nubs”…

I am just so tired of going into a 5v5 match at the start being on defence then 7min in having to change teams because all of a sudden its a 5v2 with the attackers complaining none stop about team balance and “whats the ****ing point”…

If the teams are fairly balanced matches will not be a 3 min white wash… they should be close matches that are not dragged out and actually see both objectives by both teams. However when it is going to be a stomp… I know that I would prefer that stomp to be over in 5 min rather then 20… Even when I am on the winning team I just want to get my attack done and move on to the next map/next game.

Sure matchmaking will still solve the people leaving issue… (or at least it should)

However, we will still see far to many full length at the first objective… then 2min to capture the first objective as attackers and not actually see the second half or even 3/4 of the full map…

(INF3RN0) #24

The reason here is that in a more balanced player environment the percentages would be the same, otherwise it would defeat the purpose. I’m not as concerned by it myself, but a lot of people from past SD games have had strong opinions about what side they play first. A random coin toss leading to a team having the choice to pick O or D was common place.

Pub stomping is only a reality in open join clan servers, which is why many games offer public mm que to absolve that. In this case I’d expect most non-ranked clan servers will run obj mode, which only involves a single round. The issue only exists in SW during this open testing phase, and if some clan servers decide to run SW servers then people tend to play the servers with the best admin management anyway.

(PixelTwitch) #25

[QUOTE=INF3RN0;496396]The reason here is that in a more balanced player environment the percentages would be the same, otherwise it would defeat the purpose. I’m not as concerned by it myself, but a lot of people from past SD games have had strong opinions about what side they play first. A random coin toss leading to a team having the choice to pick O or D was common place.

Pub stomping is only a reality in open join clan servers, which is why many games offer public mm que to absolve that. In this case I’d expect most non-ranked clan servers will run obj mode, which only involves a single round. The issue only exists in SW during this open testing phase, and if some clan servers decide to run SW servers then people tend to play the servers with the best admin management anyway.[/QUOTE]

I totally do understand what you are saying but XT is a very different game to previous SD games…
Sure the mechanics are pretty much the same in many respects and even the overall feel…

I think a random coin toss is a great idea with balanced teams. What you could simply add to the system that I purpose is that if the WL percentages are within a certain number of each other the game does a random coin toss and allows the victor to attack or defend first. I do not intend this to be the way in competitive, matchmaking or scrims. Only public servers are where I am concerned.

I honestly do not expect this to roll out like a lot of the old SD games vets expect it to…
XT really needs to hit this new mass market appeal and I really believe that there will be many more community run servers then in previous games from SD. This is where I feel the problem will remain. I also understand that I am saying all this without actually playing the obj modes yet so you could well be right and no one will care for playing SW in public. However the amount of time that SD are putting into this focus testing and standing their ground with all the complaints about the maps in SW shows me that they intend SW to be a big part of the overall XT experience.

Also I do not mean this to sound offensive in any way and I do understand how popular ET and Quake Wars are/were in there tight nit communities.
I also understand that many people do want more of what they like… more of the same kinda thing… However I do feel that a lot of the negative reaction to my suggestion does come from stubbornness and not logical thinking…

I even get the idea of “wasting SDs time” making the system.

Really… I do not see why not wanting to get stuck on first objectives is such a big issue :S
Unless of course it is down to the old boys club looking forward to stomping dem noobs in public.

Anyway it seems that everyones mind is well made up on the matter… Personally I think that is a massive shame and I know its going to have a negative effect on the newer players in the long term… But alas… I concede.

(INF3RN0) #26

Prev SD games were pretty much all community servers btw :tongue:, and I personally am more interested in mm because it’s way more fun to me. Admins did have plenty of shuffle options in the past though, and could even manually move players. Avoiding one-sided games was always a goal though because it was a big reason why many players became discouraged from playing.

(PixelTwitch) #27

yea dude I get that :slight_smile:

But you seem to forget that previous SD games had a very “Hardcore” player base…
In the first 6 - 12 months after release of XT its going to be a very different matter…

I too cannot wait for match making! I know it sounds sad… but I really do hope there is a “rank” system like in Starcraft, LoL and CS:GO… GRANDMASTERS HERE I COME!!!

(shaftz0r) #28

its really a massive “who cares” to me. this is a complete non issue, particularly this early in the beta. bring this up in 6 months when there’s something to balance. right now the maps are nowhere near the point of this conversation being on my brain, never mind as a topic, not to mention that this would only affect sw mode, in which case most people wouldnt care very much, because of matchmaking.

(onYn) #29

Matchmaking and stuff like this should be a matter once there is the potential of more people playing. Right now there are way too many important subjects to focus on, in order to get those people. For now it would be enough, if people understand to enjoy the game, and not tryhard some maps if they see that there team is dominating. I personally dont care if I my team is stomping or geting stomped by the enemy, because there is allways a lot I can learn from those games. What really makes me mad tho, is that when my or the enemy team is far supperior, and I can´t swap, some overmotiviated people just instantly do the objective, and make us enjoy loadingscreen, warmup and all that stuff for 2 or more minutes, just to play another 3 minute game…
If you see that your team is easily winning the game, just pick a merc you never played before, play arround with there abilities, play with the pistol, go melee sniper, just goof arround. It´s just my oppinion, but for me just being able to play and shoot is the most fun, and objectives are there to give this shooting experience a frame, but not the other way. So as lon gas I can shoot, I will have fun playing. For sure not while loading a new map after 4 minutes.