Stoker's Molotov

(CCP115) #1

Welp, looks like I’m gonna be that guy.

Stoker’s molotov is too damn strong. So maybe a nerf isn’t warranted, but I have to say it’s frustrating to play against. A whole area can just get blocked off, and it slows down the game so much, if the molotov is used well. But that’s dealabe.

My real problem is the damage. If you’re giving him an already incredible flank and push stopper, why give it such incredible damage? If someone dies in the fire, it’s a guaranteed kill, they can’t be revived. On Execution, this is a huge deal.

I don’t really know what needs to change, but I have an idea. Either:

-Reduce damage to 35 per second. That’ll give most mercs another second to survive.
OR
-Fire doesn’t finish people. Makes no logical sense, I know, but on Execution the molotov is crazily effective, as any haphazardly thrown molotov onto the roof of the Dank Market can pretty much guarantee a free pick. If the fire doesn’t finish people, then a medic can at least wait until the fire is over. This will encourage Stokers to follow up, and not just throw molotovs willy nilly.

(triteCherry) #2

Fire should finish people. Right now it’s the only reliable method of making sure someone is dead and stays down since they nerfed explosive gib. Nothing, not even Stoker’s fire, is more annoying that using your explosives only to have a medic just revive it like it never happened.

If the damage isn’t intense then it’s not as threatening. Kira’s laser in the same way except it can move.

(CCP115) #3

[quote=“triteCherry;102657”]Fire should finish people. Right now it’s the only reliable method of making sure someone is dead and stays down since they nerfed explosive gib. Nothing, not even Stoker’s fire, is more annoying that using your explosives only to have a medic just revive it like it never happened.

If the damage isn’t intense then it’s not as threatening. Kira’s laser in the same way except it can move.[/quote]

They should revert the explosive changes imo, they just feel infinitely weaker now.

(perfumedTusk) #4

Also, if you end up against a team that works well together, they can screw you up, down and sideways with stoker. I was playing a comp match, and when they got us to last they just all threw molotovs at our spawn so we couldn’t move while they took a leisurely stroll onto last and delivered. Considering it took half an hour just to get a match, this really pissed me off.

(farcicalMesh) #5

The fire should finish people, but the fire diameter should be lowered. The fire can cover a whole EV. Either the damage should be lowered, or the fire diameter should be smaller

(Dwu) #6

The game isn’t balanced around execution mode and it shouldn’t be.

(sentimentalDime) #7

35 wouldn’t change anything, except 120 and 110 health mercs would have another third of a second in the fire, provided they don’t get hit with a single bullet. the molotov currently does 120 damage per second, or 40 per tick.

It should deal a lot of damage, otherwise people would just jump through the fire and have a medic heal them afterwards.

(Hexwall) #8

Its supposed to be area denial. Its fine as it is

(Szakalot) #9

imo its fine that molotov does a lot of damage but its too much-too quickly. either flames should spread a little slower or the initial damage should be a little lower

(Mr.Dubstab) #10

I feel like it should stay just like it is…

  1. Extinguish it.
    I hope all of you are aware that it is extinguishable. If not, you really should give some stuff a try, before making a further judgement. (Not going to expose all secrets.)

  2. Move around it.
    Secretly you have a slight area in the fire where you can walk (the last edge). Use it to pass it without getting hurt. (Mind: If you get shot, you might walk backwards, right into it. You need to keep it in mind 100% that the fire is still going on behind you.

  3. Jump over.
    Use a walljump to jump over it. It gets used a lot, and usually it is easy to dodge anyways. (The first and last part are the hardest! Timing and practise is required!)

  4. GET THE **** OUT!
    As soon as I see a Stoker with a Molotov in his hand/Molotov going towards my face… I turn around and run away… The max amount of secodns I am in there is 2 seconds (usually not even). 35 (top damage)x2 = 70 damage. You are able to get out. (But people want to finish that fight first… Never. Finish. A. Fight. In. Fire!?

(CCP115) #11

Just reduce the damage an eensy weensy bit, and then I’ll be happier. I still need to play more with Stoker, and my next purchase might be Redeye just so I can see the interaction.

Thanks for your responses.

(Szakalot) #12

[quote=“Mr.Dubstab;104739”]I feel like it should stay just like it is…

  1. Extinguish it.
    I hope all of you are aware that it is extinguishable. If not, you really should give some stuff a try, before making a further judgement. (Not going to expose all secrets.)
    [/quote]

this is pretty buggy actually, the molotov often doesn’t get extinguished.

(CCP115) #13

[quote=“Szakalot;104827”][quote=“Mr.Dubstab;104739”]I feel like it should stay just like it is…

  1. Extinguish it.
    I hope all of you are aware that it is extinguishable. If not, you really should give some stuff a try, before making a further judgement. (Not going to expose all secrets.)
    [/quote]

this is pretty buggy actually, the molotov often doesn’t get extinguished.[/quote]

Doesn’t it take a lot of explosives to extinguish as well? Something like 4 stickies?

That’s a lot of explosives, I gotta say.

(Szakalot) #14

[quote=“CCP115;104828”][quote=“Szakalot;104827”][quote=“Mr.Dubstab;104739”]I feel like it should stay just like it is…

  1. Extinguish it.
    I hope all of you are aware that it is extinguishable. If not, you really should give some stuff a try, before making a further judgement. (Not going to expose all secrets.)
    [/quote]

this is pretty buggy actually, the molotov often doesn’t get extinguished.[/quote]

Doesn’t it take a lot of explosives to extinguish as well? Something like 4 stickies?

That’s a lot of explosives, I gotta say.[/quote]

if it works, most of the time 2 stickies can carve a path through the flames

(Thai-San) #15

The only thing I’d change is that it should have a team colored trail, just as every other grenade like object in Dirty Bomb.
The few times I die from fire is when it lands right next to me and I didn’t see anything flying towards me.
Maybe that’s just the Molly’s gimmick, that it takes you by surprise but I think it should follow the rules that every other grenade has to obey to.

(Mr.Dubstab) #16

[quote=“ThaiSan;105147”]The only thing I’d change is that it should have a team colored trail, just as every other grenade like object in Dirty Bomb.
The few times I die from fire is when it lands right next to me and I didn’t see anything flying towards me.
Maybe that’s just the Molly’s gimmick, that it takes you by surprise but I think it should follow the rules that every other grenade has to obey to.[/quote]
@ThaiSan There is a colour difference. Yellow is friendly. Orange/Red is enemy fire. On the other hand… There is still absolutely no colour for RedEye’s smoke…

(Thai-San) #17

@Mr.Dubstab Nono, you got me wrong. I wasn’t talking about the fire. I was talking about the grenade itself. For example: If Fragger throws a nade the nade itself has a color trail in the team color. This way you can easily see if there’s a grenade coming towards you. If I’m not mistaken, there’s even a red circle around the nade if it’s close enough.
But the Molly’s… They have no indicator what so ever and that always get’s me because Dirty Bomb got me used to color trails by now.

About Red Eye’s smoke: I don’t see why the smoke should show from which team it is since it doesn’t hurt and blocks your view either way. The only pro point would be that you’d know if there’s an enemy Red Eye close by.

(Mr.Dubstab) #18

[quote=“ThaiSan;105209”]@Mr.Dubstab Nono, you got me wrong. I wasn’t talking about the fire. I was talking about the grenade itself. For example: If Fragger throws a nade the nade itself has a color trail in the team color. This way you can easily see if there’s a grenade coming towards you. If I’m not mistaken, there’s even a red circle around the nade if it’s close enough.
But the Molly’s… They have no indicator what so ever and that always get’s me because Dirty Bomb got me used to color trails by now.

About Red Eye’s smoke: I don’t see why the smoke should show from which team it is since it doesn’t hurt and blocks your view either way. The only pro point would be that you’d know if there’s an enemy Red Eye close by.[/quote]
Oh… Sorry! My bad. :#

Yeah. The smoke has a trail as well, I believe (as well as a circle around it)… I guess it should be should be reported as a “bug” as I do see where you’re coming from.

(Exactly the point why I want a colour to be added… Gives you (quicker) a safe feeling to rush trhough if it’s friendly, as your RedEye is probably scanning with his Eye through it.)