Stoker in need of a buff?

(ThunderZsolt) #1

I have played a lot during the holidays (have a few thousands of humbugs left after unlocking all trinkets), and I can count on one hand how many Stokers I’ve seen. There were more matches with an Arty than not, there was a Kira every 2-3 games, and of course a truckload of low lvl Skyhammers, but no Stoker.

  • He has access to the best rifles, so that is not the problem.
  • Kira also has an ammo station, yet she is played way more.
  • Arty and Skyhammer has the same HP, the problem is somewhere else.

So, it must be his other ability that is lacking.

I think that the 40s CD is too long for what it does (although it properly finishes the enemies now). Arty recharges both airstrikes during this period, and Nader gets 4 nades (Fletcher gets 5 sticky bombs, but he is another story)

I suggest to lower it by 20%, to 32 seconds. To offset that, either nerf the duration from 10 to 8 seconds, or the damage from 40/s to 32/s.
TBH I wouldn’t even mind if both damage and duration get nerfed, as long as it is more available on demand. If you keep the 10sec duration, 3 stokers could lock down the objective without actual effort even if it does less damage. If you keep the 40 dmage/sec, it would have basically the same killing power on a shorter cooldown (320 damage in the 8 second period)

I have no competitive experience, Stoker might be good there, but seeing the other options (most notably Arty) I doubt it.

(hoyes) #2

Well, I feel if you nerfed the duration of the molotovs then there would be little point of stoker being chosen, since his use is area denial. The CD is a tad bit long, I agree, especially when compared to Kira’s laser which can deal more damage, albeit taking a tad bit more map knowledge to use but at higher level play this wouldn’t be an issue.

Personally I want them to reduce the CD to 35 seconds, but increase the CD when you cancel a molotov throw to 14 seconds . This would encourage people to use them at the right time rather than at every situation they think they may need it. If they do not need the molotov but have already activated it they can either throw it and let it do something, or cancel it and wait for a better time.

(Dr_Plantboss) #3

Generally I just think that it needs to do impact damage, BAM fixed…

The reason I think this is because currently if you throw it at a group on enemies they have about 3 seconds to get out of the way if they’re on full health.]

It’s fine as it is though, but a cooldown decrease would be very nice.

(GatoCommodore) #4

[quote=“Dr_Plantboss;c-217916”]Generally I just think that it needs to do impact damage, BAM fixed…

The reason I think this is because currently if you throw it at a group on enemies they have about 3 seconds to get out of the way if they’re on full health.]

It’s fine as it is though, but a cooldown decrease would be very nice.[/quote]

stoker impact damage was nerfed due to “Annoying” press Q to win.

for myself, i would like the fire damage be increased and the DPS post touching the flame also increased, its really bullsh it when i get burned 2 times and not dead and the enemies who were shooting me are dead being shot to pieces with thunder MG.

makes you think if its just made for denying an area but the damage after touching fire is not that big and you can actually wall jump it to get out of it faster

but beside the rant, Stoker is Jack of all trades, master of none.
pretty good at killing generator+M4+stark

(LifeupOmega) #5

Can’t remember the last time I played Stoker, if I want to destroy an EV I’ll just go Sky or Arty, if I want area denial I’ll go Nader. ¯_(ツ)_/¯

(Your worst knifemare.) #6

I don’t kniw what you people are saying, i see at least 2 Stokers every match.

(GatoCommodore) #7

with rhino rotation? i think wegonna see more stoker with Rhino-Aura Barbeque

(Your worst knifemare.) #8

with rhino rotation? i think wegonna see more stoker with Rhino-Aura Barbeque[/quote]

Yes, but since many many many many rotations ago i have always seen a wild, crazy, british, chef.

(GatoCommodore) #9

with rhino rotation? i think wegonna see more stoker with Rhino-Aura Barbeque[/quote]

Yes, but since many many many many rotations ago i have always seen a wild, crazy, british, chef.[/quote]

you mean Ainsley harriot?

(tominatorx) #10

Played a few matches as Stoker yesterday and they were actually my best matches. Maybe a small tweak in terms of cooldown (a bit shorter would be nice) for his incendiary grenade but he is still a good merc imo.

Versatile, you can use him on every map. On a map like Underground he is probably the best support you can have. He can give you ammo just like the other fire supports and his ability is still useful on the whole map (unlike Kira, Skyhammer and Arty).

(ThunderZsolt) #11

[quote=“Dr_Plantboss;c-217916”]Generally I just think that it needs to do impact damage, BAM fixed…

The reason I think this is because currently if you throw it at a group on enemies they have about 3 seconds to get out of the way if they’re on full health.][/quote]

Arty’s airstrike and Kira’s laser also has a ~3 seconds deploy time, which is fine. However, you can keep them chasing around with Kira’s laser, and Arty has half the CD of Stoker.

Instant AoE damage should be reserved for Fragger and Nader imo (although Fletcher also can do it)

I’d prefer Skyhammer on underground, if i wouldn’t like the stark so much more than the BR16, because

  • ammo packs > ammo station
  • you can throw the airstrike marker indoor for 90 damage like a cooked fragger nade (it explodes almost instantly) and it only has 19 seconds cooldown when the drone strike doesn’t hit. Also, you can use the full drone strike on both main objectives, and with explodydendron enemies die even under the roof in the extractor fan control building.
(tominatorx) #12

[quote=“starElephant;c-218023”]

I’d prefer Skyhammer on underground, if i wouldn’t like the stark so much more than the BR16, because

[list]
[] ammo packs > ammo station
[] you can throw the airstrike marker indoor for 90 damage like a cooked fragger nade (it explodes almost instantly) and it only has 19 seconds cooldown when the drone strike doesn’t hit. Also, you can use the full drone strike on both main objectives, and with explodydendron enemies die even under the roof in the extractor fan control building.
[*]
[/list][/quote]

Ok I can see why you would choose him.

I use the Timik so I’m not affected by the BR16 vs Stark choice. :slight_smile:

Frag grenade (+ the airstrikes on the objective) is nice but area of denial is more useful on the objectives themselves imo. It’s more reliable in the damage that it will do imo. Even though it has a longer cooldown (which is why I also mentioned, I would prefer a small CD reduction on it, especially since Fragger and Skyhammer as well get favored in terms of CD on a map like Underground). And you can use it everywhere like for instance the generator room. It’s imo still the most effective way to lure the enemies out of it.

Ammo station… yeah it’s indeed not as useful as the ammopacks.

All in all I think it comes down to what you prefer. I personally find Stokers ability more reliable on a (mostly) indoor map like Underground.

I agree with @Jokder that it could be a good idea to reduce the cooldown of the incendiary grenade to 35 seconds, the affected area burns for 10 seconds so that would mean that there is still a gap of 25 seconds between the end of the fire and the next one you can use. It would still be more than the 19 seconds of Skyhammers frag grenade (indoors) and the 17s of Fraggers frag grenade. But with the advantage of the wider spread and the fact that it can deny the enemy for 10 seconds, I think that the 6s and 8s longer cooldown is not that bad.

Also Skyhammer indoors really becomes a weaker Fragger when you use his airstrike marker as a grenade. Slower CD, less damage so then I would probably go with Fragger. If however you really need a support, he is still really useful.