State of Play: Modes, Movement, Mercs, & More

[acQu]

The thing is: you can discuss unimportant parameters all over and over again, and adjust them to the detail, but if you do not discuss the “grounds of this game”, and these “grounds” are not that good, then yo can be a master in discussing all these detailed parameters, it just doesn’t matter.

[acQu]

So what is my problem with this game? Did you ever even care to find out what is the problem? I am not alone with this, you can add super duper “X”, but if … well, find out what “if” is.

hints maps and theme of the game, maybe switch to an open world engine, make complete overhaul, no tube maps, no idiotic pseudo fast gaming experience. You are in beta now, so nothing of this, except a COMPLETE OVERHAUL of the maps will happen, but for future games, please … stop creating these maps.

[Glottis-3D]

acQu is right.
game desperately needs its core.

[BomBaKlaK]

Definitely !

[Ashog]

Having artificial slowdowns imho doesn’t correlate to having a deeper gameplay as claimed somewhere above. The deeper gameplay has to do with availability of tactics coupled with a high mastery/skill ceiling, not with removing these additional tactics by disallowing various movement tricks and lowering the mastery of movement when performing extra tasks simultaneously (e.g. sprinting while cooking nade). The discalimers may be good on paper but in reality you won’t cheat a non-weekend-warrior gamer who will realize the shallowness of the gameplay after fairly short time of dedicated play, especially if you fail to introduce the higher skill ceiling and steeper learning curve by dumbing down the gameplay and catering in favor of COD/BF/generic shooter crowd.

As for me, apart from the bigger things that were already mentioned above, I’d prefer to have a small pay-to-win exclusion in form of a purchasable grenade slot for every character. Better than not having them almost at all as of now. You will easily get away with this exclusion provided the rest of the gunplay is not pay to win.
Apart from much anticipated upcoming long jumps, I’d consider testing sliding a-la Brink but on a cooldown.

As a game mode, I’d seriously consider CTF. I don’t see why that mode wouldn’t compete with TF2, provided you don’t amass the silly hats and socks like Valve

[INF3RN0]

[QUOTE=acQu;496422]I only see detailed discussion, nothing about core. The game is not that good, for some reasons probably. Finding out these reasons is probably a good starting point.

::sorry for the bash post, but i see absoluteley no future for this game.[/QUOTE]

Maybe you missed the countless threads on maps/objs/etc that are still active… feel free to contribute to them with details rather than just posting “the core isn’t good” because that’s about as ambiguous as it gets.

[acQu]

Some core aspects which are particularly important to me and which i am more than unsatisfied with extraction := theme, atmosphere, maps, and performance. I have only a bit hope for maps (not much though, because i saw some design, and it will pretty much remain like it always was). But even if maps are good (no hectic gameplay, choices to make, interesting objectives), that would still leave me in London, Urban style maps => absolutely uninteresting. Why would i want to dive in this world. Hell, it is a game, please, there is so much you can do. So there would come my complete redesign of the theme: i would totally rip out Extraction from space and time, i would rip it out of London and create bigger, more open maps (not totally open world), with nature, and i would put it far more into the future into a sci-fi, tech environment. I would rip out the story about the boring dirty bomb and make it a fight between two fractions. I would maybe create a world of transhumanism, where robot-humans fight against bio-humans. Sounds much more exciting, right? And from these grounds, i would design more interesting maps, and more interesting characters, with more interesting weapons. Do you catch my drift? Extraction has nothing of this sort which interests me. Just to give an example how i imagine to be a game like. I don’t want to fight in a boring world, the game design and the theme needs to motivate me to keep playing. Then you can design all the XP, Item, Character, MatchMaking stuff around that, because then you have actually a good ground for a game; something interesting and not alike any other of the modern shooter games …

EDIT creating my patent for this game now … (it is a good blueprint i think) … haha

[Leinahtan]

Just to add my voice / Play the Devils Advocate

I am actually not in favor of different movement speed depending on what you are currently carrying - I have always found equipping a knife to run around a bit silly. I prefer every character having their own movement speed determined by their character and not what they are currently holding (main/sub), which is how it is now (unless I didn’t notice).

About Sprinting… and read the whole thing…
As for “Sprinting”, I think removing Sprint and MAINTAINING the current movement speed is the way to go.Yes, it will “slow” the game down a bit, but you could add in several new “abilities” too. For example, a Stim Pack Medic could provide a “Haste” effect ability to nearby allies. Maybe even have the Stim Pack booster give damage reduction too for a short period.
You could also create a unique “Sprinting” Ability for several mercs. I have always felt every merc, regardless of their role, should have 2 abilities outside of their weapon loadout. For those “agile” based mercs, you can give them a Sprint Based ability, be it an “Adrenaline Rush” booster, A bullrush, a dash and slide, etc.

In the end, I just want you guys to create more unique abilities for more unique mercs while at the same time stopping any silly gameplay mechanics, like Bunny Hopping to the Front lines with a dagger in the hand because it is faster to do that…

[Ashog]

I prefer how it was realised in ETQW - both pistol and knife yield greater speed. It makes sense and is not silly if they are both like that. In Xt that would be secondary, tertiary and melee weapons, as well as tools.
However running with pistol was an advantage over knife since you could do some greater and ranged damage with pistol if caught unaware during the run/sprint.
Could never understand freaks running with knife. I guess the cause was an early misunderstanding when some people thought that knife and pistol didn’t increase the speed equally; later people kept running with knife either out of habit or just because they thought they looked funkey

[Erkin31]

I thought that TitanFall would have convinced SplashDamage to authorize the sprint + reload: '(
I also love the fact to run faster with knife and pistol.

[Djiesse]

I prefer how it was realised in ETQW - both pistol and knife yield greater speed. It makes sense (…)

You lost me right there, how does it make sense exactly? Unless you mean the knife and pistol having the same speed, not the fact that they are faster than a primary weapon…

I have to say I’m with Leinahtan on that one and always found it silly when the weapon you have in hand affects your speed (so you put that big MG in your backpack and suddenly the extra weight doesn’t slow you down anymore?). Different speeds for different mercs and/or different loadouts is fine, but I would leave it at that.

[Ashog]

I actually meant both. It makes sense that knife and pistol are both same because they got the same order of magnitude of mass.

I also find obvious that running with double hand-held heavier weapon in hands is cumbersome and is essentially slower than when running with knife in one hand, or a pistol. It’s just the physics of a human body in motion. Don’t have to go to army to imagine that. Try to run with a cleaning swab while holding it with both hands, compare the result with running with a Galaxy Note 2 phone in one hand.

Not that I am a big fan of realism, don’t get me wrong, I actually don’t like such games because they usually castrate the gameplay and most importantly fun in favor of reel life everything. Still I think the most fun shooter game ever was Quake and its mods and they were everything but realistic. Don’t think that SD should add extra realistic stuff than now, but having speedier running with secondaries just adds more variety and tactics to the game and one doesn’t have to invent or create much to add this into the existing game which is always a positive.

[spookify]

I played a lot this weekend sadly on Euro servers so general lag, hit register lag and glitching were all over the place.

For the people to be as fast as they are with the small hit boxes and the weapons to be as inaccurate as they are I still do not like the feel of this game.

I have a very hard time even crouched hitting someone 30 to 50 meters away. Its like I am throwing bullets at them and getting a bleep every once and a while. But if the see me it feels like I am getting hit by a ton of bricks… I may suck but I am burst firing and doing everything I can to make longer shoots down people fast and I cant seem to figure it out!

Add prone give the game more dimensions…

Smoother merc movements…

Most Important give each gun a life and feel that is unique to that particular gun. What I Mean (Example): In BF3 each gun felt crazy different and needed to be shot in a curtain way to over come the recoil and spread. The M4A1 you should tap away and basically go through a whole clip… The Scar you could had to do short bursts with and tapping really didnt work. The AS Val was the same way but little longer bursts then the SCAR. All of these timings are in a good players head and after they use the gun for a few days you dont even have to think anymore about handling the gun you just are the gun. In this game I have no idea where my bullets are going to go…

[Rex]

[QUOTE=spookify;496704]For the people to be as fast as they are with the small hit boxes and the weapons to be as inaccurate as they are I still do not like the feel of this game.

I have a very hard time even crouched hitting someone 30 to 50 meters away. Its like I am throwing bullets at them and getting a bleep every once and a while. But if the see me it feels like I am getting hit by a ton of bricks… I may suck but I am burst firing and doing everything I can to make longer shoots down people fast and I cant seem to figure it out!

In this game I have no idea where my bullets are going to go…[/QUOTE]

I feel exactly the same.

[Dthy]

[QUOTE=spookify;496704]For the people to be as fast as they are with the small hit boxes and the weapons to be as inaccurate as they are I still do not like the feel of this game.

I have a very hard time even crouched hitting someone 30 to 50 meters away. Its like I am throwing bullets at them and getting a bleep every once and a while. But if the see me it feels like I am getting hit by a ton of bricks… I may suck but I am burst firing and doing everything I can to make longer shoots down people fast and I cant seem to figure it out!

In this game I have no idea where my bullets are going to go…[/QUOTE]

I gave the game a few months break and tried it out today and this is exactly how I feel.

[Ceres]

[QUOTE=spookify;496704]I played a lot this weekend sadly on Euro servers so general lag, hit register lag and glitching were all over the place.

For the people to be as fast as they are with the small hit boxes and the weapons to be as inaccurate as they are I still do not like the feel of this game.

I have a very hard time even crouched hitting someone 30 to 50 meters away. Its like I am throwing bullets at them and getting a bleep every once and a while. But if the see me it feels like I am getting hit by a ton of bricks… I may suck but I am burst firing and doing everything I can to make longer shoots down people fast and I cant seem to figure it out!

Add prone give the game more dimensions…

Smoother merc movements…

Most Important give each gun a life and feel that is unique to that particular gun. What I Mean (Example): In BF3 each gun felt crazy different and needed to be shot in a curtain way to over come the recoil and spread. The M4A1 you should tap away and basically go through a whole clip… The Scar you could had to do short bursts with and tapping really didnt work. The AS Val was the same way but little longer bursts then the SCAR. All of these timings are in a good players head and after they use the gun for a few days you dont even have to think anymore about handling the gun you just are the gun. In this game I have no idea where my bullets are going to go…[/QUOTE]

Exactly my thoughts. I decide to give this game a new shot every week but it just doesn’t work. There are so many things wrong with xT that I don’t think another year of work will be enough to fix everything. Which is kind of weird for the amount of time the game has been in alpha/beta. Hitboxes, the main thing that has to be fixed in a game is still ****ed up ever since I first played when the paid alpha came out. It seems like SD are focusing on the wrong things, like creating more mercs, rather than fixing the actual game.
That’s how I feel.

[INF3RN0]

RawInputUpdateTest true

This new cmd made a big difference for me in terms of how the mouse movements felt, using a g400. Literally made some weapons feel completely different (in a good way).

Also wondering what is your guys average accuracy showing up as? I’m getting around 35%+ on all rifles/SMGs and 40%+ on side arms. I’d expect a consistent 40% avg is entirely plausible.

[Tast1c]

I completely disagree. Only thing is some weapons feel odd like m4 where ak feels better cause it shoots slower and matches with kick up of the weapon. is this the same spookify who shoots ppl on the server with least effort and also said that this game is too easy. The spread was in bf3 also not as low as you describe, most of time you prefer to shoot in bursts rather than shooting in one clip. This only applies in short to mid range but spread got high after half a clip. I dont quite see his reasons and cant agree with his suggestion. This doesnt solve the problem lol

[spookify]

[QUOTE=INF3RN0;496758]RawInputUpdateTest true

This new cmd made a big difference for me in terms of how the mouse movements felt, using a g400. Literally made some weapons feel completely different (in a good way).

Also wondering what is your guys average accuracy showing up as? I’m getting around 35%+ on all rifles/SMGs and 40%+ on side arms. I’d expect a consistent 40% avg is entirely plausible.[/QUOTE]

I try to remember to put this on every time now. Does seem to do something but for mouse movement only obviously.

[BAMFana]

Also wondering what is your guys average accuracy showing up as? I’m getting around 35%+ on all rifles/SMGs and 40%+ on side arms. I’d expect a consistent 40% avg is entirely plausible.

I’m seeing similar numbers. Depending on playstyle, a consistent 40 % or more is plausibly possible, but I don’t think it’s necessarily something to aim (hurr) for. Both headhunting and engaging at mid+ range is likely to bring accuracy down significantly (compared to aiming for center mass and only engaging in close-mid range), and obviously certain weapons are a lot easier to aim with than others. For example, the Kira rifle was my poorest accuracy weapon last time I checked, at just above 35 %, probably due to a combination of head hunting, the enormous spread bloom after a few bursts and how hard it is to hit with it at mid+ range.