Some Red Eye changes to tone him down

(watsyurdeal) #1

Disclaimer: I do not think Red Eye is op, but these are some changes that I think could be added, to make him feel less trouble some to fight against, while also allowing him to still be effective if you were already good with to begin with.

  • Change health to 110
  • Change sprint to 410
  • Give Grandeur falloff, maximum falloff percentage is 75%
  • Grandeur’s damage begins to fall at 20 m, and ends at 40 m, which is more than enough for most fights
  • If needed, change the headshot multiplier to be 1.95, if only to stop the Grandeur from one shotting Aura and Sparks
  • Nerf the PDP’s rate of fire to 90 rpm

Note: In the most recent update, the smoke grenade has become even harder to see through without the goggles, hence why I ain’t touching that.

(Eox) #2

You can get the same result on Grandeur by nerfing damage from 40 to 38 or so. It’s probably a bitbetter because it does not break the standard headshot multiplier among most weapons (aside from shotguns).

Putting this aside, I’m agreeing with the general idea behind those changes, though I’m almost sure Grandeur already has some falloff (I could be wrong tho).

(watsyurdeal) #3

Nerfing the Grandeur that way means it takes longer to kill Skyhammer and other 120 hp mercs, 4 bodyshots. That means that an M4 will pretty much win against you every single time unless they are already weakened, and don’t even get me started on the Burst Rifles.

(GatoCommodore) #4

what if we nerf all the weapons thus the TTK is longer?
wouldnt that be the easiest option?

(watsyurdeal) #5

@GatoCommodore said:
what if we nerf all the weapons thus the TTK is longer?
wouldnt that be the easiest option?

You have no idea how badly I’d want that, cause then we can make the guns more consistent, and less reliant on random spread.

But that would take a lot of time, and unless Splash Damage is willing to take a chance and let someone like me or someone else in the community do all sorts of testing, it won’t happen.

Ideally the faster the guns should kill in this game is about 333-416 ms, plenty of time for people to dodge or react to certain fights. But that’s just me.

At this point, I’d say it might just be easier to buff Aura and Sparks to 90 hp, and nerf the Grandeur by giving it fall off damage.

Or just buff Aura, and give Sparks some of her changes back. idk

(LifeupOmega) #6

You mean 90hp right? :wink:

(watsyurdeal) #7

Fixed…dammit

(frostyvampire) #8

I do agree we need proper damage falloff in the game. But not on the Grandeur.
Sniper rifles (grandeur, moa, PDP, FEL-IX) should have 0 falloff but everything else yes.
A bit off topic, back to Redeye

Just reduce damage on the Grandeur and PDP to 35-39 so they can’t 1 shot and don’t touch anything else. Maybe increase PDP clip size but no change in fire rate and stuff

But I don’t think the weapons are the main problem with Redeye. I think the main problem is that you can’t counter him through the smoke. Sure you can destroy it with explosives but it means you need to waste your ability as well and most mercs don’t have explosives.
If you play against a Redeye that can aim, he is invincible while the smoke is up unless you get lucky or you have a good Redeye on your team.

Simply making his eye glow red and visible through smokes seems like a good nerf to me, just like Bushwhacker’s turrets but a bit less bright.

(Eox) #9

@frostyvampire said:
I do agree we need proper damage falloff in the game. But not on the Grandeur.
Sniper rifles (grandeur, moa, PDP, FEL-IX) should have 0 falloff but everything else yes.
A bit off topic, back to Redeye

Just reduce damage on the Grandeur and PDP to 35-39 so they can’t 1 shot and don’t touch anything else. Maybe increase PDP clip size but no change in fire rate and stuff

But I don’t think the weapons are the main problem with Redeye. I think the main problem is that you can’t counter him through the smoke. Sure you can destroy it with explosives but it means you need to waste your ability as well and most mercs don’t have explosives.
If you play against a Redeye that can aim, he is invincible while the smoke is up unless you get lucky or you have a good Redeye on your team.

Simply making his eye glow red and visible through smokes seems like a good nerf to me, just like Bushwhacker’s turrets but a bit less bright.

Wouldn’t that beat the purpose of concealing yourself behind the smoke ?

(frostyvampire) #10

@Eox said:

@frostyvampire said:
I do agree we need proper damage falloff in the game. But not on the Grandeur.
Sniper rifles (grandeur, moa, PDP, FEL-IX) should have 0 falloff but everything else yes.
A bit off topic, back to Redeye

Just reduce damage on the Grandeur and PDP to 35-39 so they can’t 1 shot and don’t touch anything else. Maybe increase PDP clip size but no change in fire rate and stuff

But I don’t think the weapons are the main problem with Redeye. I think the main problem is that you can’t counter him through the smoke. Sure you can destroy it with explosives but it means you need to waste your ability as well and most mercs don’t have explosives.
If you play against a Redeye that can aim, he is invincible while the smoke is up unless you get lucky or you have a good Redeye on your team.

Simply making his eye glow red and visible through smokes seems like a good nerf to me, just like Bushwhacker’s turrets but a bit less bright.

Wouldn’t that beat the purpose of concealing yourself behind the smoke ?

It will beat the point of hiding inside a smoke/right behind a smoke.

You will have to play smart, either go really far back behind cover and watch it, or enable IR goggles, spot the enemies and then instantly take them off.
Or sometimes you will only smoke so your team can safely plant/defuse/repair without even using the IR goggles.

The only thing it will do is nerf Redeye’s cheap kills strat and increase his skill level

(Dawnlazy) #11

Redeye needs a redesign, it’s not like Thunder where you can just nerf some values and achieve balance. Being able to block people’s sight while at the same time sniping them is a terrible gameplay idea that should have never seen the light of day.

(LifeupOmega) #12

But Dawn, you just need another Redeye, balanced : )

(hawkeyeguy99) #13

And here I am thinking nothing is imbalanced apart from Thunder and Bushwhacker…

I honestly don’t think changes really need to be made except for a Thunder slight nerf and a buff to Bushwhacker’s turret

(Szakalot) #14

@Dawnlazy said:
Redeye needs a redesign, it’s not like Thunder where you can just nerf some values and achieve balance. Being able to block people’s sight while at the same time sniping them is a terrible gameplay idea that should have never seen the light of day.

smoke was good in pre-steam beta, it had no more than half of the duration it has currently, so redeye couldnt zone an entire choke for the duration of the spawnwave. Basically, smoke was used as temporary ambush utility, to gain an advantage for 1 clip and hopefully turn the tide of battle.

With post-steam redeye release they buffed smoke with sth like 2x duration and half as big radius.

Imo eiher smoke gets considerably shorter, or cooldown on smoke nade gets significantly longer.

Grandeur is a whole different story, I would start with increasing fall off, to distinguish it from long range PDP snipey-snipe a bit.

(GatoCommodore) #15

@Szakalot said:

@Dawnlazy said:
Redeye needs a redesign, it’s not like Thunder where you can just nerf some values and achieve balance. Being able to block people’s sight while at the same time sniping them is a terrible gameplay idea that should have never seen the light of day.

smoke was good in pre-steam beta, it had no more than half of the duration it has currently, so redeye couldnt zone an entire choke for the duration of the spawnwave. Basically, smoke was used as temporary ambush utility, to gain an advantage for 1 clip and hopefully turn the tide of battle.

With post-steam redeye release they buffed smoke with sth like 2x duration and half as big radius.

Imo eiher smoke gets considerably shorter, or cooldown on smoke nade gets significantly longer.

Grandeur is a whole different story, I would start with increasing fall off, to distinguish it from long range PDP snipey-snipe a bit.

shorter smoke would be dank tho, Red Eye become ninja for 1 clip sounds fun

(watsyurdeal) #16

I can get behind shorter smoke, the goggles go out faster than the smoke. For balance they should be equal.

(BlackboltLW) #17

Isn’t the IR goggle supposed to be glowing red back then? I really hope they implemented it back tbh.

(GatoCommodore) #18

@watsyurdeal said:
I can get behind shorter smoke, the goggles go out faster than the smoke. For balance they should be equal.

oh but what do we know, we arent the guys at PTS amirite

(GatoCommodore) #19

@watsyurdeal said:
I can get behind shorter smoke, the goggles go out faster than the smoke. For balance they should be equal.

oh but what do we know, we arent the guys at PTS amirite