Should the tutorial be forced?

(BerylRdm) #21

I don’t like the idea of forcing people to do such things as going through the tutorial. This isn’t a pleasant welcome imo. But I very much like @bontsa 's idea of rewarding people for going through it.

(EverythingElse) #22

Definitely yes, AND make the people who haven’t completed the tutorial do it. Maybe have it be 20k credits so when the new players hit lvl 4 they can immediately get a 50k merc instead of getting the generic Vassili or Proxy. Also make Vassili unlockable after level 15

(aminuseternal) #23

But if people cant get vassili until after lvl 15, then they will just suck as vassili at a higher level…
And wouldn’t being able to get a 50k merc just make people go for objective specialist less?

But what is forcing people to play the tutorial really going to to? Its not a quick fix for a perceived problem. The tutorial is there to teach the basics of a game, not make new players into great players. There is forcing someone to learn a mechanic through gameplay, and then there is forcing someone to have their hand held, and I dont think DB would benefit from handholding. Also lets just remember that it is an fps game, some people tend to play shooters, for some sort of shooting mechanic :wink:

However, the real question is… Why do so few people like cheese? ;_;

Oh and can someone provide an example of a game where a forced tutorial works that is not dark souls?

(MarsRover) #24

It won’t help everyone, but it will help. Every damn day I see level 10+ players that stack repairs, don’t know that you can’t destroy generators with explosives etc. Those are people that decided to stick with the game, at least a lot longer than the average player. Sure, some people will be dummies no matter what but DB doesn’t do everything it can to try and minimize that.

Hard to do that without a parallel universe where that game doesn’t have a mandatory tutorial :slight_smile:

(Terminal_6) #25

I might go for a sort of mandatory “express tutorial” that very briefly touches on WASD etc. for the people who have never played an FPS before, class basics, and objectives. I think cramming every single one of DB’s subtleties and nuance would try some people’s patience. Yes, 10 minutes of instruction can test certain people’s attention.
I’d want it to automatically transition into advanced tutorials, but then allow players to quit and find a game. Some will continue the tutorial, others won’t, but they’ll all know the complete box set is there.

And can we make it more obvious which mercs fill which roles? This isn’t really related, but teaching players indirectly can be super efficient. No one wants an Overwatch comparison, but their heroes are all listed by role, which not only makes them easier to find, but easier to decipher at a glance for new players. We could have had this long before OW.

(MarsRover) #26

That’s the exact opposite of what I want. Starting the tutorial with “WASD to move, space to jump” etc is the best way of ensuring that players will turn it off before they get to the important and unique DB mechanics. Skip all that, skip all of it. Seriously, the tutorial should start with (in male announcers voice) “if you’ve never played an FPS then GTFO and play something singleplayer like Wolfenstein, a new Doom just came out and I heard it’s pretty good… Now for the rest of you - you know the basics to I’ll just go right into the important parts <cue talk about ADS, walljumping, repairing, fucking charging the paddles etc.>”.

The tutorial should teach things unique to DB. A fast paced multiplayer shooter is not the place to learn basic FPS controls. If someone has never played an FPS before, they’ll be annihilated no matter what tutorials you throw at them.

(bontsa) #27

@Terminal_6 We just got rid of the crap awful “how to WASD” tutorial part (it was a part of the first implementation of tutorial), I’m extremely happy that uselessness was ditched.

(Xyfurion) #28

[quote=“aminuseternal;201030”]
Oh and can someone provide an example of a game where a forced tutorial works that is not dark souls?[/quote]

Portal 2 has an unskippable tutorial. It’s mainly to introduce Wheatley but also does a good job of introducing the player to the game.

(aminuseternal) #29

@MarsRover, okay yeah I could definitely see the part about showing players generators are destroyable with stuff other than c4, its really the only way to get past the barricade on bridge.

An I think having a much louder and more obvious teammate repairing UI would help with that, I think some people just don’t notice that tiny yellow text or everyone just really fancies that obj XP. However, I do often see people(even lower lvls) rush over to do an obj when they have the mechanic augment and an engi isn’t around :smiley:

@Terminal_6 actually now that you point it out, it is weird that mercs are not sorted by role. It would be an easy UI change I imagine, and maybe have a bit talking about what each role does. Like “Fire support are used to distribute ammo, keep your team in the fight, and blow crap up.”

@Xyfurion okay ill have to check it out sometime, I never played either of the portal games >_>

(Diosito) #30

Yes, it should be mandatory BUT I LIKE CHEESE and that is more important than tutorial.

Abbadon
Abaddon

(manicMicrowave) #31

The tutorial is a disappointment. It gets you all hyped for some single player squad based content with the medic but the game does not have any PVE. I know that the game is not advertised as having any but it is still very mean to get give you false hope. At least it was changed so now it is less of a set-up where you would expect to be able to get your other merc back up yourself. I still think some single player or coop campaign would be great with the mechanics the game has.

The tutorial is almost too good to let new player pass up on it and making it mandatory might slow down all the hackers that keep making new accounts.

(SaulWolfden) #32

It could use improvements, but regardless, I see no reason for it not to be mandatory, it’s so short anyway so it’s not like it would be hard for anyone to get through.

(Terminal_6) #33

We did? I only played the new thing once. I figured you could just spray the controls on a wall in an obvious position. Some people gotta learn, but yes it is annoying to learn how to WASD for the 10th time.

(bontsa) #34

We did? I only played the new thing once. I figured you could just spray the controls on a wall in an obvious position. Some people gotta learn, but yes it is annoying to learn how to WASD for the 10th time.[/quote]

I’m not sure if that’s ment to imply I’ve played it 10 times or what but having to play it multiple times is not my point.

WASD stuff is something utilized in so many games, not only FPS’s, that its quite moot to put in tutorials nowadays. As @MarsRover also pointed out, if someone really finds DB as their first ever shooter (and specifically first ever game to use WASD-style movement controls) they’re going to have hard times no matter how many tutorials you advice them to go through. They’d honestly be better off with slower phased games. If they want class based action, maybe TF2 or BF or similar.

So tutorial should definitely be kept focusing on stuff unique to/ relevant in DB rather than shooters overall. Even if reviving / health and ammo support are certainly not DB exclusive mechanics, it’s necessary to point out to new player DB does have them and how to utilize them.

I have no opinion about spraying the controls somewhere in a wall, graffiti like for example for the sake of games theme, so sure why not. We’ll see.

(The_N00Ba) #35

From what I have learned, it is always good to assume that there will be a player new to the genre. No matter how they got into the genre and how they chose to play your game as their first. It tends to be important to remember that those players exist and to help them learn to experience the genre in all it’s glory.

So I would say make the WASD stuff optional and make it so it can be skipped probably via the voting options to help new or newer players get used to the voting idea. Keeping the basics on a wall though some where would be a good idea as well. I guess it depend on what SD wants to do with that merc base.

I definitely agree on keeping the tutorial more focused on DB mechanics, and game play. Afterwards the player should be able to just be dropped right into a game. :slight_smile:

(bontsa) #36

Ok well that voting suggestion was pretty brilliant as that in itself would include one element necessary in DB’s online-environment (showing where the HUD element is and the simple controls). Sure if it was optional why not, old one could even be recycled for that so practically no extra work necessary. Adding one as a fixed part of the tutorial is a definite no-no. I’m still sadly cynical that people who would go through that will just give up on the game forever after 1 game outside maxlvl5 servers but, shurg

(Wedgebox) #37

The tutorial should be VERY forced. It teaches how to play the game, and the play style of DB and how it’s different from generic FPS. And besides that, noobs…

(Wedgebox) #38

[quote=“manicMicrowave;201133”]The tutorial is a disappointment. It gets you all hyped for some single player squad based content with the medic but the game does not have any PVE. I know that the game is not advertised as having any but it is still very mean to get give you false hope. At least it was changed so now it is less of a set-up where you would expect to be able to get your other merc back up yourself. I still think some single player or coop campaign would be great with the mechanics the game has.

The tutorial is almost too good to let new player pass up on it and making it mandatory might slow down all the hackers that keep making new accounts.[/quote]

I don’t want another flag, so I’m just going to simply say: No. Just, no.

(HamanDinduNuffin) #39

why forced tutorial is not applied from the start of the beta @RazielWarmonic ?

(The_N00Ba) #40

what Wedgebox?

You know having a tutorial that draws the player more into the world of DB does sound interesting. getting the players in the right mind set from the beginning could be useful provided the player chooses to do so.