The Selbstadt .40 and the Simeon .357 are basically direct downgrades to the M9 and the Smjüth & Whetsman respectively. The Selbstadt is worse than the M9 because it has 3 fewer rounds in the magazine and no other noticeable benefit. The Simeon is worse than the S&W because it has 2 less damage per bullet, amounting to 10 less DPS. I have heard that the Simeon has less recoil/spread but I haven’t really noticed the difference in use. And even if the Selbstadt has some kind of benefit to compensate for its smaller magazine, and even if the Simeon has some kind of benefit to compensate for its lower DPS, they’re still incredibly similar to the M9 and the S&W to the point that they’re completely redundant and could use a change to make them more interesting.
Redundant Pistols
I agree they should make them more unique but they should still be statistically worse to keep in line with the augment balance etc.
The thing that amuses me about your post is that in both cases I had noticed the difference on paper in much the same way that you have, but I still prefer those guns to their nominally-superior counterparts on a purely aesthetic level.
If there’s some other benefit to them that’s great and all, but I just straight up like the look and feel of them more. While sidearms are an important part of the game, I don’t think they’re yet important enough to worry me much over 2 damage per bullet in a 6 round revolver. Similarly, 12 rounds really ought to be enough to do whatever it was you were trying for after emptying your primary. If it wasn’t… well, that’s too bad, but that’s a fairly fringe case and I don’t feel it’s a common enough scenario to make me say “No, I can’t use that loadout, it has the Selbstadt .40”.
Personal feelings aside, you suggest some kind of change to these guns. What sort of thing did you have in mind?
Besides maybe less damage or lower ammo capacity in the Selbstadt all those guns along with the Caulden compared to the DE. 50 have a lower increase to their spread after each shot, letting one fire them quickly without worrying about their accuracy.
The Selbstadt is more accurate than The M9 at the price of less ammo.
The Caulden is more accurate than the DE .50, at the price of less damage.
The Simeon is more accurate than The Smjüth & Whetsman, at the price of less damage.
None of the weapons should ever be regarded solely by their Damage per Hit, DPS, and magazine size, ever. DB’s weapons are very finely tuned with regard to not only those metrics, but various forms of accuracy (spread, recovery, time to sight/desight) and movement characteristics.
What you guys seem to be unaware of is that the Selbstadt has a range advantage over the M9. It will do more damage at medium-long range than the M9. And actually, I believe the M9 is more accurate than the Selbstady, but the caveat to downing an enemy at range is to have exceptionally good accuracy (~20dmg/headshot).
Play the game more before assuming the information available on the net is perfect/perfectly reliable. The Simeon isn’t simply more accurate - I would say the S&W and Sim have the same fresh, settled accuracy, but the Simeon can be accurately rapid fired (firing as fast as you can click your mouse) in either hipfire or IS, whereas the S&W requires a brief pause between shots, unless you’re within melee contact range of your enemy (even then, you’re giving up headshot potential to desperately fling damage at your enemy).
I’m not regarding weapons solely by their damage, DPS and magazine size. I’m regarding them by the statistics that I have access to which are relevant when comparing these weapons. If there was a difference in rate of fire I would compare those too, but there is no difference in rate of fire, so that statistic is irrelevant.
If your information isn’t available online, where did you get it? Did you do extensive testing with some friends to calculate the damage drop-off?
And stating that the Simeon is more accurate than the S&W while aiming down sights just shows that you’re talking out of your ass, because all weapons are perfectly accurate and have no CoF bloom while ironsighted.
[quote=“affableTricycle;51566”]I’m not regarding weapons solely by their damage, DPS and magazine size. I’m regarding them by the statistics that I have access to which are relevant when comparing these weapons. If there was a difference in rate of fire I would compare those too, but there is no difference in rate of fire, so that statistic is irrelevant.
If your information isn’t available online, where did you get it? Did you do extensive testing with some friends to calculate the damage drop-off?
And stating that the Simeon is more accurate than the S&W while aiming down sights just shows that you’re talking out of your ass, because all weapons are perfectly accurate and have no CoF bloom while ironsighted.[/quote]
I’ll go ahead and explain, but you really ought to keep your rash conclusions to yourself, before making yourself look as embarassingly ignorant as you have with that last remark.
CoF bloom isn’t the only behavior weapons exhibit. When IS’ing, weapons will recoil, moving the camera and the point of aim and subsequently the point of impact of the weapon. The S&W has more recoil than the Sim. When you rapid fire the S&W, it has more tendency to ‘walk’ away from the target than the Sim.
Further, particularly specific first-hand information I haven’t seen written anywhere but know from testing it myself (no need for testing with friends, I did it live): When rapid firing the Sim, in either case, the Sim will recoil up and continue to fire/impact in relatively the same place, meaning the player can pull the cursor back down while barraging those few 6 shots and generally land them where they’re pointed at. The S&W will have more distinct punch, shifting around moderately more in the raised recoil phase, forcing the player to slow the timing between their shots.
It’s often linked in this forum, but I found this spreadsheet by googling “Dirty Bomb Weapons” the first week I started playing:
Use the tab at the bottom to view the ingame stats. Accuracy is left to the user to determine, and all information is tentative of course.
Further, there absolutely is a noticeable difference in the fire rate of the pistols.
“Oversampling”, or clicking the mouse faster than the allowed rate (of fire), causes only one shot to be fired for two clicks. It isn’t easy by any means, but I absolutely guarantee you I’ve oversampled while firing the revolvers ingame, and it’s something discussed/observed to great lengths with similarly stat’ed and functioning pistols/weapons in Counterstrike.
[quote=“raspberryBlender;51587”][quote=“affableTricycle;51566”]I’m not regarding weapons solely by their damage, DPS and magazine size. I’m regarding them by the statistics that I have access to which are relevant when comparing these weapons. If there was a difference in rate of fire I would compare those too, but there is no difference in rate of fire, so that statistic is irrelevant.
If your information isn’t available online, where did you get it? Did you do extensive testing with some friends to calculate the damage drop-off?
And stating that the Simeon is more accurate than the S&W while aiming down sights just shows that you’re talking out of your ass, because all weapons are perfectly accurate and have no CoF bloom while ironsighted.[/quote]
I’ll go ahead and explain, but you really ought to keep your rash conclusions to yourself, before making yourself look as embarassingly ignorant as you have with that last remark.[/quote]
Nice. Unnecessarily being a dick. Didn’t you watch the tutorial video? Also “Play the game more earlier.” How about you just use facts instead of being a passive aggressive douche canoe?
Recoil =/= accuracy. Spread can’t be compensated for, recoil can. Very easily in fact. It’s not like we’re talking about the AK in CS, guns in DB have almost no recoil even when ADS.
We are specifically talking about the M9 vs the Selbstadt, and the Simeon vs the S&W. The M9 has the same RoF as the Selbstadt and the Simeon has the same RoF as the S&W.
FFS, I know what oversampling is. Don’t assume everyone who disagrees with you is just getting into FPS games and has no idea how guns work.
I was only assuming you had no idea how FPS worked because you’ve been acting like it.
And take the time to learn what passive aggressive actually means instead of being just another flake who repeats buzz words he’s picked up from his peers.