Proxy

(SteelMailbox) #1

Oh Proxy the ol British engineer. We all love her right?
[spoiler]I don’t[/spoiler]
We have been hearing outcries about shotguns and Proxy for ages and that’s good, I feel like she should have a place in comp scene but at her state right now I feel like she is completely broken.
Not only her mines keep getting buffed, her shotguns also. She is a 90HP merc yet I find her harder to kill than a Fragger, something is not right.
I currently feel like the shotguns are in an OP state and should be nerfed, all of them, 1 shots and insta gibbs are ridicules with weapons that sadly don’t take that much skill to use. Do not buff Remburg and Hollunds to be at Anhuld level since it just puts Proxy in an even more broken state.
I thought about a few solutions that can fix the issue:

  • Buffing bomb squad and giving it to all mercs
  • Up the visibility of mines without bomb squad
  • Nerf shotguns
  • Lower mine count to 1 (from 2)
  • Nerf Hochfir (Honestly I feel like the Hochfir is in a good spot and shouldn’t be touched)
  • Nerf machine pistols (I actually feel like machine pistols are just secondary SMG’s with more mobility)
  • Remove Proxy (Its just a prank relax)
  • Nerf range of mines

Whatever you do I really want to see a nerf to Proxy in the next update.

(Jostabeere) #2

-Nerf the spread of shotguns while sprinting/jumping.
-Give her a place-down timer of 1.5 secs to negate the kamikazi toss-in-the-face-bullshit.
-Cut the cooldown if mines are placed somewhere. This should apply to turret and stickies and stations aswell.

(MilkyBear) #3

She is fine to me :expressionless:

(watsyurdeal) #4

Revert the change to the mines where the trigger distance was increased, I’ve had mines go off when I was behind a wall.

(pumpkinmeerkat) #5

I would prefer to see the ROF or effective range of the two CQB shotguns reduced rather than an accuracy nerf. Shotguns should have a place in close quarters but could be even less effective at range than they currently are IMO.

Overall I think that Proxy is in an okay place balance wise. She likely isn’t as useful at the highest level of play due to her low HP and lack of range. Perhaps the mine damage to objectives could be buffed to make her more useful in certain attacking situations. I think the semi recent trigger distance change should be reverted but the default visibility should also be reduced. The current audio cue is more than enough to make players aware there is a mine nearby. Making them harder to spot would encourage smarter placement. I don’t think the mine placing animation should be lengthened since there is already a significant delay for activation.

Maybe a small reduction to the vertical triggering range and/or vertical blast radius could help make mines slightly more avoidable with last second (MLG pro) wall jumps.

(Apofenas) #6

So you practicly want to nerf Proxy to floor?

No, i disagree.

Don’t want to die to mines? - check your corner before you run near it. Seriously. Without mines Proxy is just weakest engineer incapable to compite with Fletcher and Bushwhacker. Her mines instead need to be less noticable without bomb squad and create less sounds without guardian angel.

Shotguns… is it only Proxy? I never heared complains like “That Rhino jumped from a corner and insta killed me with Remburg! OP! NERF!” -© any merc with <90 HP. Shotguns don’t need damage nerf. Although they could use effective range nerf.

Nerf machine pistols? Sparks will thank you with her 2 secondary weapons. So as Vassili. So as Fletcha with his shotgun and machine pistol. This actually looks more like Fletcher nerf.

(SteelMailbox) #7

[quote=“Apofenas;137605”]So you practicly want to nerf Proxy to floor?

No, i disagree.
[/quote]
No. I want her to get a nerf that doesn’t make her bad like Phantom but doesn’t allow her to be at the broken state she is at currently

Don’t want to die to mines? - check your corner before you run near it. Seriously. Without mines Proxy is just weakest engineer incapable to compite with Fletcher and Bushwhacker. Her mines instead need to be less noticable without bomb squad and create less sounds without guardian angel.

Being under the constant pressure of checking corners is a bad thing. Believe me, I thought against 4 Proxies. It isn’t fun nor helps the team to walk around and check corners everytime you want to enter a room. Plus I see a lot of mines in random spots. Sound is meant to help with that but I ain’t sure if it’s a bug or something but it doesn’t happen about 60% of the time for me. Guardian angle doesn’t help with mines and nerfing bomb squad will put it under the rug since that is the only reason you will use it.

Shotguns… is it only Proxy? I never heared complains like “That Rhino jumped from a corner and insta killed me with Remburg! OP! NERF!” -© any merc with <90 HP. Shotguns don’t need damage nerf. Although they could use effective range nerf.

No, it isn’t only Proxy. The shotgun problem is bigger which is why I separated it from other nerfs cause shotguns need to be nerfed anyway.

Nerf machine pistols? Sparks will thank you with her 2 secondary weapons. So as Vassili. So as Fletcha with his shotgun and machine pistol. This actually looks more like Fletcher nerf.

It is a suggestion but that was the more extreme one. I honestly myself feel that maybe, just maybe, each merc will have a different stat to the same weapon but that is a thing for a whole other day.

(Dawnlazy) #8

Mines were clearly in need of some buffs before, I think they are good right now - I don’t think you should be able to longjump away after you jumped on a mine, you made a mistake and got punished for it, unless of course if you have Untrackable. Shotguns are just weird right now, I think less damage but more range like the Ahnuhld would be the way to go to make them more viable without being so crazy from up close.

(WaffleMonster) #9

Proxy is still one of the most Underpowered mercs in the game, far weaker than bushwhacker and fletcher. Nerfing her would be stupid.

(Sorotia) #10

Then why soon after the mine buffs do I commonly see at least 2 proxy on a opposing team? Why do I see her as much if not more than Fletcher, especially since he is on rotation? Why do I see less and less of Bushwacker?

I seriously almost never see Bushwacker anymore…why play him? Turret is easy to kill and unless you make a mistake it wont kill you…turret is a big target and mines aren’t…sticky bombs are mobile. Several other merc options to use the Kek with…so why play Bush?

Surviving a Turret is a lot easier than surviving a mine or a decently placed sticky…this game is becoming explosives online :stuck_out_tongue:

(WaffleMonster) #11

Then why soon after the mine buffs do I commonly see at least 2 proxy on a opposing team? Why do I see her as much if not more than Fletcher, especially since he is on rotation? Why do I see less and less of Bushwacker?

I seriously almost never see Bushwacker anymore…why play him? Turret is easy to kill and unless you make a mistake it wont kill you…turret is a big target and mines aren’t…sticky bombs are mobile. Several other merc options to use the Kek with…so why play Bush?

Surviving a Turret is a lot easier than surviving a mine or a decently placed sticky…this game is becoming explosives online :stuck_out_tongue:

[/quote]

Even before the buffs she was played alot purely because she’s a fun merc to play. Mines are very easy to avoid if you listen out for them and they have huge glowing rings around them. Against good players, they are very weak.

I seriously almost never see Bushwacker anymore…why play him? Turret is easy to kill and unless you make a mistake it wont kill you…turret is a big target and mines aren’t…sticky bombs are mobile. Several other merc options to use the Kek with…so why play Bush?

[/quote]

Bushwhacker is the only viable merc at a competitive level with the kek. People in public play what they enjoy playing and not whats actually good hence why bushwhacker doesn’t get much love in pubs.If you place a turret so that it always shoots at the backs of opponents, it will do considerable damage and force the enemy to shoot back putting them in a bad situation.

(Sorotia) #12

Then why soon after the mine buffs do I commonly see at least 2 proxy on a opposing team? Why do I see her as much if not more than Fletcher, especially since he is on rotation? Why do I see less and less of Bushwacker?

I seriously almost never see Bushwacker anymore…why play him? Turret is easy to kill and unless you make a mistake it wont kill you…turret is a big target and mines aren’t…sticky bombs are mobile. Several other merc options to use the Kek with…so why play Bush?

Surviving a Turret is a lot easier than surviving a mine or a decently placed sticky…this game is becoming explosives online :stuck_out_tongue:

[/quote]

Even before the buffs she was played alot purely because she’s a fun merc to play. Mines are very easy to avoid if you listen out for them and they have huge glowing rings around them. Against good players, they are very weak.

I seriously almost never see Bushwacker anymore…why play him? Turret is easy to kill and unless you make a mistake it wont kill you…turret is a big target and mines aren’t…sticky bombs are mobile. Several other merc options to use the Kek with…so why play Bush?

[/quote]

Bushwhacker is the only viable merc at a competitive level with the kek. People in public play what they enjoy playing and not whats actually good hence why bushwhacker doesn’t get much love in pubs.If you place a turret so that it always shoots at the backs of opponents, it will do considerable damage and force the enemy to shoot back putting them in a bad situation. [/quote]

I never saw her much, I know I never had to check every single corner for mines except maybe when she was on rotation…but low and behold…her mines get buffed and she is all over the place.

Like @steelMailbox said, sound doesn’t always work…I know especially for me since I don’t play with the sound very high.

The way I see it…if the mine can detect my footsteps from so far away…I don’t see why my bullet striking the ground near by doesn’t set it off? I mean the shear force of a bullet or bullets crashing down near by should be enough to set off such a sensitive trigger.

My problem isn’t tripping over mines except when I play quick and stupid…but when I can’t get close enough to a mine to shoot it without it taking half my health from a distance…which means I either go in half health and risk getting 1 shot by even a body shot from a shotgun or I avoid the area till I get get healed or there is another mine put up before I regen my health.

They have almost no disadvantages now unless they’re poorly placed…big detection radius, big detonation radius, and even more perfect for suicide bombing than even Nader.

(Apofenas) #13

Proxy is an attribute of pubs; Bushwhackers- competitive. You see if you have 3 out of 5 players Proxy it means you have 3 low HP mercs, most likely with shotguns. It means enemy Nader and Fletcher are soon to hit top kills. Just check your corner and will be fine.

In pubs there are more players so it’s harder to notice mines just because you get distracted more often. This week i’ve been playing with one 51 lvl guy. He was exploding my mines with dozens, but triggered like 5-6. And that’s because i’ve hidden mines behind his ammo stations and on my ally bodies.

Even in pubs the outcome you get from 2+ Proxies in team is questionable. Just compare her mines with arty strikes. Same max count. Same reload. Arty strike will surely finish you, far harder to notice, can be called from far away, can disable EV. He is on free rotation now. If you are annoyed by weak Proxy with shotgun and her mines…be sure 120hp Arty with burst rifle will make you cry.

(streetwiseSailboat) #14

Nerfing the machine pistols will hurt Fletcher, Sparks and Vassili so I don’t think that would be good.

The shotguns are weird, but that’s not a Proxy only problem.

Bomb Squad is better now than ever, I don’t think it needs a buff just to counter her mines.

Lowering her mine count will allow her less area denial and incentivise her to use them as impromptu grenades. I’d rather that not happen.

I don’t think the visibility should be increased. Her mines were super obvious because they glowed really brightly and also chirped. People wanted her mines to be less visible and they got what they wanted.

Decreasing the radius sounds like a good idea, though.

(Jostabeere) #15

[quote=“Apofenas;137605”]So you practicly want to nerf Proxy to floor?

No, i disagree.

Don’t want to die to mines? - check your corner before you run near it. Seriously. Without mines Proxy is just weakest engineer incapable to compite with Fletcher and Bushwhacker. Her mines instead need to be less noticable without bomb squad and create less sounds without guardian angel.

Shotguns… is it only Proxy? I never heared complains like “That Rhino jumped from a corner and insta killed me with Remburg! OP! NERF!” -© any merc with <90 HP. Shotguns don’t need damage nerf. Although they could use effective range nerf.

Nerf machine pistols? Sparks will thank you with her 2 secondary weapons. So as Vassili. So as Fletcha with his shotgun and machine pistol. This actually looks more like Fletcher nerf.[/quote]

“Wait, let me check every corner in a fast-paced game as DB” Yeah, no, sorry. Strike 1.

Rhino doesn’t have such speed so he can jump into your face before you even react. Strike 2.

Machine pistols chew through healthbars. They can easiyl be used as Primaries in CQC/MRC. Strike 3, you’re out.

(Apofenas) #16

You don’t need to check every corner on map. You need to check corner you about to run in once you enter enemy territory. There is a number of places Proxy drop mines all the time. If you get killed there, it’s your fault. If you got killed by mine in unexpected place - it’s Proxy achievement like if other merc kills someone with his ability; if you got killed on that place 2, 3, 4, times - it’s your fault that you don’t learn on your own mistakes.

So you can jump from the corner with burst rifle/REVIVR/grenade launcher/katana, make head shot/stab at back and insta kill enemy before he reacts and that’s legit, but shotgun to the face must not insta kill people? Yes it requires better aim for those burst rifle/reviver/grenade launcher, but they are also used in other areas, while close combat is only shotgun usage. Logic?

What % kills does Rhino get with shotguns? If they are so awesome, than Rhino should be switching between minigun and shotgun like Sparks between REVIVR and machine pistol.

How many people prefer shotgun load outs for Fletcher and Aura over Blishlock? Yes i see people use them, but mainly it’s Blishlock that is used.
If i’m not mistaken Bushwhacker is best engineer* merc for competitive because of KEK, right? Where is Fletcher with his so awesome instakill shotgun and Machine pistols that “can easiyl be used as Primaries”?

(SaulWolfden) #17

One went what felt like half a mile away from me on a pylon side I wasn’t even on nor close to where the mine was.

(Ritobasu) #18

People are complaining about Proxy now? Thank god, it means she’s finally relevant in the Engineer meta dominated by Fletchers and Bushwhackers

She’s not OP by any means and is still one of the squishiest mercs in the game, it’s about time someone can use her to terrorize entire pub games and be a viable pick in comp

(solace_) #19

I would honestly say proxy is good right now, I enjoy playing her and I also have no issues dealing with her. As for the kamakazi strategy, it can be effective, but only in certain situations, and anyways, I think it is a legitimate strategy.

The same could be said about fletcher, his mines are stated as being good for setting traps, but hardly anyone does that. In fact the play style is almost completely different.

Just my thoughts.

(MTLMortis) #20

Yeah I feel the same way about stop signs while driving.

WTH kinda dumb is that statement?!?