Please stop putting explosive classes on free rotation

(neverplayseriou) #21

@Icecoal fragger isn’t a spam merc, the only annoying thing about lots of fraggers is their hp and dmg, most new people won’t make a big impact with a nade.

(watsyurdeal) #22

I honestly don’t care, I just wish people would start doing their jobs.

If you’re a medic, revive, if you’re an engi, plant, leave the DM to Fire Support, Assault, and Recon.

(Runeforce) #23

So if the explosive spam is so terrible, how come I still get on pub games with four Vasilli’s, none of them managing to get a single spot during a 15 minute match?

(Sorotia) #24

Naders have been annoying…but when are they not? Personally I’ve found more turret spam than grenade spam recently[quote=“gg2ez;154397”]If I had my way I’d say get rid of free-rotation all together. It’s a goddamned horrible way to let people try mercs they don’t own.

I’d even go one step further and say remove the merc paywall as well and change the business model into character and weapon dkins. Maybe even do something similar to TF2 ($$) and put premium skins and special effects in cases so people can gamble their money away to SD.

I’d be happy, $D would be very happy.[/quote]

I’ve never played TF2…special effects? Do you mean visual or proc boosts? Sounds kinda P2W to me if it’s the latter…

(Ballto) #25

[quote=“TheRyderShotgun;154473”]snip
[/quote]

It’s not just annoying for veteran players, it’s annoying (or at the least detrimental) to new players as well.

If a veteran player logs into a server and the other team has four naders, their reaction is usually “Jesus christ this is annoying”

If a new player comes in they will think “Holy shit this is super unfun. Al of these undodgeable grenades and exploding bodies is bullshit. Bad spammy game.”

If they dont RQ because spam, theyre still not enjoying themselves much unless theyre part of a small minority of people who arent ragey salty entitled asshats. At least it seems like a minority these days.

Or they log onto a team with four naders.

Veteran players are salty because they probably have to carry a team with a terrible team composition, probably no medic or fire support either, and a non diverse class selection making it an easy stomp on your team. Most new players dont know when to change their fucking class to help the team, and thats a problem they can only solve by actually getting better and learning how best to help your team. Simply put, playing support in any game is the absolute best way to do this. Even if you are an FPS veteran, every game has different mechanics, be it in movement, shooting, the objectives, or whatever. Most players wont be great at killing or doing the objective in any game, but playing support, say a medic, they can still help their team a lot while they are learning since everyone needs a medic, or ammo, or whatever.

but the free rotation doesnt help because it encourages you to play these classes that usually arent support based, like nader, a class where you need map knowledge and good aim to make full use of her abilities and kill-eyness, which the vast majority (98% id say) of new players just dont have.

There are a lot of other ways to go about a trial period for a merc without a free rotation. You could just have free trials on a week long CD that lasts for a few hours of in game time, like credit boosters, you could make it rent-a-merc, you could randomize who gets what mercs free, but this system clearly is just really annoying at best or downright detrimental at worst

(Ballto) #26

[quote=“Sorotia;154528”]Naders have been annoying…but when are they not? Personally I’ve found more turret spam than grenade spam recently[quote=“gg2ez;154397”]If I had my way I’d say get rid of free-rotation all together. It’s a goddamned horrible way to let people try mercs they don’t own.

I’d even go one step further and say remove the merc paywall as well and change the business model into character and weapon dkins. Maybe even do something similar to TF2 ($$) and put premium skins and special effects in cases so people can gamble their money away to SD.

I’d be happy, $D would be very happy.[/quote]

I’ve never played TF2…special effects? Do you mean visual or proc boosts? Sounds kinda P2W to me if it’s the latter…[/quote]

basically, there were a lot of hats, Some hats had the prefix unusual. For example, Unusual Fez

these unusual hats had special glowing effects on them, be it small orbiting planets around your head, the hats on fire, etc.

There actually was and probably still is a hat worth 2500 USD in real money because there were only about four in circulation

(Ballto) #27

i can counter the naders just fine, and ive been playing thunder phoenix and stoker (i already own him and only when we dont already have four) mostly this rotation. Its not fun gameplay when an entire team is one merc, be it nader, stoker, bushwhaker or whatever else because it usually ends up a stomp on your end and annoying the stompers with nade spam.

the problem is not with the class itself, its with the number of said class

(Derpfestor) #28

Randomized rotation will have more variety per match, reducing the chances of an entire team being entirely the same merc.

(MTLMortis) #29

[quote=“ZeroFactor;154383”]2 words; Pineapple Juggler

(heheheh) [/quote]

I h8 you just a little bit right now.

As to the OP, I have never come across this situation except once when every person on the Chapel defense were Skyhammer/Arty’s and the EV was under a constant bombardment cloud. Was cute.

(Jesus) #30

[quote=“Kouken;154310”]Wouldnt be a problem if free rotations were individual instead of global

Or if just all mercs were free and SD focused on skins to make money instead of an awful RNG system no one wants to support[/quote]

Im fine with the actual system of RNG for loadout after i bought all the merc getting good looking and good playing cards are my only motivation to play the game, if they make people pay for them ill have nothing to do anymore and ill just stop playing since ill have no objective to complete for myself

(Monty) #31

Oh, Nader is on free rotation? I do not actually mind. I got some 662 hours clocked to this game according to Steam. Does that make me a veteran player? Probably compared to some, probably not compared to some others. But the point is, I do not really mind when Naders are on free rotation, and the same holds true for the other explosive classes from Proxy to Fragger.

Nader on Rotation:

  • Most newbie Naders keep on using their grenade launcher instead of switching to their primary or secondary. Hence if you can get close and personal with a Nader, they will keep spamming grenades, which makes them a very easy target for your primary weapon. A fast running mercenary makes the approach very easy, even with the risk of one hit death from a grenade. They also have tendency to spam all five grenades, which means that you can just wait out for them to run out before dashing at them. Not to forget that Naders tend to wander off to hunt for frags, which makes sneaking to the objectives very, very easy.

Proxy on Rotation:

  • A fast running mercenary that lays explosive eggs, armed with a one hit kill shotgun? Why, it almost sounds unfair, if their explosives eggs wouldn’t blow up right in their own face. If their 90~ hit points wouldn’t make them one hit kills for a Nader. Or lets face it, with Thunder’s massive clip size, you can just pretty much mow several Proxies down before you even need to reload. And don’t forget to long jump every time you go past a corner. (C + Space Bar.)

Fletcher on Rotation:

  • The combination of two primary weapons and sticky grenades makes them very good and flexible offensively, which will show up in anyone’s fundamentally useless K/D ratio. But on the other hand: rotation Fletchers ignore objectives, heck even determined Fletcher players ignore objectives. So a team filled with Fletchers does not automatically mean that team is going to win. And we should not forget that even with that awesome SMG and stickies, Fletchers are flawed over a distance. So just pick up the stock Skyhammer and shoot them down from afar. Or how about giving that Stoker a chance, throw a molotov slightly past a corner and you get some dead Fletchers trying to sticky or shotgun people. (Nader’s or Fragger’s grenade spam works too.) The flaw of the Fletcher is their limitations with range and their inability to damage beyond corners. (Even when we consider stickies left as traps.)

Fragger on Rotation:

  • The fact is, if a Fragger and a Skyhammer with similar enough tracking and aiming skills face off, the Fragger will come out on top due to their larger hit point amount. But unlikely Skyhammers, Fraggers have a tendency to run out of bullets. Which means that even decent Fraggers spent half of the match heading to the nearest ammo station. Not to mention how newbie Fraggers suck at cooking grenades, and that is not to forget how Fraggers tend to throw their grenades in the exact same spots. In other words, peeking behind corners to throw a grenade. Hence, all you have to do is keep a bit of distance, and just pepper them with bullets when they try to peek-a-boo.

These explosive mercenaries are not really a problem.

(AnimeDude) #32

How about no free rotations at all, just give them a demo for each merc, their choice of a 30k credit merc for free, and be done with it.

(Floross) #33

Make friendly fire on for every server

(MTLMortis) #34

A thousand times this.

Nader starts lobbing grenades you rush them. Unless they’re good at shotgunning grenades, they are toast.

(N8o) #35

Eliminating explosive characters from free rotation takes away a good chunk of the playable mercs.

Nader, Fletcher, Fragger, Arty, Skyhammer (though everyone has him).

You can’t just take away chances for people to play those mercs. A solution would to introduce a personal system where everyone has different free rotation mercs, but that could bring another lot of issues along with it.

(GildedDark) #36

I wouldn’t mind seeing SOME servers that block rotation mercs unless they are owned
That would allow people to avoid a lot of the spam

(sgtCrookyGrin) #37

I think just making RNG rotation (personal) is easy and simple enough for everyone.

(gg2ez) #38

[quote=“Sorotia;154528”]Naders have been annoying…but when are they not? Personally I’ve found more turret spam than grenade spam recently[quote=“gg2ez;154397”]If I had my way I’d say get rid of free-rotation all together. It’s a goddamned horrible way to let people try mercs they don’t own.

I’d even go one step further and say remove the merc paywall as well and change the business model into character and weapon dkins. Maybe even do something similar to TF2 ($$) and put premium skins and special effects in cases so people can gamble their money away to SD.

I’d be happy, $D would be very happy.[/quote]

I’ve never played TF2…special effects? Do you mean visual or proc boosts? Sounds kinda P2W to me if it’s the latter…[/quote]

@Sorotia visual.

(Cletus_VanDamme) #39

The current free rotation is one of the best aspects of this game IMO.

Allowing people to try before they buy, perhaps using a free merc during a rotation then falling in love with said merc and therefore purchasing said merc is not just brilliant business practice, but also a fair way to ensure that new players aren’t stuck with the same merc for quite some time.

Yes, they’re given a credit bonus, but how many people spend that on cases or a merc that isn’t suited to their playstyle?

Changing the current system is an insane thought, and honestly if you’ve been playing this game for a while you know how to avoid the spammy areas, and the fact that people who aren’t used to playing a merc they don’t own, such as Nader, will not play her incorrectly, leading to an easy opponent to best, so not really an issue IMO.

An actual example of the rotation working, my younger brother, who I introduced to this game, was not having the best experience. His aim wasn’t good enough with the M4 to be consistent, yet using the squishier characters, such as Aura and Proxy (who he bought with the initial 10k bonuses you used to get) he felt he died too quickly.

I suggest Bushwacker and his Kek10, Turret and Engineer abilities.

3 games later, he’s dominating getting 30+ kills, and still to this day uses Bushwacker as his main merc.

A great system.

(TheVulpesFox) #40

[quote=“N8o;154755”]Eliminating explosive characters from free rotation takes away a good chunk of the playable mercs.

Nader, Fletcher, Fragger, Arty, Skyhammer (though everyone has him).

You can’t just take away chances for people to play those mercs. A solution would to introduce a personal system where everyone has different free rotation mercs, but that could bring another lot of issues along with it.[/quote]

Don’t forget kira has an AOE damage effect.
I like the idea of personal merc rotations/ 3 rotations in circulation and the player base divided into 3 groups and each group is assigned one of the merc rotations.