Phantom, rebuilt from scratch.

(watsyurdeal) #1

So after watching this video, I feel like I don’t need to write an essay on what the current state of Phantom is, and can instead just reference to that video, so, before you read any further, go watch it then come back.

Ok, done? Good, so let’s get to it.

First of all, let’s talk about what Phantom can do…has 110 health, has smgs, is tanky while cloaked, and has the Katana…which is already confirmed that other mercs will be able to get at some point…so what does he do that is unique?

Why should we use Phantom over any other Merc?

Welp, short answer, you shouldn’t, long answer, with all the classes that have 110 hp and the same guns, you could pick something that is way more useful to the team as a whole.

So, what can be done to fix him? Well, give for one, let’s take a look at cloak.

The first problem is obvious, it allows him to tank damage, meaning while cloaked he can use that armor to close in and kill you with his melee. Which is pretty unfun to deal with. The second problem is, that because it’s so powerful, they feel the need to make him visible, which is completely pointless for cloak. The ENTIRE idea behind cloak is to allow you to get behind the enemy from the FRONTLINE. You shouldn’t have to flank with cloak for it to be useful…you can flank with any class. Cloak should make you completely invisible, so if the enemy has all the sightlines you can still get someone behind them to do a specific pick or objective.

So the obvious first change, is this.

  • Cloak now grants 100% invisibility, and drains based on movement, the faster you move, the faster it drains.
  • Cloak still drains on hit, and damage will still bleed through cloak
  • Cloak takes 0.5 seconds to activate and deactivate
  • You can NOT attack while cloaked, you must be uncloaked to interact with objectives, revive allies, or attack enemies.

So we fix two problems, making the cloak actually good at it’s job, and making it so players actually have a chance of spotting Phantom before he makes an attack.

The second thing is a support ability, while cloak is a good thing to have, it’s not exactly for helping team mates so much as it is getting you within your effective range. So, Phantom needs some kind of utility that can aid his team mates. And we have quite a couple of options here.

  • An emp of some kind, which works and behaves just like the Motion Sensor, but instead disables any deployables in it’s range, and reveals them to his allies.
  • A spotting ability that can be used while cloaked, turning Phantom into a human UAV.

And finally, one more thing, something to make Phantom more useful in competitive play, where you won’t really see classes that have less than 90 HP…oh, I know. A damage bonus for sneak attacks, or attacks from behind.

  • Backstabs grant a 20% damage bonus, this stacks with chopper. So lunges will deal 122 damage from behind, killing everyone but a Fragger from behind. Backstabs are any attacks that are from behind, within a 135 degree angle, so side attacks will not count.

All these changes added, I think Phantom will be in a good place in both pubs, and competitive play. He will be viable, and still have good counter play as he’s not some barely visible wall that’ll slice you to chunks.

(Amerika) #2

I’m actually on-board with these changes as long as you can’t attack, at all, while cloaked and there is an uncloak time/sound so you can react. That would ensure you have to be intelligent of when/where to use it. I also don’t want him to be melee focused but simply just be a bit better at melee. And despite the intelligence you need now to use/abuse the shield which makes him interesting I could live without it and wasn’t a fan of it ever since I watched the role-call trailer for the first time (my first words to people on VOIP was how that was going to be abused all to hell).

And as far as the video and what PixelTwitch had to say that’s pretty much what I said on day one. He has no place in competitive play because you’d be missing out on too much utility using him over other established classes. And compound that with him being cheap even in the hands of a lower skilled player at launch. But even after nerfs he hasn’t changed much for the higher skilled players who know how to use him. Still doesn’t mean he fits in to competitive play but he hasn’t changed much.

I am still a big fan of giving him the ability to spot. I like the EMP idea too. The EMP might be a bit too much of a hard counter for Aura though. Either of those would give him more utility and make him a much more solid option in competitive. Same with the 100% cloak as long as it wasn’t also going to allow him to get non-stop unavoidable and cheap kills. Get position, yes. Get cheap 1 hit kills? No way.

(watsyurdeal) #3

No it’d basically be the Spy from TF2, the cloak is a positioning tool, you use to get where you need to be, then deactivate it when you want to make your move.

I liked the way it worked in TF2, it’s just a shame they added so much unnecessary crap to the game that made Spy not worth it in the long term.

(Amerika) #4

I hated how the spy worked in TF2 when I played and it’s one of the reasons I stopped playing that game early on. One hit kills that didn’t require some aim will never be good in my book. The game has probably changed a lot since I played but the spy at launch was something bad players played as who simply wanted to get cheap kills without needing to aim in an FPS game. Combine that with a ton of spam and RNG hits and you got a game that I just can’t respect.

Granted, my opinion is colored by the time which I played which was long ago and the game might have changed since then but Phantom was basically a repeat of this at launch except a lot more capable in the right hands (both melee and shooting).

(watsyurdeal) #5

Well in TF2, the Spy could be used well in the right hands, and he was pretty easy to counter after a while since people caught on to how he works.

And though he has a Revolver, it’s not enough to really defend yourself in a gunfight, kinda like how Phantom was when he had just a pistol.

With the SMG and the cloak, and the Melee only being barely powerful enough to one hit ko mercs in certain circumstances. Phantom can be a very adaptable and powerful merc, able to be used in a lot of scenarios, even if it’s only briefly. I can see him being a trump card people play maybe 3-4 times in a game to turn things around, while in pubs just being your run of the mill stealth character.

(Eox) #6

Backstabs should be a new gameplay mechanic introduced for all mercs IMO, not only to Phantom. This will add even more skill ceiling to melee weapons. However, if this is introduced, I think it would be wise to tune down all melee attacks slightly, while giving a higher damage bonus to backstabs (maybe something like +50% ?).

I clearly don’t agree totally with your rework though. I think it’s a bit sad to restrain that much your actions while invisible. I oftenly suggested the possibility to revive an ally while cloaked : I am surprised that it didn’t got more support. I’m more for a more free invisibility, but of course it would need its limits in order to be balanced.

The idea of a second ability is still nice.

(watsyurdeal) #7

The thing about invisibility is that you have to choose, do you want perfect invisibility? Then we can not allow actions while cloaked since it leads to frustrating deaths for the victims, do you wanna be able to attack while cloaked? Then you have to be visible somewhat, which makes it entirely useless.

So I’m opting for the version that makes the most sense given what Phantom is, a close range class with a clear emphasis on being the best ambush merc in the game.

(MarsRover) #8

I’d like that Phantom would actually take more damage while cloaked. Don’t want to pull any % numbers out of my butt.

I just want to make the cloaking a decision that has to be weighted every time, and also make sure that if you see a cloaked Phantom charging towards you, you should be able to take him down even as Sparks with body shots with a machine pistol. Cloak for positioning, not for tanking. I agree with Amerika that one-hit unavoidable melee kills are not a good thing.

(JC916) #9

I think frontal stabs from the katana should have a damage reduction, so it encourages players to be smart about their engagements.

(Freelancer) #10

@Watsyurdeal

Ive readed your suggestion and come to the conclusion, that is way to OverPowered.

You talking about strategy, tactics and opportunity.
Sounds really good to me, but…

The average player picks usually a merc, that has the best chances of killing everyone without being killed.

For example:
Phantom (with your suggestions) covers behind an object and wait for the first player passing —> SLAM! Player dead.
Phantom gets again behind a cover and wait for a player —> Player passing throw… SLAM! Player dead.
Phantom switches position, because he is a “pro” and know, that they will looking for him. Player passing through, finds no Phantom, because he changed Position and SLAM! Player dead again.

I hope you know what i mean with that :slight_smile:

The idea is good, but not for this game and players.

EDIT:
For my example the Phantom cloaked and uncloaked himself everytime.

(watsyurdeal) #11

You could say the same thing about Vasilli though, he always has the first shot due to the range he can fight at.

(Demolama) #12

Recon mercs in general do not add much to either causal or comp play. The entire recon merc class is in desperate need of more to do in this game, especially when it comes to helping the team in this team-based game. Spotting enemies is just a gimmick and worthless because of fast respawn times and because a good team using voice coms works just as effectively as a heartbeat sensor. And let’s be honest if Vasilli did not have his powerful MoA he would not be played in comps, period. The powerful rifle is the only thing that makes this particular merc( the only recon merc) useful in this game outside pubs.

So my question is why did they take out the hacking device? This would have been a great way to add a teamplay aspect to the recon class by incorporating some type of hackable-only doorways into the maps. These hackable doors could be used open different routes to the objective for team that would otherwise remained closed off.

W:ET had something similar for its covertops class (the predecessor of the recon mercs). However, the weakness of this door openning role in W:ET was that in order for the covert ops to open the door he had to steal the enemy’s clothes, which was worthless in comps as teams on voice coms already knew he stole one of their uniforms and were ready to intercept the door opening. But in DB, without needing clothes, hacking could be performed without the knowledge of the other team. This new role would open up some of the chokepoints in many of the maps, and more importantly it would at least give the phantom something to do to help the team achieve victory.

(Amerika) #13

You are definitely underplaying the value of the HBS in match play. You have no idea how many grenades myself and every other Fragger have hit entirely due to the HBS. Same for flanks as you can tell which way people are facing based on motion. I do agree that the HBS isn’t what makes people use Vassili in high end match play but it’s definitely not a gimmick when used correctly.

The hacking device would be interesting but it would have to work like revives and plants/defuses in that everyone would need to be capable of it. They have to design the game around players potentially not having a merc that are playing and if you make something that can only be breached by a hacking tool it could severely change the flow of the game. And it would also be way too similar to what engineers already do as it would be the same mechanic.

I’m not against it…I just think I understand why it wasn’t put into the game due to current map flow design and similarities with other abilities.

(facileKennel) #14

I really like this chances, i hope nexon takes note.