Open Thread: How do you believe we can increase the Dirty Bomb player base?


(KayDubz) #1

So I’ve said in a number of threads that the game does not feel like its growing. So I’d like to see how people feel we can get a lot more players in the game.

Btw, let me amend my earlier stats given in other thread. I incorrectly stated DB averaged over 5k players for a month. I misread the stats. What DB did was reach a peak over 5k concurrent players during a stretch of days…which it hadn’t done in 16 months. So that’s at least a decent sign of new players and veterans returning to the game when big updates release.

Anyways, below are all the monthly averages. How do you feel we can make this number increase even more? I’d really like to see the game grow greatly. What I think we need is more new maps, possibly different game modes (like capture the flag) and definitely rented servers. I believe rented servers need to come first, as that will be the big thing to attract players.

August 2017
2,630.6
July 2017
2,440.3
June 2017
2,099.8
May 2017
2,100.0
April 2017
2,109.0
March 2017
2,105.2
February 2017
1,883.2
January 2017
2,009.2

December 2016
1,909.2
November 2016
1,430.5
October 2016
1,499.6
September 2016
1,688.4
August 2016
1,899.8
July 2016
2,190.8
June 2016
2,446.6
May 2016
2,803.7
April 2016
3,134.0
March 2016
2,663.8
February 2016
2,559.4
January 2016
2,606.1

December 2015
2,794.6
November 2015
3,131.2
October 2015
2,561.1
September 2015
2,819.7
August 2015
4,088.9
July 2015
7,101.7
June 2015
6,376.1
February 2015
7.8
January 2015
59.4


(bgyoshi) #2

Trim off the extra trash and made DB focused.

Aside from whining, by far the biggest killer is offering players too many things.

They pushed 5v5 Stopwatch as the end all be all intent of DB, but also offer 6v6 and 7v7 and 8v8 Objective and Stopwatch, and also offered Execution. There’s casual and ranked and browse… Pick something. Get rid of 5v5 or 6v6 or 7v7 or 8v8 and choose one or two core modes and offer both for Ranked play. Don’t let players make your game for you, make a game and offer it to the players. They got rid of execution, they’re talking about trimming away 7v7 and 8v8, this is good. It’ll focus the game down, new players won’t come in with a false sense of 5 different ways to play and the community won’t be divided among them. The people that stay around will like the game SD wants. This will help unify the community too

Custom servers are a great way to add some fun back in. There’s nothing wrong with offering one or two methods to play, then opening up rentable servers to let people make what they want. Often times, a game’s entire popularity comes from the community (like Arma 2, DayZ mod made it popular) and other times, players just want fun custom rules (TF2). SD also doesn’t have to officially support these modes. They don’t need to make mercs and balance patches to tune them, they can focus on their game and let community servers run themselves.

Continue development. They’ve nailed this through the second and third quarter of 2017, they need to just keep it up. We have two new mercs and more on the way, so it’s time to start thinking about actual balance patches again as well, on top of continuing development.

No one thing is going to fix the game. The design is kind of all over the place right now and they’re still juggling too many things.

This is a good thread.


(hawkeyeguy99) #3

I literally don’t think there is any problem with playerbase. I never had to wait for a match until CMM came out. Maybe it’s just me but I don’t see it as a big enough problem at the moment. Wait for the game to fully release.


(KayDubz) #4

@bgyoshi

If you force people into ranked, low player matches, and only a couple of gametypes, you kill the game.

The most loyal fans who’ve been playing for years see the value in varied game types or at least rented servers where players can do different things. It’s why games like COD4 lived for so long. Players had many map choices, server choices, and game type choices. They weren’t forced to do one or two things only.

If you force people into ranked, low player matches, and only a couple of gametypes, you WILL kill the game.

I’m hopeful rented servers breath life into this game. And I hope SD doesn’t do something like offer rented servers, but removes the option for renters to set 7v7,8v8 and Objective matches.

@hawkeyeguy99 said:
I literally don’t think there is any problem with playerbase. I never had to wait for a match until CMM came out. Maybe it’s just me but I don’t see it as a big enough problem at the moment. Wait for the game to fully release.
Lololol. People have been saying wait for release since Alpha. Who knows when that will ever happen.


(bgyoshi) #5

@KayDubz said:

If you force people into ranked, low player matches, and only a couple of gametypes, you kill the game.

Hence why I gave a multitude of things to do. I didn’t offer single and exclusive paths to take. Focusing the game down to Ranked and Unranked 5v5/6v6 SW or Obj only AND giving community servers where it will be easily possible to make 7v7 or 8v8 or 10v10 or 16v16 servers AND continuing to release new content is what I suggested.

You’re right, if the only thing they do is make the entire game 5v5 Ranked only, it will be dead. Hence why I didn’t suggest that.


Could Someone Advise Me on How to Improve Gameplay Strategies in Dirty Bomb?
(woodchip) #6

There are so many things that could easily improve the experience for all players and especially new players. Just going to list in no order:

  1. Change the merc unlock rotation to be different for each player.

DB’s at its best when a diverse set of mercs are played. But new players never see that. Noobie servers consist almost entirely of the same 5 mercs because everyone is on the same rotation. Also, merc stacking beyond 2 results in increasingly negative gameplay experience.

Due to the way rotation is set up right now, that 3x phantom or 4x proxy game is the majority of the new player experience. Change would fix that and make the game better for everyone to boot.

Counter argument is having a 3 merc rotation helps people learn the characters & lowers the new player learning curve. Maybe, but it isn’t worth it. MOBA’s are obviously more knowledge dependent here than DB. It’s especially not worth the cost to player-merc identity (critical for locking new players in). It’s hard to identify with a merc that the entire rest of the lobby is playing.

  1. Improve the autobalance features.

Things, like:

-Have the game know which team is winning (most combined score by X, and so forth). As players join, add high level players to the losing team. You don’t have to prevent them from switching, but doing that by default would improve a lot of games.

-Add incentives for switching to an outnumbered team. When 1 team is up 2 players, the player that switches should get some kind of reward. Doesn’t have to be much, (obviously you would get some weird behavior if you set it too high) but anything would help.

-Lower the shuffle vote threshold for extremely one sided games.

It should be a bit easier to get a shuffle when one team has 3x the points of the other at the 10 minute mark. Even a difference of 1 less yes threshold could go a long way.

-Increase the shuffle vote threshold after a shuffle.

It should be harder or even impossible to get a shuffle 30 seconds after a previous shuffle vote.

  1. Increase teamplay incentives in casual play.

XP for a rez and ammo & EV repair could be increased, at least slightly. Being the only medic or ammo giver or engineer should be extremely rewarding in terms of score and credit generation. Right now, it’s only extremely rewarding if you are Aura or Jav.

  1. Change the Stopwatch victory condition timer, at least for nonranked.

If an attacker can’t push the objective for 8 minutes, 99% of the time it’s because they are getting stomped and the game should end. Especially now that stopwatch is the only casual mode you are getting a lot of 15 minute spawn camps.

Casual Stopwatch should have objective mode like cut offs as a mercy rule. With a timer a bit more generous than objective: 7 minutes per objective instead of 5.

  1. Add a Stopwatch victory condition element to the UI.

Seriously, there ought to be some easy to read indicator of how far attacking team 1 got. The 2x delivery system is already sort of confusing for new players. 2x delivery with nothing but memory to tell you whether first attackers delivered once twice or never makes it even harder to understand the basic rules of the game.

  1. Add recruit a friend.

Message a friend on steam a special link and get them to play. Whenever they level up you both get bonus 500 gold.

  1. Make the new player experience extremely rewarding. Practically give stuff away for the first 5 hours.

Players taking 10+ hours to unlock their 2nd character or first bronze card is way too little reward to engage totally new players. Newbies probably aren’t dominating the scoreboard in their first few hours, so virtually every successful F2P game compensates by giving them lots of cool new toys in that time.

  1. Make the normal player experience more rewarding.

Lead cards are not even worth watching the unlock screen for. Frankly, they shouldn’t probably even be in the game as anything other than stepping stone for total noobies. Stingyness in a F2P model just doesn’t pay for itself in the end.

It’s ok for cobolts and gold to be extremely hard to get. But the game should be more generous overall, with special focus on engaging players at each step of the learning curve.

Giving a free 1x crafting kit with each arsenal crate for instance would go a long way to engaging new and intermediate players with the crafting system, which right now they have to pretty much ignore because spending gold on characters is so much more valuable.

Giving noobies 1 “free” bronze craft per 8 play hours is not going to break your F2P model.

  1. Add tutorials for each merc.

The game is really complicated. It takes a while to understand things like long jumping, the engineer building / planting bonus, let alone the strengths and weaknesses of each weapon or how to use each merc.

A short 5 minute max tutorial for each merc that also explains the strengths and some tips for their default gun would go very far. Then you can make completing the tutorial award an iron card for that guy and voila, way less skyhammers that don’t know about giving ammo.

  1. Add a gun range with moving targets.

Like Overwatch has. A place to test out every merc and weapon, test out jumping and what not, can help players get excited for unlocking stuff later. Testing weapons is especially important, as the differences between them are fairly subtle, and there is no in game info about those differences whatsoever. As a new player, I felt like all the SMGs beside Blishlok for instance were basically the same, and that that was a major weakness in the game. I was wrong about that, but it took me 10+ hours to realize it.

A 1 sentence description of weapon strengths and weaknesses somewhere, anywhere would help this.

Map specific

  1. Nerf defense on bridge point 1 slightly. Especially the middle path that involves going over the ramp is extremely vulnerable to crossfire. Changing that geometry to be slightly more attacker friendly could be good.

11.1) Allow the generator on point 2 bridge to be repaired. Point 2 is interesting, but lately it feels almost trivialized by explosives.

11.2) Make getting the 1st objective out of point 3 slightly easier (maybe move it slightly closer to the door). Then make returning the objective in point 3 slightly easier faster.

  1. Make point 1 on underground more open to air support. It should be possible for instance to use kira/sky/arty on the aura station that hides in the corner behind the med bay. Right now airsupport toons are weak throughout underground, and especially on point 1. The windows mechanic is also pretty unintuitive if you are new. Better to have clearly open and clearly enclosed spaces.

12.1) Consider nerfing the elevator sound effect.

I’m not 100% confident on this, but it’s very easy to hold the upper side level as defenders, and slaughter the enemies in the elevator as they try to retake it. Lowering the sound effect radius of the little elevator noise could help make it slightly harder for defenders to lockdown the spawn on point 1.

12.2) Slightly slow the time it takes to capture the 2nd ‘point’ on Underground.

The intermediate zone is really interesting and contrasts very well with the rest of the map. But it often ends very quickly, sometimes after only 2 or so spawn waves. I would consider making it slightly easier for defenders to hold this 2nd ‘point’, probably by adjusting the spawns or spawn switch mechanics slightly.

12.3) Nerf the barrier on point 3, and make attacking from the gas room easier.

Right now attacking from the gas room is very hard, because once you drop down into the main room it is very hard to retreat. Meanwhile, the barrier generator is extremely powerful.
Together these things tend to overemphasize the barrier room.

Barrier should be slightly less powerful, and the right approach should be slightly more powerful for attackers.

I don’t have any ideas for other maps

  1. Remove the boost via plant and disarm exploit.

Having widely known ‘hacks’ like this cheapens the perception of the game. If player A and player B are planting and disarming as fast as possible for 2 minute straight they are 99% likely abusing the game. Adding a very generous diminishing return to planting/disarming would fix this without affecting normal play.

  1. Add an XP bonus for partying with friends.

Players who play games together have more fun and are more likely to stay playing that game.

  1. Add a mute system for toxic players.

People who rage at others & especially noobies make a lot of people stop playing. A report system that mutes the top 1% most toxic people or whatever could be enough of a threat to keep people from getting told to drink bleach quite so often. Obviously this would have to be disabled in ranked.

Idk there’s tons of other stuff. Mostly, DB needs to look at what very successful F2P games are doing. Hearthstone, Paladins, Dota2, and Heroes of the Storm all add valuable insight into a successful F2P model. Most of the issues with DB are non-gameplay & stem from the Nexon influenced F2P strategy. Nexon’s shortsighted and greedy F2P tendencies have sunk many games.


(GatoCommodore) #7

we have the highest peak players (5,584) compared to 15 months ago

SD is doing something right.


(watsyurdeal) #8

By not being so good damn negative when you lose a game.


(Cleanlybomb) #9

Download game.

Play first match.

Go against people 50-100 levels higher than you.

Get killed repeatedly by their 3-4 Javelins.

Uninstall game.

^ changing something here might help.


(watsyurdeal) #10

It’s called a new update, same exact thing happened with other Merc like Stoker and Fletcher


(Cleanlybomb) #11

Download game.

Play first match.

Go against people 50-100 levels higher than you.

Get killed repeatedly by their 3-4 Stokers and Fletchers.

Uninstall game.

^ changing something here might have helped.


(jitter_sv) #12

1/ re-open casual objective match for training, and let stopwatch for real team play game
2/ introduce 2 separate ranked system: 1 only for constitued team, 1 for solo players where you win/loose point depending your real level, not the result of the match
3/ let the possibility to rent custom servers for community, teams
4/ give sdk for create custom map

the key, imo, is to let the players help to make growing the game by creating maps, tournament, communities , and not let people playing alone


(TheStrangerous) #13

My thirst thought was dumbing down the game, since sadly it works in gaming industry :frowning:
But I’d rather it remain, to be niche title.


(Blargz) #14

@woodchip Made some great points. I’d only add, that DB needs advertisement. I’ve seen multiple f2p shooters adverts while browsing the interent, but there was nothing about DB.

Also, drop that ‘beta’ thing. People don’t like unfinished products. We don’t have game-breaking bugs or constant technical issues. It plays just fine and it’s ready. All it needs is some minor changes and fixes (like ranked solo q players playing against other solo players, not full teams).


(Nail) #15

there’s no advertising because THE GAME HASN’T BEEN RELEASED

" We don’t have game-breaking bugs or constant technical issues. It plays just fine and it’s ready."

what freakin game are you playing ?


(Blargz) #16

“there’s no advertising because THE GAME HASN’T BEEN RELEASED”

Yeah, that’s kinda my point. Release the kraken already. Tell me about those game-breaking bugs and technical issues that prevent DB from finally launching.


(FishRolls) #17

Unless the game dies in the beta (which it probably won’t) we need to make sure the game is refined with a lot of content for it’s eventual release.


(WatchAsILead) #18

No offense but thats not really your job, If SD was worried about the player count I’m sure they would of done something about it. Right know its a beta and they want to get the game to a fully polished, public release. Id rather have 2,000 players daily playing the beta and 20,000 after release then the other way around. Just be patient, developing a game takes time. Dont be one of those impatient players that cant wait 6-12 months for the game to be finished and trashes it in the meantime.


(Ptiloui) #19

About advertising, shoe and i don’t recall who (sorry dude) went to the gamescon recently so… if it’s not advertising, i don’t know what it is.
But, i don’t think advertising now is a good thing. The game is clearly not finished, and people you could attract now who got disappointed will never return.
What this game really need is more polished content. The purpose of the beta state is to ask players test things and read their feedbacks. And honestly, i don’t feel we are really testing things in order to make them more polished or have other mechanics. And the fact there is a PTS, in a BETA game, is the proof that only the feedback of a few are really listened to.
Don’t like Javelin ? Just remember some privileged players tested her before she was released. What can we conclude ? Those players saw her and said “she’s fine” ? They proposed some tweaks but SD didn’t listened ? Or maybe they did tweaks and released her without more tests (so what’s the point of testing her before release) ?

This is maybe a salty post but i think im just beginning to be bored of the static state of this game. The REAL NEW contents we had for two years are maps. Really ! Mercs were already in alpha or closed beta. They just removed them to re-released them one by one. The crafting system is not even that original (the Trade-in was better and somewhat unique). Execution mode was a pale copy/paste from what CS do for 15-20 years ago. Aaaand that’s all.


(K1X455) #20

Make an effort on player retention