Objective Reminders?

(Disquieted1) #1

So I’ve been playing pub matches and competitive matches and I’ve seen the same thing in both: Players running around thinking that we’re playing TDM. Most times I’m the only one on a server (or one of two) that is doing the objective (and therefore playing the game). I think the game needs to periodically remind players that the game is objective based and the game isn’t centered around kills. Probably make the objective in the UI pulse every now and then would be my suggestion. Any thoughts?

(Faraleth) #2

I actually like this idea. It would be nice if there was a (slightly hidden) option in the menu to toggle this off though - because as someone who always plays the objective and knows what they are doing, it could get pretty annoying - but should be on by default.

As long as it wasn’t overly annoying with interfering UI, I could see it being very good and useful! I’ll note it down as a suggestion for the devs in tomorrow’s stream c:

(XavienX) #3

Maybe whenever players spawn, there should be a big message up top, but not TOO big that it takes up your screen. Just big enough saying, “To the DAMN UHB-JEK-TIV, ain’t TDM y’all!”

(D'@athi) #4

Hehe nice idea. A pity, but imo, still useless.
This game, in comparision to what they are used to, simply is to fast for the average stoned/drunk/frightened kids nowadays. So putting more information into their brains would be stalling them even faster.

(Black) #5

[quote=“Faraleth;77502”]I actually like this idea. It would be nice if there was a (slightly hidden) option in the menu to toggle this off though - because as someone who always plays the objective and knows what they are doing, it could get pretty annoying - but should be on by default.

As long as it wasn’t overly annoying with interfering UI, I could see it being very good and useful! I’ll note it down as a suggestion for the devs in tomorrow’s stream c:[/quote]

There shouldn’t be an option to toggle it off. It should also be a voice reminder too, something like: “FOCUS THE BLOODY OBJECTIVE!” or “KILLS ISN"T GOING TO WIN US THE BATTLE!” The reminder should simply blink and or highlight the objective on the map and in first person briefly.

The objective reminder should pop up when a player refuses to advance towards or interact with an objective. Maybe like a minute? Which is equivalent to about 4 spawns in which the team is not focusing the objective.

(RyePanda) #6

I would like the announcer to continue to say how much time was left to disarm the C4, and have a red flashing “Disarm the C4” on the bottom of the screen. So many times where I seriously think my teammates don’t realize what the pulsing yellow bar means.

(Litego) #7

People do it because TDMing wins games. I’m dead serious! If you kill everyone, there’s no one left to stop your team from doing the objective. Having the entire team focused on just PTFO isn’t going to win you the game. The other team is just going to shut you down.

You need people who just goes around and kill enemies, because without enemies your objective players are free to do the actual objective without dying. Just throwing yourself at the objective helps no one. PTFOing into a brick wall is not useful.

I suspect far too many people focus too hard on the objective, so when you meet that wall of bullets, people get pissy and start saying shit like OP. No one is planting because no one can actually reach the objective, so it looks like they’re just TDMing instead of playing the objective.

With that said, of course in the end you do win games by doing the objective, so you need people to focus on that. All I’m saying is that having the entire team do it is not good for the team. The killers are helping the objective players do their thing, without the killers you wouldn’t be able to do the objective.

So when your team is getting rolled in a game, maybe look at what’s causing it. Is it actually the lack of objective players? Lack of support players? Or maybe it’s actually a lack of firepower (in other words, TDM players). For me I find it’s most often the latter two.

(K1X455) #8

You’ll see players do TDM if they’re on defense because it is a big part of their uhb-jek-tiv. It’s more mundane to just death match the opposition because you’ll gain 200 Game Mode XP for holding out a good defense and suppressing opposing activity to achieve their uhb-jek-tiv. Perhaps SD can make future maps that are equally uhb-jek-tiv for the defense beside preventing the other team do their uhb-jek-tiv?

(Ghosthree3) #9

It does though… I’m pretty sure it annoyingly yells “bla bla the damn objective” every minute or something.

(JesseKomm) #10

To a degree, the announcer will pop in once they’ve repaired the EV or planted C4, but it’s not persistent because the game, and the devs, assume players understand this is an issue to the match. EV is a little more vocal because he’ll announce when it’s getting to certain points of the map, whereas C4 it’s just “They planted blah blah” and then players are expected to immediately go and defuse it.

(Disquieted1) #11

[quote=“Litego;77606”]People do it because TDMing wins games. I’m dead serious! If you kill everyone, there’s no one left to stop your team from doing the objective. Having the entire team focused on just PTFO isn’t going to win you the game. The other team is just going to shut you down.

You need people who just goes around and kill enemies, because without enemies your objective players are free to do the actual objective without dying. Just throwing yourself at the objective helps no one. PTFOing into a brick wall is not useful.

I suspect far too many people focus too hard on the objective, so when you meet that wall of bullets, people get pissy and start saying shit like OP. No one is planting because no one can actually reach the objective, so it looks like they’re just TDMing instead of playing the objective.

With that said, of course in the end you do win games by doing the objective, so you need people to focus on that. All I’m saying is that having the entire team do it is not good for the team. The killers are helping the objective players do their thing, without the killers you wouldn’t be able to do the objective.

So when your team is getting rolled in a game, maybe look at what’s causing it. Is it actually the lack of objective players? Lack of support players? Or maybe it’s actually a lack of firepower (in other words, TDM players). For me I find it’s most often the latter two.[/quote]

assumes that OP wrote “5 out of 5 players need to repair the EV simultaneously”

Fragger, Nader and Phantom exist for a reason.

(Viquel) #12

There should be some kind of intro video, that cannot be skipped. It would zoom around the map and explain the single stages. It should play on all maps, and even if you’re level 20 and higher, it should not stop.

(Jurmabones) #13

This. Even if they force-quit the client, when they reload it’ll start it all over from the beginning.

The more I play mp games, the more I realize games are good but communities are full of dumb little nitwits with the attention span of fruit flies.

(Gi.Am) #14

yepp its tied to your death as far as I know, reminding you that an objective needs to be done when you respawn.

(The_Enema_Bandit) #15

I used to play with extremely lowered dialogue volume, because I don’t like to be yelled at constantly about something that’s pretty clear to me. The thing is it also lowers the dialogue of mercs, which is something I like.
So maybe additional audio option for this is an idea?

(Litego) #16

[quote=“Disquieted1;77846”][quote=“Litego;77606”]People do it because TDMing wins games. I’m dead serious! If you kill everyone, there’s no one left to stop your team from doing the objective. Having the entire team focused on just PTFO isn’t going to win you the game. The other team is just going to shut you down.

You need people who just goes around and kill enemies, because without enemies your objective players are free to do the actual objective without dying. Just throwing yourself at the objective helps no one. PTFOing into a brick wall is not useful.

I suspect far too many people focus too hard on the objective, so when you meet that wall of bullets, people get pissy and start saying shit like OP. No one is planting because no one can actually reach the objective, so it looks like they’re just TDMing instead of playing the objective.

With that said, of course in the end you do win games by doing the objective, so you need people to focus on that. All I’m saying is that having the entire team do it is not good for the team. The killers are helping the objective players do their thing, without the killers you wouldn’t be able to do the objective.

So when your team is getting rolled in a game, maybe look at what’s causing it. Is it actually the lack of objective players? Lack of support players? Or maybe it’s actually a lack of firepower (in other words, TDM players). For me I find it’s most often the latter two.[/quote]

assumes that OP wrote “5 out of 5 players need to repair the EV simultaneously”

Fragger, Nader and Phantom exist for a reason.[/quote]

Feels like that’s the communities opinion most of the time, both in-game and on the forums. If I play Fragger in-game and score way beyond anyone else, being a pain in the ass for the other team, and I still lose, I will sometimes hear about how useless I am “playing TDM” instead of PTFO. Even though fighting the other team was like hitting a brick wall. No matter how many I kill there’s always someone left to kill me and the other players with the objective.

Now from my perspective I see no reason to change to an engineer and try to PTFO when I can’t even get close to the objective (unless I’m some kind of super objective ninja, but I’m not), that’s not gonna help anyone, and will in fact just make it even worse. Changing to medic might help, but if I don’t see anyone else stepping up in the TDM department I doubt it’ll make a difference.

I don’t think we need any reminder how to play the game. It’s not that people don’t understand what the goal of the game is. It’s just that they’re shit at the game, terrible at the role they’ve chosen to play or lack the ability/will to adept and play the role that’s most beneficial for the team at that moment (I will admit I’m not that great at this one myself).

So what are we even complaining about here? Basically all it comes down to is that other players aren’t as good at the game as us. Objective players trying to get to the objective that we see dying over and over in duels on the way to the objective: Stop TDMing and PTFO! TDM players that get’s outplayed by better/more players on the other team, dying over and over, not clearing path for the objective players: Stop TDMing and PTFO! Support players not giving ammo/health… Ok this one I agree with, that’s a problem and they need to do less TDMing and more supporting. But then again, that comes back to them being shit at their role and not understanding it.

TL;DR So all it comes down to in the end is just shit players being shit, annoying more experienced players.

(Disquieted1) #17

[quote=“Litego;78342”]Feels like that’s the communities opinion most of the time, both in-game and on the forums. If I play Fragger in-game and score way beyond anyone else, being a pain in the ass for the other team, and I still lose, I will sometimes hear about how useless I am “playing TDM” instead of PTFO. Even though fighting the other team was like hitting a brick wall. No matter how many I kill there’s always someone left to kill me and the other players with the objective.

Now from my perspective I see no reason to change to an engineer and try to PTFO when I can’t even get close to the objective (unless I’m some kind of super objective ninja, but I’m not), that’s not gonna help anyone, and will in fact just make it even worse. Changing to medic might help, but if I don’t see anyone else stepping up in the TDM department I doubt it’ll make a difference.

I don’t think we need any reminder how to play the game. It’s not that people don’t understand what the goal of the game is. It’s just that they’re shit at the game, terrible at the role they’ve chosen to play or lack the ability/will to adept and play the role that’s most beneficial for the team at that moment (I will admit I’m not that great at this one myself).

So what are we even complaining about here? Basically all it comes down to is that other players aren’t as good at the game as us. Objective players trying to get to the objective that we see dying over and over in duels on the way to the objective: Stop TDMing and PTFO! TDM players that get’s outplayed by better/more players on the other team, dying over and over, not clearing path for the objective players: Stop TDMing and PTFO! Support players not giving ammo/health… Ok this one I agree with, that’s a problem and they need to do less TDMing and more supporting. But then again, that comes back to them being shit at their role and not understanding it.

TL;DR So all it comes down to in the end is just shit players being shit, annoying more experienced players.[/quote]

I know where you’re coming from. I play mainly Fragger, Proxy (soon-to-be-Bushwhacker once I unlock him) and Sawbonez. These three are the Mercs that are always in my squad.

The sad thing is, is that no matter what I do nor where I am, teams are TDMing against each other. If I play Fragger and hold off the control center on Underground from the defenders, others are there doing damage too and not a single bomb planted. If I play Proxy and try to get the bomb planted, I’m almost always the only one to defend the bomb (I usually die and the blaring yellow bar disappears from the C4). If I play Sawbonez and heal the entire team into the control center, they camp and don’t plant the bomb. I understand the different functions of each team member and how they come together. Hundreds of hours on Counter Strike taught me that.

I know the counterargument. “Do it yourself.” Much easier said than done. For anyone to do anything, they need support from the team. when the team doesn’t provide that support, no one can do anything. Dirty Bomb is a team based game after all.

There’s a difference between being bad and not understanding the game. I’m able to accept that people are bad (I’m not that good myself, having just recently come from CS). But players should at least be reminded that Dirty Bomb is an objective based game. In CS, you can do two things to win: Get kills or do the objective. In Dirty Bomb there’s one: Do the objective. Getting kills is secondary, albeit necessary.

Attackers have two things to manage when they play. Get kills and do the objective. However only the latter will give them a win. Defenders have one and a half things to manage when they play. Get kills and do the objective. In the Defender’s case, getting kills is half of the objective, but only the objective itself will win the game.

Only objectives win games. This sets Dirty Bomb apart from its competitors and rightfully so. Years of CoD, BF and CS have taught others that “only your K/D matters,” which doesn’t apply to Dirty Bomb. Notice how K/D isn’t shown until the match summary? That encourages objective (and indirectly, team) play but not enough. If Dirty Bomb is to succeed more than it already has, reminding players that the game is different is the way to go.

tl;dr – Years of other FPSs have taught players that only K/D matters. To be both fun and more successful, Dirty Bomb should remind players that this game is different in that teamplay and objective play is emphasized rather than K/D.

(Litego) #18

But as others have said, we already have the video at the start of every match explaining the objective and we have the voice com telling us about it every so often. I don’t think flashing objective text is gonna make it clearer. I’m pretty sure people know exactly what’s up, they just aren’t able to deal with it or don’t care about it. Though the latter would slow down progression, and considering the CoD/BF crowd are a bunch of progression whores, I bet they’ll do anything to progress faster.

With that said though I’m not against the idea, as long as I can turn it off myself.

Maybe what they need to do is remind people that winning earns them more credits so that they progress and unlock new shit faster. Now that might change some KD whores mind.

Maybe also remind them that doing the main and side objectives as well as giving ammo/health earn them extra score which turns into XP (and possibly credits?) which levels them up faster. We all know how much CoD/BF players love their levels and infinite progression (prestige).

However these reminders are displayed I’d like an option to turn off that shit. As I said, I don’t mind it, if I can make it go away.

(Disquieted1) #19

Good point. Objective incentives would make things better – or the emphasis on objectives through XP. I’m all for that as well.

(refit) #20

Does anyone else think the announcer sounds like Wheatly from Portal 2? I am always a little distrustful when he yells, “Disable the C4”. Like maybe it’s a trap.