A quick question regarding accuracy and recoil, let’s say Splash Damage wanted to increase the skill floor and make things more consistent, by reducing the max spread of the guns we use by a large amount, say, 50%
But increase the recoil of the weapons, forcing players to put a little more effort into controlling their weapons in order for them to be more accurate.
Would that be a good or bad thing?
recoil is random so i dont see how its different from spread - that much.
and no, i dont want predictable recoil patterns
I’d like to see how The Division’s weapons handle (excluding SMG’s) being implemented into DB, the recoil is awesomely high but controllable if you have the skill
I know i’m comparing between 2 vastly different TTK’s but I still think it’d work
Would not be smart. Youd just promote recoil scripts, macros etc for predictable recoil.
[quote=“Szakalot;160271”]recoil is random so i dont see how its different from spread - that much.
and no, i dont want predictable recoil patterns[/quote]
It depends on what kind of recoil, in a lot of game there is vertical recoil (sometimes slightly angular) that is linear and fully predictable (i.e when controlled, there is no spread). Then there is horizontal recoil/shake that directly affects the accuracy of the weapon without the cof changing.
Rather keep hipfire semiconsistent because it give ADS its purpose of having zero spread.
dirty bomb stands out on the market with regards to its shooting mechanics. In most of the FPS games you have to ADS. In DB you don’t have to…not always. This kind of dragged me towards playing the game.
I don’t want this to be changed.
I’m all for having to control guns more… … what? I can’t be the only one who wants more satisfying gun play? … oh… okay… well… I guess I’ll take my leave then…
[quote=“Szakalot;160271”]recoil is random so i dont see how its different from spread - that much.
and no, i dont want predictable recoil patterns[/quote]
Recoil = something you can control to some extent.
Spread = only thing you can do is to choose the general direction and hope for the best.
AFAIK
[quote=“SereneFlight;160401”]I’m all for having to control guns more… … what? I can’t be the only one who wants more satisfying gun play? … oh… okay… well… I guess I’ll take my leave then…
[quote=“Szakalot;160271”]recoil is random so i dont see how its different from spread - that much.
and no, i dont want predictable recoil patterns[/quote]
Recoil = something you can control to some extent.
Spread = only thing you can do is to choose the general direction and hope for the best.
AFAIK[/quote]
Those a more effects that definitions of recoil and spread, at least in my layman understanding. When you point the gun at point X:
Personally I’m against anything that makes TTK shorter. So adding predictable recoil would require rebalancing everything else. Replacing random spread with random recoil - eh, IMO not worth the effort.
@MarsRover yes-this distinction is used in DB
@WaffleMonster obviously im talking about DB. EVERYTHING depends, including ‘everything’ if you shift frames of reference.
the reason why i like spread +recoil over pure recoil:
fun facts: DB has one of the most accurate guns in all series, more accurate than RTCW, obviously better than QW/Brink, and if you look at M4 - more accurate than ET
CSGO also has spread, on top of the recoil patterns, not to mention the insane spread when firing while moving
The whole point of random spread is to try and force you to use the weapons in their given range. If the gun has more range, the spread at distance is less random. It makes sense to me. I’m not entirely sure why people complain about it so much.
I really don’t have any problems with how the weapons work right now. If they were more predictable people would have even more accuracy than they already do and TTK would go through the roof. So damage would need to be nerfed in order to not throw things out of wack.
I wouldn’t be against the idea at all. Just that TTK would need to be adjusted. In Soldier of Fortune 2, a game much like Dirty Bomb in a few ways, always had bullets go where you fired them but the guns had recoil and a decent amount of time between bullets hitting. It worked out pretty well in that game as the gunplay was stellar and rewarded good aim. But TTK was a bit higher than DB to offset this.
Here is an unfinished video by my frenemies, ZFZ. You might know that name from early DB competitive. In the first half of the vid they are facing my team which is [5150] who some might recognize from Tribes (also known as smf>>). This gives you a good idea of how the guns worked and what the TTK was like. There was a fair bit of sneaking in SoF2 similar to CS so it looks slow than the game typically played.
Current system is fine imo.
Or rather it was, personaly I feel like the TTK is a bit too low right now, for my own taste (Or my reaction times have gone to shit in a very short amount of time). It seems atleast for me that the spotlight is currently a little bit too much on front loaded highdamage weapons (i.e. shotguns, burstfire). Compared to how it was in the beginning of the open beta / stress test.
Either way I don’t mind spread + recoil infact since we are looking at how older games did it.
I personaly always liked how the Firearms mod for HL1 managed their weapon (after all my main shooter back in the days).
The game was fastpaced (more quake than CS) but had fairly realistic weapons. They used static random spread (no blooming) and on top of that quite strong recoil.
You could learn to compensate the recoil (or shoot in bursts) but the spread was given.
Had two effects, first: tabfiring in the CS tradition was useless, cause even the first bullet could land off center. Second: full auto past closecombat range was useless (except for lmgs when using bipod).
However to compensate all weapons had a fireselector. which obviously reduced you to singlefire but also greatly reduced the spread. Making most weapons pinpoint accurate. TTK was roughly similar to DB, 2-6 bullets to the head killed (excluding snipers) if you did the smart move of buying a helmet.
Anyways I miss the constant click clack switching between fullauto and singlefire depending on what kind of engagment I expect in the next couple of seconds. And the frantic panic of trying to survive a sudden close encounter while still stuck with singlefire.
Uhm sorry went of the rails a bit. Let’s see yeah well increasing recoil while reducing spread would definitive mean that damage needs to go down (Or HP needs to go up) otherwise the TTK goes down even more for those that are able to compensate the recoil (less bullets miss).
i only wanted to say that, i am also on the spread+recoil side.
BUT i think that spread needs to be much more normal-distribution (bell shaped distribution, Gauss function), not flat (uniform) distribution like in current DirtyBomb.
In simple words, With Bell-like random distribution you will have more center shots, than outer shots. And you will not feel the total weird shots when reaching max-spread.
Imho, since every random process in earth works according to normal-Gauss distribution. It feels much more natural because we got used to it - when sand drops it usually falls closer to center, and in real weapons pellets usually go closer to center.
Right now, when i reach max-spread at any weapon, it realy feels like full retard mode. and it should not. I just need to get less accuracy, thats all.
Higher recoil will only lead to people getting slower and ADSing more. I believe many decent players will be able to handle the recoil, but not all players. And that gonna result in shlow games.