Mapper's Mistakes: A Look Back At Where We Have Grown

(Ifurita) #21

The other big mistake is planning on making maps that are too big or too complex. Nothing is more depressing then spending months working on a planet sized map only to realise that its a stinking pile of un-compilable, un-playable poo

Yep, did that too. On my first map, it was really big and open. First, I ran out of entities because all my windows were breakable (3 story barracks building), then I discovered that 100% structural brushes <> good thing, so I fixed that, then I figured out that FPS would always suck because it was so wide open … so it was scrapped

but I salvaged the zeppelin and hanger and am turning it into a stand alone map … bwhahahahahahahahaha

(Java.Lang) #22

Yeah someone hinted on it earlier, but nothing funnier than disproportionate rooms.

Hallways as big as entire buildings… gigantic stairways, and overall grandiose architecture are just some of my prior acolades.

(DG) #23

ok what I download to try this mapping lark then? :stuck_out_tongue:

(LaggingTom) #24

On the contrary to what MadJack wrote, I have a problem with making things too big, worrying that people won’t be able to fit through.

(Ifurita) #25

See my post above. Compile often and just run thru your map to keep things in scale

(neotic) #26

I don’t know… I think alot of stuff you just learn via trial and error and forms in to a habit… I’m not sure what to say till you show me a peice of work to correct! My biggest obession is consistency. If you have a follow room; all the walls should be the same thinkness or repreesented in that way; etc. =x

(MadJack) #27

Tom, that’s how I was when I started mapping (too small rooms, entrances etc) but now I’m trying to correct myself from compensating too much from lack of space in my earlier mapping days :wink: lol

(Ifurita) #28

I agree with Neotic, once I settle on a scale, I stick to it. Ceilings are a uniform height above the ground, doorways are a uniform size, walls are a uniform thickness, etc … unless there is a special reason to make them otherwise

(MadJack) #29

Yeah true.

The only problem I was having recently is with real pics of the fort I’m using. It’s always a bit sketchy in the pics description and having to have those rooms on a good scale is not always obvious. Sometimes descriptions are pretty clear but as with my current project, it’s mostly pictures from tourists. The fort has an official site but very few sizes. Those that are included just say things like “The tunnel is 600 Meters long and 500 meters deep into the ground”. [Don’t worry, no 600 m. long tunnels in the map :D]

On topic, I usually make my walls 32 units thick and as for the height it depends on the room.

(Ifurita) #30

I think one of the problems that new mappers have is making maps to scale with 6’ humans. Unfortunately, true scale does not equal good gameplay when people get hung up in doorways, hit their heads on ceilings, etc

(amazinglarry) #31

How about not making maps with rooms that lead to nowhere. I’m just gettin into the map building thing because while attending school for game design I feel it’s cruciial to have as much knowledge as possible to go anywhere… and I must say that there’s nothing more frustrating to a player who’s running around in a new map and finding out the 5 hallways and 4 rooms he just went down lead to absolutely nowhere, and in most cases the exact opposite direction of the objective… now to run aaall the way back… or /kill. Heheh. Sorry if I was a bit off topic.

(SteelRat) #32

Lookin back at some of my first mistakes is embarrasing but I don’t mind sharing :wink:

My first map (RtCW since Doom II does not count here I guess) was made all out of structural brushes with textures on all sides and with doors 3 times as high as the players and different sizes for everything.
Not to mention CSG substract that caused me about 4 times more brushes in the map than I planned since I did not understand how this tool worked… :stuck_out_tongue:

CAULK.

Nowadays I am still learning but am being more structural in my work.
I plan the map out on paper, decide on sizes for things I want and stick to them.
I compile very often, check out progress and make backups.
As Ifurita says, make some of the stuff u want in your map as prefabs.

ET and scripting is fun right, I think that most of you have seen the script_mover without a model once or twice not to mention mapcoordsmins and maxs :stuck_out_tongue:

And also, the game does not become more fun if a map is HUGE (marketgarden excluded), it will simply just be BIG and boring to play since all you do is run from a to b 80% of the time. (yes I am lazy and hate running :P)

(blushing_bride) #33

i always make doors and stuff too big simply to avoid door blocking and chokepoints. I always make tunnels and corridors big enough for two people to stand in side by side. this does not always result in realistic scale but as the game is not realistic i dont see this as a problem. the only drawback of this is that you then need to make reverything else bigger to fit the scale. The problem is that an ET player is a square box so you need to make room for this. the most important thing is to keep the proportions of things correct.
Plus everyone knows that bigger=better :banana:

(Mr_Tickles) #34

Now I know why you’re blushing heh heh :stuck_out_tongue:

(=DaRk=CrAzY-NuTTeR) #35

Ifurita, the J changes how the brushes and stuff are selected in the 3D veiw, it you press it once it clears, press again it only shows the white outline, again it only shows the red, again and your back to defualt and then the cycle restarts

(Ifurita) #36

thx

(=DaRk=CrAzY-NuTTeR) #37

no problem lady :wink:

(neotic) #38

The real trickery with doors or a hall is that… if a bottleneck or choke point is done right; there will be other ways to get around it but the immiediete hallway/door makes for a very fun/good fight. You make it desirable to use this hallway/door but if its completely owned by one team its not the end of the game. These create fun and interesting firefights.

Geez, my typing was terrible in my last post!

Also, it bothers me when textures are just put next together. Say you have a flat plane that makes a wall, but its composed of two or more brushes. Nothing bothers me more if the textures don’t match and there isn’t an obvious reason for them not to; ex: its a border texture, frame, window, etc

Just changing the wall texture half way down the wall doesn’t happen in the real world unless one sticks out a few units more from the other; then that is okay; it gives a sense of layers.

A really huge annoyance for me is bad lighting; which I guess is very easy to achieve from the looks of some maps. Best suggestion is just make a map with 12 rooms and experiment every light you can. My favorite is using the fade parament… because most lights in the real world don’t go from lighting to not lighting… its gradual. For my current map I use these settings for a really nice soft effect that still gives a good amount of light:

fade: .27
light: 70
radius: 768

And a little color always goes along way as long as its desired for the setting.

(Gringo Starr) #39

One thing that probably wasted about 20 hours of my time was not knowing to use the middle button to copy textures from one surface to another. Believe it or not, I used to go back and forth between surface inspectors copying each stretch and shift #! lol

(Genesis) #40

errm…
the second map i did --> i had typed mapcoordmaxs instead of mapcoordSmaxs…
man… did i get pissed at not gettin into limbo!!!