Just throwing this out there.

(brennanfreak) #1

What if concussion grenades just prevent ability use for a set amount of time?

(Bewgaclaw) #2

Could be an interesting change, but it could be fairly devastating to mercs that have longer ability cooldowns than Thunder’s grenade.

(Reddeadcap) #3

Would be nifty to apply that on people who are in the blast radius.

That said, the inconsistent blinding effect, no input as to who has been concussed and no real way actually make enemies vulnerable should be looked into first.

(Sorotia) #4

Would be cool, but I imagine if that happened people would complain about it as much if not more than pre-nerfed concussions…

(Naonna) #5

As someone who doesn’t play CS:GO … basically ever… How are flashbangs in that game different from the ones in Dirty Bomb? What do they do better, and how does the different pace of Dirty Bomb make CS:GO’s version inefficient for this game?

If we can understand what was done correctly, we can integrate that more easily into Dirty Bomb.

(bontsa) #6

Now @Naonna is exactly where it’s at!

Why I feel flashbangs are crucial and fantastic utility in CS:GO, is because of much much faster TTK and much much slower and “straight-forward” (as in no parkour for you) movement mechanics; hence losing your vision even partially for 300 ms (around average human reaction time) can mean death.

They also bounce a lot more, so there’s tactical depth in throwing them, mapknowledge and fuse time has to be taken into account greatly, setting skill ceiling rather high in their usage. Due to their consistency too, there is enough counterplay to them (looking away actually prevents most of the effect). Unlike DB’s version which sometimes flashes you across the map when you’re facing your crotch with eyes shut, and sometimes does as much as a candle would even when it goes off right in front of your kisser.

While CS:GO doesn’t offer so much information via HUD as DB, it is still nullified by flash effect, which we lack. And that just baffles me, how hasn’t it been thought right at the start? There’s a difference between offering counterplay and making an ability obnoxiously useless, dear SplashDamage.

So all in all, what I feel DB’s conc should do? It should disable HUD, have more bounciness (and have map geometry LOT more consistent), but not only casting visual hindrance on enemy, but also reduce their movement speed with greater radius than current concussion. As in CS it’s enough to cast effect on vision only, in DB movement is so crucial disorienting that is necessary too. After all the ability doesn’t outright kill like Fragger’s or Nader’s, it should be more of a crowd control type, making enemies vulnerable on bigger area.

Counterplay would be offered in form of allowing certain HUD elements that the character “feels”, like getting hit direction and HP (why not ammo count too, professionals should be aware of it at all times) and NOT reducing their ability to shoot / use own abilities. So they can spam away and make educated guessing where they’re getting shot at, but if enough severely affected by concussion, it remains rather futile. However if Thunder or his team fails to seize the opportunity or throw is a failure, no harm is done so it’s pretty much ability wasted. Also cooldown could be on-par with Fragger’s.

(watsyurdeal) #7

Personally I feel like the Concs should function like the Arc Nades from Titanfall. But since this isn’t Sci Fi, we should settle for…

  • Cause a disoritenting screen effect, not blinding, but make things blurry and very difficult to see.
  • Hinder movement somehow, reducing speed as well preventing jumping and sprinting.
  • The effect they have on deployables should last a little longer imo.
(RedBeard) #8

[quote=“Watsyurdeal;157901”]Personally I feel like the Concs should function like the Arc Nades from Titanfall. But since this isn’t Sci Fi, we should settle for…

[list]
[] Cause a disoritenting screen effect, not blinding, but make things blurry and very difficult to see.
[] Hinder movement somehow, reducing speed as well preventing jumping and sprinting.
[*] The effect they have on deployables should last a little longer imo.
[/list][/quote]

Interesting, however that still has him as a bullet sponge. I woulld rather see it knock players down briefly rather than hinder movement over time.

(CCP115) #9

CS:GO flashes are so powerful for such small items, and Dirty Bomb needs to try and match that as much as possible./

I have to say this change might actually be interesting. If an ability is off cooldown, then it can’t be used for a short amount of time, and if it’s cooling down, it won’t be affected.

(Vaasref) #10

How about Rhino and Sparks ?

Their abilities are their true primaries.

I think conc should not affect abilities that way.

(Reddeadcap) #11

[quote=“Watsyurdeal;157901”]Personally I feel like the Concs should function like the Arc Nades from Titanfall. But since this isn’t Sci Fi, we should settle for…

[list]
[] Cause a disoritenting screen effect, not blinding, but make things blurry and very difficult to see.
[] Hinder movement somehow, reducing speed as well preventing jumping and sprinting.
[*] The effect they have on deployables should last a little longer imo.
[/list][/quote]

Along with that they should really give him back his 180 hp.

  • This actually happens when you’re in the blast radius of the conc grenades, the closer you are to the center the more distorted and black & white vision becomes, this isn’t noticeable if you’re blinded.
  • The do decrease movement speed, but there should be something else, somehow making enemies truly vulnerable like how it reduced mouse control or if that’s too much locking away aim down sights and bump up weapon spread.
  • Agree.
(Naonna) #12

A PDP user would be utterly helpless to a depressing degree if ADS or spread was changed by the conc.

(bizarreRectangle) #13

And so would anyone with a gun. @Redcap The movement speed is barely decreased, it doesn’t work most of the time and I don’t quite know what is wrong with it. I think that the stun over distance got messed up in the december hotifx, and that’s the reason nobody gets stunned sufficiently unless they are very close to it.

@bontsa made a post which is probably one of the very few intellectual ones about changing thunder. I think there needs to be an extra stun effect or two. One thing I’d like to see is being unable to jump while stunned. And maybe effecting aim somehow, like spread increase or dpi decrease.

(bontsa) #14

@bizarreRectangle Why thankyou, but there’s been a lot of insightful discussion here.

But yes, since DB relies much more heavily on movement systems, concussion to be effective, should affect this more greatly than it does now. And preferably in larger area.

If flashing effect would be consistent though, I feel that would be enough of a hindrance for aiming. If you have no clear vision (and no stupid, undeserved aids like seeing enemy HP bars) you cannot retaliate with full efficiency, giving proper upper hand to Thunder and his team. As long as the effect can be anticipated and confirmed. Not wonky, random flash as now and having some kind of proper indicator on enemy (marker etc) when their vision and movement is impaired.

(pumpkinmeerkat) #15

Just bringing back the ability to cook his concussion grenade and making them more bouncy would help a lot IMO.

(SonataDusk) #16

Maybe if it did a bit of damage to deployables in addition to disabling them for a time. Not insta destruction, but maybe taking two concussions to take out a health station or turret, one to destroy mines, stickies, or HB sensors. If that was the case then the cool down should be increased a tad.

(inscrutableShow) #17

Personally, I think they should remove the EMP function altogether, and give that to a new engineer, with the cooldown and capacity of Stickies. That would make them more spammable (by spammable I mean you don’t have to worry about waiting for the cooldown, you can just throw it). This would make it so you could just throw one around corners, at C4, etc, to clear potential mines/turrets/etc. That, IMHO, is the whole point of EMP nades. As it is, the EMP function of the conc nades is just a sidenote to the flashbang bit. I personally LOVE the idea of EMP grenades, so I’d like a merc where EMPs are the focus.