I unfortuanately don’t think Splash Damage will do this even though it’s a great idea because they like to put new mercs on free rotation the next rotation after they are released to allow people who want the merc right away to buy it and those who are patient to try it out once it comes into free rotation to decide if they really want to buy it or not.
Instead of having universal rotation, randomise the rotation completely per account to minimize spam
Eddie1
(Eddie)
#22
If they’d just make a chance to pick 2 mercs every week. So next week u have to choose 2 OTHERS than the week before and that actually lasts 2 weeks. So for example you pick Arty and Fletcher, You’d then next have to pick 2 other mercs let’s say Nader and Sparks. Then After the N&S week u have to pick 2 new ones and those can’t be Arty, Fletcher, Nader or Sparks. after that week the Arty and Fletcher come available again. imo a pretty good system.
Szakalot
(Szakalot)
#23
pretty good system for people that will never pay any real $$$ on the game.
there HAS to be an incentive to spend money, for the game to make sense as a business model.
none of the ideas proposed here, makes sense from $$$ point of view. You can whine all you want, but if a game does not generate profit - it doesn’t exist.
Eox
(Eox)
#24
make it ip based, maybe even country based. Just to prevent 8 naders vs 8 sparks kind of stuff
[/quote]
It’s very easy to change your IP adress. That’s not a good idea either.
Country based ? I don’t know.
Dirmagnos
(Dirmagnos)
#26
If some1 creates multiple accounts to switch untill he finds rotation that he likes, let them.
Those idiots will end up with bunch of accounts that arent worth anything really, since they all will have some credits, some levels, some ranks, etc
But anything complete or competitive or clan-related, they can forget about it. Its not exactly that it takes months to buy one merc in DB.
Simply not worth it and makes player look like a complete moron in the end.
They could also reduce amount of mercs in rotation to 1. For the same reasons as many people object personified selection for each account. Having 3 mercs in rotation makes players 3 times less willing to buy mercs, compared to just 1.
Also, good game is successful game, that in turn is based on gameplay. And having 6 snipers or 6 naders or 6 Sparks running around in same team(and possible similar situation with opposite team) dosnt really qualify as good.
Another option to prevent multiple accounts would be rotating mercs daily. Spending half an hour every day, looking for account that has preferred merc… that person needs to see a shrink… No logic will work in those cases.
Szakalot
(Szakalot)
#28
[quote=“Dirmagnos;38793”]If some1 creates multiple accounts to switch untill he finds rotation that he likes, let them.
Those idiots will end up with bunch of accounts that arent worth anything really, since they all will have some credits, some levels, some ranks, etc
But anything complete or competitive or clan-related, they can forget about it. Its not exactly that it takes months to buy one merc in DB.
Simply not worth it and makes player look like a complete moron in the end.
They could also reduce amount of mercs in rotation to 1. For the same reasons as many people object personified selection for each account. Having 3 mercs in rotation makes players 3 times less willing to buy mercs, compared to just 1.
Also, good game is successful game, that in turn is based on gameplay. And having 6 snipers or 6 naders or 6 Sparks running around in same team(and possible similar situation with opposite team) dosnt really qualify as good.
Another option to prevent multiple accounts would be rotating mercs daily. Spending half an hour every day, looking for account that has preferred merc… that person needs to see a shrink… No logic will work in those cases.[/quote]
its not about them being morons or not lol, its about people that would otherwise (maybe) spend cash, not spending cash.
If you give people the choice of :
- pay money
- get the same stuff for free
what do you think people will do?
Even if its 5% of players (1 in 20, doesn’t sound crazy to me), that is 5% less profit for developers.
Rotating mercenaries daily is even more absurd (sorry); hardly any incentive at all to spend cash, you get to play with all the mercenaries in the entire game within a week.
Also: the problem of people swarming the free rotation is only really true for the first few months of the game. After a month of play people get more mercs that suit their particular playstyle, and even though they will try out the rotations, they will stick to what they are good at.
The more a particular player will play, the less likely they are to be affected by the rotation.
And above all, I think its actually quite fun to see how those setups of 4 vassilis, or 4 sawbonez or 4 rhinos play out. Makes pubs for a different experience, with each next rotation.
masterfulTrapezoid
(masterfulTrapezoid)
#29
why would a player not spend money ? if they have 10 accounts whats stopping them from spending money ? right now whats there to buy ? not much, when they release skins or any other nice cosmetics THEN should people worry to buy currency for real money.
There is no point in spending money now if you want to make 10 accounts let them, people will get sick of switching accounts or they will want to buy things for a main account they cant get by switching accounts aka cosmetics (id buy an angel costume for sparks any day of the week) or they will get the pack with all the mercs, the argument against making multiple accounts is rather weak and feeble in my opinion.
Szakalot
(Szakalot)
#30
[quote=“masterfulTrapezoid;38864”]why would a player not spend money ? if they have 10 accounts whats stopping them from spending money ? right now whats there to buy ? not much, when they release skins or any other nice cosmetics THEN should people worry to buy currency for real money.
There is no point in spending money now if you want to make 10 accounts let them, people will get sick of switching accounts or they will want to buy things for a main account they cant get by switching accounts aka cosmetics (id buy an angel costume for sparks any day of the week) or they will get the pack with all the mercs, the argument against making multiple accounts is rather weak and feeble in my opinion.[/quote]
you are speculating.
presently the main way to spend money is to unlock mercs. therefore, allowing players access to all mercs for free goes against the business model
masterfulTrapezoid
(masterfulTrapezoid)
#31
you are speculating.
presently the main way to spend money is to unlock mercs. therefore, allowing players access to all mercs for free goes against the business model[/quote]
anyone that has any amount of patience will unlock mercs normally by doing the daily missions and playing the game spending 10$ or so in a single merc is rather stupid people just buy the pack and get all, if they want a primary way to get people to spend give them things that make sense such as skins for guns or skins for mercs buying credits for mercs when in time you will be flooded with credits is silly .
Szakalot
(Szakalot)
#32
not everyone plays DB as much as we do. If you have a hefty income and want to try out a particular merc, chances are you are going to buy one.
I’d definitely argue that spending money on gameplay option (new merc) is less silly than spending money on cosmetics.
How come a few pixels that barbie up your gun make more sense than a new gameplay option?
You unlock skins with credits too! (cases)
Gi.Am
(Gi.Am)
#33
Sorry @Szakalot but I have to disagree with a couple of your points.
a. Assuming that everyone that creates and manages multiply accounts, would instead buy mercs for money if they couldn’t do it. Is as realistic as the music industries claim that everyone who is filesharing would buy CDs if the filesharing would go away.
b. Someone who has the income to drop 10 bucks in a whim to circumvent the grind is usually not the type of person who can be arsed with creating and managing multiple accounts.
c. Stacked Teams going away overtime. Not gonna happen or to be more precice hopefully not gonna happen. People will stop playing the game (for whatever reason) to compensate the game (and any f2p title) needs a steady flow of new players, that will predominantly play the free rotation Mercs. Stacked teams going away under the current model is a sure sign of the game dieing (granted with a dedicated loyal playerbase that could drag on for quite some time).
d. The current system is costing Nexon and SD money aswell. It creates a bi-weekly effect that people in general don’t like and has the potential to put even longtime players off the game.
Furthermore it generates the impression that the game (certain Mercs) are far less balanced than they are. Now some people will go to the forums and bitch about that imbalance, but others simply say fuck that, maybe write a negative review and are never seen again. Considering that the F2P model hinges on attracting and retaining as much players as possible (And then making them pay up as muchas possible). That’s bad.
Now don’t get me wrong, I don’t mind stacked teams that much (yes they can be quite funny) . And I think free rotation is actually a good model for any F2P system but IMO a system that is there to attract players shouldn’t be point of so much constant griefing and needs work.
The main difference between DB and other titles when it comes to free rotation, is that those other games only allow 1 champion per team so stacking isn’t possible. I wouldn’t wanna see something like that in DB (atleast not in casual). But there need to be another way to encourage more diverse team compositions.
Dirmagnos
(Dirmagnos)
#34
You mean, like playing game normally and then buying mercs with ingame credits they earn ? Like currently existing system, for free.
There is no point in worrying about players using multiple accounts if they will play game only for a few weeks, since they will have miniscule impact on game economy anyway.
And if they do intend to play it for a while, then sticking to one account is far better that making 10. Instead of having 10-15k creds on each, player will have enough on one to buy rather solind merc selection on one.
DB monetary system is as it should be in true F2P game, you pay real money for convenience.
Personalizing merc rotation and/or making switch daily instead of weekly, wont change that even a bit.
There is one huge error in logic in this argument. You presume that all those 5% would spend any real money on the game, with or without multiple accounts. And your presumption that they all spend same amount of money.
Talking statistics, were looking on more like 0.025% loss at the worst. People who normally spend notable sums on games(and im not talking about whales, 10-15 bucks a months is notable), wont bother with such absurdities like creating multiple accounts and then rotate thru them every day just to play one specific merc… and then again, for another merc. They will just spend 10 bucks and be over with it.
In short, people who would result to such idiotic tactics(rotating accounts), dont intend to spend money on the game in the first place.
First of all rotation is random. Player have no idea who he would get tomorrow.
Second, There are more than 7 mercs in game… and wel be getting more.
Third, pretty much every1 have favourite mercs and if anything, daily rotation would increase sales, since players get to test mercs that they are not sure if they wannt to buy.
And most importantly, first impressions are often the best ones. So when player plays merc for a day and then next day merc is gone and there is no eta when it will come back, there is that much greater chance that player will decide to buy that merc, because it felt so great. Instead of holding back, with either credits or even real cash.
Absolute and utter nonsense.
First of all your argument is based on premise that player base is static, which is simply absurd, people are coming and people are going.
Considering that playerbase is a lifeblood for any online game, there will be always plenty of new players, who will use the crap out of free rotation.
And secondly, even with having mercs that he wannt, even older player, who dont own mercs that are currently in rotation, will try them out for 2 main reasons: 1. to get new experience, a feel for a merc and 2. to learn what merc can do, how it can be countered or supported.
[quote=“Szakalot;38822”]
And above all, I think its actually quite fun to see how those setups of 4 vassilis, or 4 sawbonez or 4 rhinos play out. Makes pubs for a different experience, with each next rotation.[/quote]
And herds of snipers or rhinos running around is anything but fun, it feels and looks horrible in context of gameplay.
Its one thing when we have 6 Skyhammers, they are free, so its purely a case poor judgement on those players part. But its completely another, when Nexon actually promotes such idiotic combos by creating fixed rotations.
Szakalot
(Szakalot)
#35
[quote=“Dirmagnos;39014”][quote=“Szakalot;38822”]
its not about them being morons or not lol, its about people that would otherwise (maybe) spend cash, not spending cash.
If you give people the choice of :
- pay money
- get the same stuff for free
what do you think people will do?
[/quote]
You mean, like playing game normally and then buying mercs with ingame credits they earn ? Like currently existing system, for free.
There is no point in worrying about players using multiple accounts if they will play game only for a few weeks, since they will have miniscule impact on game economy anyway.
And if they do intend to play it for a while, then sticking to one account is far better that making 10. Instead of having 10-15k creds on each, player will have enough on one to buy rather solind merc selection on one.
DB monetary system is as it should be in true F2P game, you pay real money for convenience.
Personalizing merc rotation and/or making switch daily instead of weekly, wont change that even a bit.[/quote]
there is definitely a possibility of casual gamer who just wants to see what they game has to offer: ‘ill play till i get to try everything’. Some of those would spend real $$$ to try out a merc they like. Some of those would circumvent spending and play for free, even though otherwise they might have payed.
There is one huge error in logic in this argument. You presume that all those 5% would spend any real money on the game, with or without multiple accounts. And your presumption that they all spend same amount of money.
I did not presume that at all. 5% of players is playing ‘for free’ even though they might have not. That is 5% less profit of whatever the percentage of players spends real cash.
Say 10% of players spends real money. this is DB’s entire income
If 5% of total (so also 5% of 10% - which constitutes 100% of income)) players won’t spend money… the profits will be smaller by 5%, umkay?
Talking statistics, were looking on more like 0.025% loss at the worst. People who normally spend notable sums on games(and im not talking about whales, 10-15 bucks a months is notable), wont bother with such absurdities like creating multiple accounts and then rotate thru them every day just to play one specific merc… and then again, for another merc. They will just spend 10 bucks and be over with it.
In short, people who would result to such idiotic tactics(rotating accounts), dont intend to spend money on the game in the first place.
source? to me it seems that some of the people that MIGHT spend money… won’t. its that simple
First of all rotation is random. Player have no idea who he would get tomorrow.
Second, There are more than 7 mercs in game… and wel be getting more.
alright, wasnt clear to me whether you meant 3 or 1 merc rotation.
Still a new merc to play everyday is little incentive to pay cash to get something new. Why bother paying if everytime you login you can play with something NEW for free?
Acquisition of NEW stuff is a very strong incentive in F2P games to layout $$$. If you tried ALL the mercs, you are less likely to pay cash for any of them. the magic and mystery of a purchase is gone.
Third, pretty much every1 have favourite mercs and if anything, daily rotation would increase sales, since players get to test mercs that they are not sure if they wannt to buy.
And most importantly, first impressions are often the best ones. So when player plays merc for a day and then next day merc is gone and there is no eta when it will come back, there is that much greater chance that player will decide to buy that merc, because it felt so great. Instead of holding back, with either credits or even real cash.
or maybe they will just jump into whatever is new, get bored with the game quickly and quit, after feeling like they ‘saw it all’.
2 week rotation actually allows players to explore the mercs on different maps/playstyles/enemy counters/team composition etc. I’ve been playing Fletcher for months now, and I still feel like I learn something new every second day.
Absolute and utter nonsense.
First of all your argument is based on premise that player base is static, which is simply absurd, people are coming and people are going.
its not as dynamic as you state either. Majority of playerbase is stable. Its not true that for every new player you have a veteran who goes away. Most of the players that leave are the players that played very little.
Players that like the game - stay. The longer the game is out, the higher the percentage of ‘stable’ players.
In half a year, the amount of ‘stable’ players - those who played for months, rather than weeks, will be much higher than now. Therefore, more players will have access to more mercs. Just like, the longer the game is out, the higher an average player level.
Considering that playerbase is a lifeblood for any online game, there will be always plenty of new players, who will use the crap out of free rotation.
And secondly, even with having mercs that he wannt, even older player, who dont own mercs that are currently in rotation, will try them out for 2 main reasons: 1. to get new experience, a feel for a merc and 2. to learn what merc can do, how it can be countered or supported.
they might as well try it out, but not swarm it the way that someone who only has skyhammer and aura will. Instead of seeing 5 naders per team for a week, you will maybe see a higher percentage of naders in the first day, and much more balanced teams in the following days.
And herds of snipers or rhinos running around is anything but fun, it feels and looks horrible in context of gameplay.
Its one thing when we have 6 Skyhammers, they are free, so its purely a case poor judgement on those players part. But its completely another, when Nexon actually promotes such idiotic combos by creating fixed rotations.
why are they idiotic?
I’d pick nader and blast those rhinos away. teams of 4 or more snipers are always hilariously steamrolled down. While it can be annoying to have bad composition on your team, you have no influence on the said composition. 4 rhinos aren’t more annoying than ‘no medics’ or ‘no engineers’ or ‘no ammo givers’. In the end its up to the individual players to care (or not)
scrub_lord
(scrub_lord)
#36
[quote=“srswizard;38638”]@Viquel imo it’s not a weak argument, at all.
If someone just wants to try out a merc, he could rotate through his accounts, to see if any of them has that exact merc on free rotation, instead of using credits or even real dosh, to unlock the merc.
With the current system, people are more likely to unlock mercs, because people like to have things now, not 2-6 weeks later.[/quote]
I don’t even see this being that much of a problem anyways. People should have a better way of testing out Mercs imo instead of waiting ages for 3 Mercs to rotate or spending money/credits with a purchase they aren’t sure of.
PlayingUndead
(PlayingUndead)
#37
Just to the add “what people will do to try out the game” point a little bit, I really don’t know much about this kinda economy balancing thing, but what I did and folks I know would do is pretty simple:
Research the Mercs/guess which one I want to play as in-game. Boot up the game. Aw, the Merc I want has to be unlocked. Alright, I’ll just play with what they give me for free then to see if I like the game enough to put in time or cash for the guy I want.
I could be wrong but I figured folks based whether or not they wanna put time into the game based on the core gameplay, not how their favorite class plays, but I’ll be honest I don’t play a lot of class based stuff so I could be wrong. Just my two cents, I’m not really making a point here.
Also, I know this probably sounds stupid but as a casual player I’ve appreciated the class spam purely because it’s helped me, well, forced me rather, to figure out different habits to deal with them at a faster rate than only seeing one every other game or whatever.
fetchingSeahorse
(fetchingSeahorse)
#38
The game is still in beta, so having weeks where some mercs see a lot of play is useful for seeing how the merc is balanced. Once balancing is done, this change might work better.
loftyMacaw
(loftyMacaw)
#39
how about, we make the mercs cost a less, (real money, maybe credits) then more people would buy them, few people will pay $10 for a merc, or make so that if you buy a merc you atleast you get the some loadouts at the current price. i personally think i would spend 3-4 dollars on a merc. I think a price reduction would benefit the consumers, and because of hopefully increased sales volume it will also benefit the devs.
IcySkyz
(IcySkyz)
#40
Although I understand where some players are coming from, proposing a random rotation system for each individual player, I honestly don’t think its a big enough problem to change the current system we have, especially if its possible for individuals to abuse.
We get Aura and Skyhammer as default, and by level 3? 4? we get enough credits from leveling to buy one of the 30k mercs. Thats 3 characters right there PLUS the 3 rotation characters. Its a player-based problem that your teammates/opponent in some matches decide to all play 1 character out of the 3 you take into your squad.
As time goes on, players will become more experienced and understand how spamming 1 character is not the best idea to complete objectives. Now I know some people are arguing that this spamming of characters is causing veterans to leave etc… but honestly as players, we don’t know that. We have no true statistics either than saying “I think” this is happening.
Now the next part is my own personal experience but lets be honest here… atleast 1/4 of the games I play in low level servers end up being determined in the first 2 min.
- Attackers complete first obj in 1 min, ppl leave, unbalanced 3 vs 7 teams
- Attackers get all killed in 1 min, players give up, leave, unbalanced 3 vs 7 teams
- Games starts with 4 vs 7, shuffle is down voted, no one switches over, everyone leaves
- Attacking team is less skilled, shuffle is down voted, Defenders push all the way to spawn camp
Saying that rotation ruins low level servers is really not the case as the mentality to “win” even in unfair circumstances is much more prevalent.