human vs bots

(kilL_888) #1

just rage quitted from a 4 human, 4 bots vs 8 human player match.

it’s so much fun, everytime. i love doing this over and over again, day after day. this is really one of my favorite apsects about brink.

the bots are so useful. you dont even recognize them as the superior ai they are. they fit seemingly. they actually make you belief you play with other human beeings. in fact, the opposite team doesnt recognize the ai as those. they keep playing in their team. they dont recognize they play against superior bots.

ah, nothing better than a good ole human vs bots. they add to the game.

if you read through the cynism, you probably find that there needs to be some change to this. if i would express my real feelings about bots here, i would probably get an instant, perma ban.

so long.

(its al bout security) #2

[QUOTE=kilL_888;352033]just rage quitted from a 4 human, 4 bots vs 8 human player match.

it’s so much fun, everytime. i love doing this over and over again, day after day. this is really one of my favorite apsects about brink.

the bots are so useful. you dont even recognize them as the superior ai they are. they fit seemingly. they actually make you belief you play with other human beeings. in fact, the opposite team doesnt recognize the ai as those. they keep playing in their team. they dont recognize they play against superior bots.

ah, nothing better than a good ole human vs bots. they add to the game.

if you read through the cynism, you probably find that there needs to be some change to this. if i would express my real feelings about bots here, i would probably get an instant, perma ban.

so long.[/QUOTE]

if you didnt realize this was getting patched then

(kilL_888) #3

[QUOTE=its al bout security;352036]if you didnt realize this was getting patched then
[/QUOTE]

whats going to get patched?

you mean “quote” ai improvment “quote”? help me, this jesus dude doesnt do all too well.

(Zarel) #4

Bots(or AI in general) are still far away from being spot on in emulating human way of thinking. If none can take out the “uncanney valley” in androids and photorealistic cgi’s, I still don’t believe they can make out a proper emulation on human-like AI interaction.

But still, I like multiplayer bots way better than 4-8 hours of linear campaign.

(kilL_888) #5

[QUOTE=Zarel;352041]Bots(or AI in general) are still far away from being spot on in emulating human way of thinking.
[/QUOTE]

thats exactly my point. but why do the server rules allow a team with, for instance, 4 bots 4 humans vs 8 humans? or even 2 human 6 bots vs 8 humans?

the result is clear. the bot team gets owned. its that simple. no arguments against it.

and aside from all my sarcasm i think thats a real issue. people get frustrated. they get forced to leave the match, because no human player will join the bot team. everybody knows how bad the bots are in comparison to humans. nobody wants to be on the loosing team. so, instead of balancing the teams, the last few humans from the bot team leave the server. leaving only bots. very soon, the other players leave, too. and we’re back in the server browser looking for populated games.

this is annoying and frustrating. i just had some nice rounds with nice people. but the rage quitters left space that got filled by bots. but i want to do some more rounds with those people. i cant meet them in the server browser though.

there needs to be change. that change would be balanced teams without bots, or a combination of max bots per team+balanced team.

in long term people wont go back to the server browser. they quit the game, tired of playing with useless bots. lot of people buy games for their multiplayer component. bots and multiplayer is a contradiction for me.

(SinDonor) #6

[QUOTE=Zarel;352041]Bots(or AI in general) are still far away from being spot on in emulating human way of thinking. If none can take out the “uncanney valley” in androids and photorealistic cgi’s, I still don’t believe they can make out a proper emulation on human-like AI interaction.

But still, I like multiplayer bots way better than 4-8 hours of linear campaign.[/QUOTE]

QFT. Also, I’d rather play with four bots than play 8vs4. At least the bots provide some assistance like buffs and can be cannon fodder aka a distraction.

I would like to see constantly-variable bot AI. If it’s 8 vs 4 humans, and the team of 8 is winning big, then ramp up the 4 bots’ AI a few notches until it’s a fair fight.

(kilL_888) #7

[QUOTE=SinDonor;352062]QFT. Also, I’d rather play with four bots than play 8vs4. At least the bots provide some assistance like buffs and can be cannon fodder aka a distraction.

I would like to see constantly-variable bot AI. If it’s 8 vs 4 humans, and the team of 8 is winning big, then ramp up the 4 bots’ AI a few notches until it’s a fair fight.[/QUOTE]

i would rather play 6vs6 humans.

bots destroy a multiplayer experience imho. bots are there for you when you are offline, so you can at least play. the real fun, the real idea behind multiplayer is the competition with and against other human players.

(Zarel) #8

[QUOTE=kilL_888;352061]thats exactly my point. but why do the server rules allow a team with, for instance, 4 bots 4 humans vs 8 humans? or even 2 human 6 bots vs 8 humans?

the result is clear. the bot team gets owned. its that simple. no arguments against it.

and aside from all my sarcasm i think thats a real issue. people get frustrated. they get forced to leave the match, because no human player will join the bot team. everybody knows how bad the bots are in comparison to humans. nobody wants to be on the loosing team. so, instead of balancing the teams, the last few humans from the bot team leave the server. leaving only bots. very soon, the other players leave, too. and we’re back in the server browser looking for populated games.

this is annoying and frustrating. i just had some nice rounds with nice people. but the rage quitters left space that got filled by bots. but i want to do some more rounds with those people. i cant meet them in the server browser though.

there needs to be change. that change would be balanced teams without bots, or a combination of max bots per team+balanced team.

in long term people wont go back to the server browser. they quit the game, tired of playing with useless bots. lot of people buy games for their multiplayer component. bots and multiplayer is a contradiction for me.[/QUOTE]

…why didn’t they add an “addbot” “kickbot” commands! SD, “addbot” and “kick/removebot” commands please. :slight_smile:

(xBluntxForce) #9

Ive said this a million times on the bethesda forums, but i really cannot think of any viable reason in starting multiPLAYER mode with bots. Ive got no problems with them filling peoples spots when they leave, but i don’t want to start a game 1v1 humans, and a million bots.

(Zarel) #10

Then set a proper amount of bots you want, or if you want to, take out the bots entirely. In freeplay, I think you can make a match with a set amount of bot-to-occupy-human per team(ranges from 0, having no bot, to 8, full amount of occupying bots per team) from custom settings on the custom match menu.

I often go with 4 minimum players per team on the smaller maps, like in the reactor.

Also, I don’t know if it’ll work but i’m currently playing with some “si_maxplayer”-related cvars to the game to take out, add in some bots during matches. I don’t know how it’ll also work/affect human players though.

(kilL_888) #11

my post isnt about setting up a server actually. i think the majority of people join a dedicated server if they play online.

most of them apparantly have bots enabled. and the problem with the servers that have bots disabled completely lack of the “balanced team” funtion.

i cant understand why elementary multiplayer functions that worked for decades didnt make it into brink. thats the main issue i would like to adress.

(Stormchild) #12

The bots are a double edged sword. It can diminish the impact when suddenly a bunch of dudes quit the game in the middle of the fight, but also, it can prevent the other team to realize that the balance got broken.
I usually say “if the bots weren’t there, it would be 8 vs 4. Come on, some switch team please, make the game interesting.”.

Especially when the bots, who can be ok in solo sometimes, get sometimes “stuck” in mp. Like standing there, doing nothing (guarding an area ?)… Although sometimes, THEY do the job better than humans (no operative to hack, no one wants to, the bot does it).

(FireWorks) #13

Most servers have botskill not on high (or whatever is max). That does make a large difference. Ask your server admin

(Je T´aime) #14

Im not a big of playng with bots in multiplayer but anyway.

But my main complain with the bots is that there should be a way of making the number of bots the same for both teams not one team with 7 bots and 1 human and the other team with 8 humans for example.

Also there should be a way of diferenciate a bot for a human, its kinda pointless spending your medic pips with a bot or risking your life reviving a bot for example. I dont care about helping out the bots, just the humans.

And maybe make reduce the default number of bots to 10, so we can have all humans and still some bots to enternain you if you are alone in the server.

(nephandys) #15

[QUOTE=Je T´aime;352326]Im not a big of playng with bots in multiplayer but anyway.

But my main complain with the bots is that there should be a way of making the number of bots the same for both teams not one team with 7 bots and 1 human and the other team with 8 humans for example.

Also there should be a way of diferenciate a bot for a human, its kinda pointless spending your medic pips with a bot or risking your life reviving a bot for example. I dont care about helping out the bots, just the humans.

And maybe make reduce the default number of bots to 10, so we can have all humans and still some bots to enternain you if you are alone in the server.[/QUOTE]
I’m not on PC so maybe it’s different for you guys, but bot names are pretty easy to recognize and are reused over and over. The bots name’s are always one single word with a capital letter at the front and don’t sound like anything an actual player would come up with (to me). Bot names tend to be like Smith, Fisher, Price, etc. (Fisher and Price are actual bot names btw lol) while GT’s tend to be like xxXCrazyDudeXxx. Therefore, I always know who’s a bot and who’s not.

By the same token it might be nice if bots had [bot] at the front of their name like it was in ETQW I believe.

Lastly and slightly OT, don’t get me wrong bots suck, but I was able to win a match last night 1v8 with only bots on my team and the other team full humans the whole round. (I don’t think this is how it usually goes down in such a scenario).

(AmishWarMachine) #16

[QUOTE=nephandys;352333]I’m not on PC so maybe it’s different for you guys, but bot names are pretty easy to recognize and are reused over and over. The bots name’s are always one single word with a capital letter at the front and don’t sound like anything an actual player would come up with (to me). Bot names tend to be like Smith, Fisher, Price, etc. (Fisher and Price are actual bot names btw lol) while GT’s tend to be like xxXCrazyDudeXxx. Therefore, I always know who’s a bot and who’s not.

By the same token it might be nice if bots had [bot] at the front of their name like it was in ETQW I believe.

Lastly and slightly OT, don’t get me wrong bots suck, but I was able to win a match last night 1v8 with only bots on my team and the other team full humans the whole round. (I don’t think this is how it usually goes down in such a scenario).[/QUOTE]

Kinda like they do in Black Ops (Combat Training), have the bots be a part of an [SD] or [bot] clan? Once clan support is implemented, that is.

I have seen a handful of bot names that could very well be usernames, but you’re right, for the most part they are pretty easy to discern from actual human player names. Still, would be nice for additional text, or some other form of immediately visual indication to make it a no-brainer.

EDIT: fixed a typo.

(thesuzukimethod) #17

[QUOTE=nephandys;352333]I’m not on PC so maybe it’s different for you guys, but bot names are pretty easy to recognize and are reused over and over. The bots name’s are always one single word with a capital letter at the front and don’t sound like anything an actual player would come up with (to me). Bot names tend to be like Smith, Fisher, Price, etc. (Fisher and Price are actual bot names btw lol) while GT’s tend to be like xxXCrazyDudeXxx. Therefore, I always know who’s a bot and who’s not.

By the same token it might be nice if bots had [bot] at the front of their name like it was in ETQW I believe.

Lastly and slightly OT, don’t get me wrong bots suck, but I was able to win a match last night 1v8 with only bots on my team and the other team full humans the whole round. (I don’t think this is how it usually goes down in such a scenario).[/QUOTE]

when i play randoms (and not in a more organized manner with people met on here, for ex) i tend to prefer to be on the team with 1-2 humans against the 6 because of the challenge. I’m not some super player who can carry the bot team either - i lose quite a bit, but when it comes time to play against 6-8 humans and i have 6-7 humans on my side (in the organized 8v8 matches), I’ve been practicing against humans in all their unpredictable and chaotic glory, and w/o strong human teammates to carry me (although they do tend to be pretty generous in their buffs, imh0)

Imbalance may be partially due to a revised setting in “standard”. at one point, they pulled big-teams and made standard 8v8 by default. it seems that this has switched back (now max 8 human players in standard 16 in big teams), so if a match is rolling and a few people join/drop and you end up with 6v2 (humans), unless 2 of the 6 switch, there’s no way the numbers will balance, b/c there’s no slots.

i could be wrong (happened many times before, will many times again)

(nephandys) #18

[QUOTE=thesuzukimethod;352338]when i play randoms (and not in a more organized manner with people met on here, for ex) i tend to prefer to be on the team with 1-2 humans against the 6 because of the challenge. I’m not some super player who can carry the bot team either - i lose quite a bit, but when it comes time to play against 6-8 humans and i have 6-7 humans on my side (in the organized 8v8 matches), I’ve been practicing against humans in all their unpredictable and chaotic glory, and w/o strong human teammates to carry me (although they do tend to be pretty generous in their buffs, imh0)

Imbalance may be partially due to a revised setting in “standard”. at one point, they pulled big-teams and made standard 8v8 by default. it seems that this has switched back (now max 8 human players in standard 16 in big teams), so if a match is rolling and a few people join/drop and you end up with 6v2 (humans), unless 2 of the 6 switch, there’s no way the numbers will balance, b/c there’s no slots.

i could be wrong (happened many times before, will many times again)[/QUOTE]
Unless things changed today on 360 there was originally Standard which was 8v8. They cut that back to 8 humans and 8 bots due to lag and created the Big Team option which was the same as standard was before. More recently they simply eliminated the Big Teams option and returned Standard to the 8v8 all human mode it was originally. As of last night for me there is still no Big Teams option and Standard is 8v8 with no cap on the number of humans.

Is it different on PS3 for some reason? or did it change since my playing last night?

(thesuzukimethod) #19

[QUOTE=nephandys;352346]Unless things changed today on 360 there was originally Standard which was 8v8. They cut that back to 8 humans and 8 bots due to lag and created the Big Team option which was the same as standard was before. More recently they simply eliminated the Big Teams option and returned Standard to the 8v8 all human mode it was originally. As of last night for me there is still no Big Teams option and Standard is 8v8 with no cap on the number of humans.

Is it different on PS3 for some reason? or did it change since my playing last night?[/QUOTE]

my understanding is that big teams disappeared briefly on Ps3 at the same time it went away on 360 (and for the same reason, standard had 8v8). but by the time i got back on to play, big teams was back (in the menu options, was still there as of friday), and while the framework/settings for standard appears to allow 8v8, the total number of humans in a standard match always seems <8 (or exactly 8).

i really dont know other than big teams is def still an option on ps3, and it does seem to be the only reliable place to find 8v8. SD folks, perhaps a clarification?

(nephandys) #20

[QUOTE=thesuzukimethod;352350]my understanding is that big teams disappeared briefly on Ps3 at the same time it went away on 360 (and for the same reason, standard had 8v8). but by the time i got back on to play, big teams was back (in the menu options, was still there as of friday), and while the framework/settings for standard appears to allow 8v8, the total number of humans in a standard match always seems <8 (or exactly 8).

i really dont know other than big teams is def still an option on ps3, and it does seem to be the only reliable place to find 8v8. SD folks, perhaps a clarification?[/QUOTE]
That’s really weird as like I said it’s not on 360. We’ve been running full 8v8’s with no problems in standard since they got rid of the Big Teams option.