How to balance Vassili 101 + good patch notes that actually make senes

(fubar) #121

Kek10 and Sniper OP? Better nerf crotzni.

(ragnak) #122

But they showed you the charts, wouldnt you nerf crotzi after seeing how bluntly overpowered it was?!

(fubar) #123

How dare I question the legitimacy of echo stats that compares ASSAULT classes versus OBJECTIVE classes.

I mean, we all know the best aimers on a team are always playing engineers, right…? Thank god for echo overlord to remind us of how important accuracy is. I’ll try to remember that the next time I mindlessly preshoot corners or fire my gun at E.Vs/Generators. Gotta prioritize getting high accs.

(DarkangelUK) #124

[QUOTE=chickenNwaffles;537239]Well, Splash Damge thinks they are improving the guns by reducing spread and recoil by 5%, so I’m not sure what you expect.

They don’t know how to balance the guns in the game, and refuse to listen to people who actually are good at the game; instead they do what they did today - which isn’t necessarily bad, it’s still far from good.[/QUOTE]

They are listening to good players, they’re just not listening to you because you’re an asshole. They’re not listening to me either because I’m not good enough, but then again I’m not as much of an asshole either so it balances out.

At the end of the day mate, i’m sure you have some great input. There’s no denying that you’re a good player and have some good insight from that perspective, but the fact that you’re an absolute massive wanker probably makes them not want to listen or interact with you. Drop the ego, drop the attitude, gain some manners and you may get somewhere… if that’s too much to ask then just don’t even bother cos no one likes a c*nt.

(fubar) #125

[QUOTE=DarkangelUK;537249]They are listening to good players, they’re just not listening to you because you’re an asshole. They’re not listening to me either because I’m not good enough, but then again I’m not as much of an asshole either so it balances out.

At the end of the day mate, i’m sure you have some great input. There’s no denying that you’re a good player and have some good insight from that perspective, but the fact that you’re an absolute massive wanker probably makes them not want to listen or interact with you. Drop the ego, drop the attitude, gain some manners and you may get somewhere… if that’s too much to ask then just don’t even bother cos no one likes a c*nt.[/QUOTE]

So, you’re implying the entirety of the competitive scene gets ignored because of how much of an asshole chickenNwaffles is? :slight_smile:

(ragnak) #126

freaking chickenNwaffles its all his fault that they didnt nerf vassili, let this be a lesson for you, you asshole.

(DarkangelUK) #127

You quoted me then didn’t even read it properly

They are listening to good players, they’re just not listening to you

(fubar) #128

I have yet to see any of that. There’s 3 major topics the “good players” have been pushing for in the past months. Neither of which have been addressed or even just remotely hinted at in any patch, ever.

Who are these mysterious “good players” you speak of? I can convincingly say they aren’t part of any of the top teams or players I’ve encountered in this game.

(DarkangelUK) #129

[QUOTE=fubar;537257]I have yet to see any of that. There’s 3 major topics the “good players” have been pushing for in the past months. Neither of which have been addressed or even just remotely hinted at in any patch, ever.

Who are these mysterious “good players” you speak of? I can convincingly say they aren’t part of any of the top teams or players I’ve encountered in this game.[/QUOTE]

I’m just parrying what SD have said on this very forum, why don’t you ask them? I know smooth and others converse quite a bit on the DB sub reddit, they’ve spoken to players in the DB IRC channel… sorry but I don’t keep track of who they converse with and what’s discussed, and well, neither do you quite frankly.

(fubar) #130

Let’s break down today’s patch notes a little shall we?

Nader

Increased health to 120hp (from 110hp)
Reduced movement speed by ~2.5%

Where is this even coming from? What constitute this change? Can we have some freaking information or glimpse into your thought process? This was completely unjustified and unneeded.

Skyhammer

Airstrike Markers will now always deal damage when they first detonate
Increased cooldown when failing to call in an Airstrike to 20s (from 15s)
Reduced Airstrike Marker detonation radius by ~10%

So, you effectively nerfed the only merc that was truly, down to the core, balanced in this game. Makes… sense. Again, thought process? information? Why? Where is any of this coming from…

Sparks

Increased Med Pack healing amount to 30hp (from 25hp)
Increased the battery charge of the REVIVR so it takes ~10% longer to drain

Alright, at this point you’re just making stuff up because you want to throw a bunch of numbers into the notes, right? I mean… this is really just your way of going “LOOK, WE DID A THING!”

M4A1 Assault Rifle

Reduced effective range by ~5%

BR-16 AR

Reduced bullet spread by ~5%
Reduced recoil kick by ~5%

Stark AR

Reduced bullet spread by ~5%
Reduced recoil kick by ~5%

Timik-47 AR

Reduced bullet spread by ~5%
Reduced recoil kick by ~5%

Stop. Touching. Gun. Accuracies. It’s not the imaginary “recoil” or accuracies on a gun that makes them useful/useless. Most especially not 5%. These changes literally affect NOTHING at all. You’re doing it again, “HEY GUYS… LOOK, A THING!”

Dreiss AR

Reduced recoil kick by ~10%

Dreiss has recoil? :smiley:

K-121 MG

Increased magazine size to 55 (from 50)
Reduced spread increase rate by ~10%

So, we’re back to the exact same initial k121 you nerfed so hard into the ground because of how “overpowered” it was according to your echo stats. Makes perfect sense.

Hey, has anyone ever told you the reason no one uses the k121 over the m4? It’s not because of the gun.

hint look at the loadouts hint

Hollunds 880

Increased effective range by ~25%

Remburg 7

Reduced pellet spread by ~8%

Ahnuhld-12 Shotgun

Increased effective range by ~50%

Oh great, shotgun buffs. Because those weren’t ridiculously strong already in first place. How desperate are you to force them into competitive play?

SMG-9

Reduced bullet spread by ~5%
Reduced recoil kick by ~5%

… ? Are we changing things for the sheer purpose of having changed a thing? SMG9’s issue was NOT the “recoil” (what recoil?) or it’s accuracy you seem to love touching so much. You could have increased either by 15%, it still wouldn’t see the light of the day. Kinda what happens if you design maps and spawntimes around medium to long ranged gun encounters, then decide to give the gun immense fall off damage.

Hochfir SMG

Reduced recoil kick by ~10%

Heh. Recoil. I get it. Funny.

Crotzni SMG

Increased starting bullet spread by ~10%
    This is due to the Crotzni being slightly more powerful than other SMG's.

More powerful… as in… used by more players, right? I mean, echo would know. Hey guys, I have an idea. Let’s compare collected echo stats of the 5000 players using a crotzni vs the 500 of the Kek10. Also, let’s disregard the mercs associated with the guns.

Hey look, we did another thing.

All Melee Weapons

Removed the turn speed limit from Primary Attacks (ie slashes) for all melee weapons

Oh hey, something useful! But wait. Why the **** was there turn speed in the game to begin with?

Kukri Knife

Extended the Kukri's melee collision box to improve its range

Are you saying it’s not a tooth pick anymore? Wow. Amazing. You did a thing. I bet we’re going to see Redeyes everywhere now!

General Gameplay

Updated 4-second Spawn Point invulnerability - If a player fires, they are dropped to a 50% damage shield rather than losing it entirely
    This change does not impact medic revives

Oh my. Oh gosh. I don’t think you quite realize HOW LONG 4 SECONDS ARE. Gratz, you just managed to give defenders an even bigger advantage. Well done.

Arty

Moved Artillery Targeter further from the camera when held in first-person

Hey, that’s cool. Maybe in the next patch we can make Arty viable.

Fletcher

Moved Sticky-Bomb Detonator further from the camera when held in first-person

Oh sweet! I bet sometime around the next 15 patches we may just finally have sticky mines fixed. I mean, obviously 5 out of 10 stickies disappearing and not dealing any damage is not an issue.

Redeye

Fixed bug where IR Goggles could occasionally not be enabled
Fixed bug where some items could continue to glow white after IR Goggles have been disabled
Fixed bug where Smoke Grenade could block delivery of Carryable Objectives

That’s cool. But when are going to get an actual smoke grenade in the game? You know, something that actually… blocks view rather than be a mere inconvenience.

(DarkangelUK) #131

You should post this in the patch notes thread where the discussion is happening, this thread is Vassili balance discussion apparently. Maybe also look up the advice I gave waffles, it may help :slight_smile:

http://forums.warchest.com/showthread.php/45802-Fine-Tuning-Update-v48857-19-08-2015

(Anti) #132

Closing this thread now, getting way too personal.

For the record I spoke to a couple of ‘pro’ snipers tonight (since I have to broadcast this now rather than do it in private as always :tongue:). They had interesting thoughts on why they think Vassili is OP and how to fix it. Neither agreed with each other or waffles’ suggestions on how to address it, so yeaaa… there were some interesting ideas though.

I’ll point out that both were kind of frustrated others attribute views to them that they don’t actually hold. A lot of people posting on behalf of others who they don’t apparently speak to much actually just serves to make feedback messy and make it harder to draw the right conclusions from what the ‘community’ is asking for. Maybe we can come up with a better avenue for that stuff in future to cut out some of the, erm, ‘noise’…

:goliathspin: