How steep must a hill be that you cannot climb it anymore?

(CooperHawkes) #1

In the ongoing research to improve FATE I am looking for the exact amount of steepness that defines the borderline between climbable and non-climbable slopes. I need the values (e.g. angle to horizontal plane) for both walking and running up a hill.
I know, I can get these values myself by binary try and error search… However, I prefer some expert opinion on the real limits. I am no trick jumper, and I guess there are many people out there that are able to climb up steeper hills than I will ever dream of :wink:

(]UBC[ McNite) #2

I think its 45° that s the limit.
If you look at that, plz make it the way it is implemented in EasyGen: it highlights all triangles to steep for a player in a transparent yellow, there is a button for that.

The thing about “trickclimbing” usually is not that there is a way to get up a plane which is steeper, but that the player is using the edge of a brush to “climb” on. Have a look at the pics: Pic 1 shows a part of the front wall of my map TheRiver II Redux, but there is a cut in the brush. Although the both burshes are way too steep to climb up on them, a playermodel can actually stand on the hem of those 2 brushes.

The brush in the background is how they r done for the map, to prevent the possibility of playermodels standing on them (or jumping down unharmed using those hems).

Some popular examples of where you can “trickclimb” on hems are:
radar side entrance: some players can “climb” up the side entrance on the left side with enough speed;
braundorf_b2: climbing the terrain on the left side at the side door so Allies can get through the window and to the command post without blowing up the door

This is an example of how to create a “difficult” climb on a terrain (taken from my map The River II): It is enough to have terrain triangles with a 45° steepness only touching on a corner to actually make the terrain climbable. Something like this is easy to create in EasyGen. In radiant you have to do a dozen of fast compiles (without LIGHT stage) to tweak the result.

Something for the wishlist for FATE: Would it be possible for the mapper to choose between your honeycomb-structure and simple cube-split-diagonally-structure (like EasyGen does the terrain)? I really think that while your idea is creative and may provide smoother curved terrain, that the old-fashioned triangles are a lot better to work with when manually honing the terrain and adapting it to buildings etc.

(CooperHawkes) #3

thanx for that extensive answer McNite… much appreciated.
I’ll play around with the 45 degree limit…
however, I was too stupid to climb up the slope at radar :frowning: at least I can do the jump to the constructible mg in battery :slight_smile: I guess the princible of this jump is the same as in your first picture.

(Shaderman) #4

I think so :wink:

(CooperHawkes) #5

@Shaderman: hehe :slight_smile:

I accomplished some experiments… the limit doesn’t seem to be exactly 45 degrees, but somewhere around 45.6.
One might expect 45.5 because of some integer arithmetic involved… but this is not the case.
To be more precise: I created a slope of ratio 256 : 261 (261 is the height)… this is 45.55 degrees and still climbable easily.
256:262 (45.66 degrees) is not climbable any more (well… with some speed you still manage to get up such a hill for some while)

maybe ET just checks if the z component of the face normal is less than 0.7 (instead of the exact sqrt(2)/2 = 0.7071068)… if this is the case, the limit is 45.573 degrees

(carnage) #6

umm a lil surgestion from a thing i though abotu using but nevver acatuly implemeted

your FATE could make two sets of shaders the sets of shaders are the same but one has the slippy peram then ppl can place this on slopes they dont want climing. perhaps could help stop a few ppl determined to go where they should not

(]UBC[ McNite) #7

perhaps could help stop a few ppl determined to go where they should not

For those areas i make the terrain too steep or clip it. I think it would be weird if there s an area you should be able to walk on but feels like ice. It would need at least a different texture too, so you can visually differentiate between walkable and non-walkable terrain surface.