Fragger desperately needs a nerf

(titan) #21

Competitive players know nothing… um?? Ye the people who play it the most and push mercs to their limits are the ones least qualified to talk about balance. Okay let’s just play an imbalanced game then, congrats all we did it enjoy your pub game, meanwhile match making has zero players searching i wonder why. Future looks bright indeed for db.

(Nail) #22

there’s an average of 200 people playing these days, how much match making do you think is even possible, pub stars are playing, the “pros” are waving their arms and stamping their feet demanding answers

(titan) #23

Ok your right I’m of course exaggerating how much fraggers op-ness is affecting match making in an already dead game but the point remains that competitive players are without a doubt the most qualified to talk about balance particularly in a game which is being marketed as a competitive PC game and seeing lines like “Currently lots of people just run around shooting, trying to be succesfull.” is so far from the conversation we’re tryna have in this thread you can only pray SD are smart enough to weed out who knows what theyre talking about and who doesn’t.

(Nail) #24

sorry this ain’t my quote
“Currently lots of people just run around shooting, trying to be succesfull.”

nor is it my belief

(titan) #25

I know, that was in regard to me saying pub players opinion on balance is basically worthless, but you do believe ‘competitive players know jack’ right? :slight_smile:
The nerf is inevitable anyway there’s some quality threads on the nexon forum with quotes like
“It feels like only fraggers are allowed to have fun in comp right now, it’s awful.” and
“We started doing pugs/10 mans without fraggers. Pugs are a lot more fun now without all the bs fragger brings to the meta.”

Keep defending him anyway, just know that you are wrong.

(Nail) #26

not defending Fragger, not a merc I’d play, defending SD’s ability to sort it without having to appease foot stompers

(fubar) #27

It’s ironic how titan declares himself as competitive player and invalidates the input of others, given that few of the people that disagree with him, in this very thread, continuously destroy him in “competitive matches”. :wink:

As said, fragger is fine. I’m not a huge fan of the K121, it’s strong but it has obvious disadvantages as well. I use a M4 myself, Explodydendron is just too strong not to have, especially with the middle to long range shooting layout most maps and stages have. Aside from that, I’ll repeat what I said countless times before… Reduce travel speed time of nades. It’s literally the only thing that needs to be done, silly having a character throw nades as fast and far as a grenade launcher would. Literally all the whine surrounding grenades would cease entirely.

(Szakalot) #28

[QUOTE=fubar;525471]It’s ironic how titan declares himself as competitive player and invalidates the input of others, given that few of the people that disagree with him, in this very thread, continuously destroy him in “competitive matches”. :wink:

As said, fragger is fine. I’m not a huge fan of the K121, it’s strong but it has obvious disadvantages as well. I use a M4 myself, Explodydendron is just too strong not to have, especially with the middle to long range shooting layout most maps and stages have. Aside from that, I’ll repeat what I said countless times before… Reduce travel speed time of nades. It’s literally the only thing that needs to be done, silly having a character throw nades as fast and far as a grenade launcher would. Literally all the whine surrounding grenades would cease entirely.[/QUOTE]

  • reduce flying speed
  • prevent cooking-cancel
(Bloodbite) #29

last time I played Dome and twiddling about on one of those map mounted guns… Fragger was the one I focused on if I had multiple targets… that boy is a big, slow moving bullet sponge.

(Glottis-3D) #30

[QUOTE=Szakalot;525487]- reduce flying speed

  • prevent cooking-cancel[/QUOTE]

this will definitely help.
the damage potential will still be there, but ppl will have to realy know the moment for the nade.

this will increase skill ceiling (more presice timing, more map-awareness, travel times etc.)

win-win situation!

(Humbugsen) #31

[QUOTE=Szakalot;525487]- reduce flying speed

  • prevent cooking-cancel[/QUOTE]

yes but it needs to take longer to cook a grenade too. You should be able to rush and kill the fragger if he decides to take a grenade in fight without cover
and activate friendly fire finally… the game is unplayable without ff
so much spam and no risk in it at all…

played 1match yesterday and 1 today, had to ragequit after some minutes because of fragger

(Neo_TA) #32

does anyone else not think that fraggers body shots are too strong from far range no recoil shots?

(INF3RN0) #33

I do. He needs reduced body shot damage indeed, and more recoil to justify the high headshot damage. I believe the k121 has some of the best long ranged fall-off scaling of all the non-snipers/semis as well. It doesn’t take comp/pub/etc to look at the stats of the weapon and then use it in game and realize just how strong it is compared to everything else without any significant disadvantage.

Nades are a separate topic alltogether though, but people already know my views on that. The issue isn’t the amount of nades or the c/d, but the simple fact that with such a large explosive radius you are rarely punished for making mistakes or throwing it poorly. The nade is simply way too consistent with the cooking mechanic compared to all other abilities and that is the issue that needs to be addressed.

(Runeforce) #34

You could have the grenade cooldown tied to the number of Fraggers on the team. Like the field ops fire support reload cooldown time from previous games.

(Zenity) #35

In most games I know the MG is a bit of a joke, which makes up for large magazines and spammability with poor overall efficiency.

But Fragger’s MG is an absolute beast, the latest changes don’t seem to have affected it all that much. So the question is, is this intentional? Is he supposed to wreck everything with no noticeable weakness at any distance or any situation? If not, then I think he still needs some work.

At first I thought he was supposed to wreak havoc because of his name (in which case I would have rather seen his health reduced), but then a dev said that he’s supposed to be more tanky. If that’s the case, then the MG is still way too effective IMO.

Aside from further adjusting damage and accuracy, perhaps another thing that could be explored for the K-121 is the time it takes to raise or lower it. Right now it’s so easy to switch between knife and MG, that its speed penalty is almost inconsequential. By making it much slower to switch to or from the MG, Fragger would have to make more of a commitment and would become more vulnerable to being outmanoeuvred. Just a thought.

(POKEMANS) #36

[QUOTE=Szakalot;525487]- reduce flying speed

  • prevent cooking-cancel[/QUOTE]

Yet another quote of these points in hope of them getting noticed.

(prophett) #37

One possible solution would be a single nade. Just throwing it out there :confused:

(spookify) #38

If anything I would lower the K121’s Body shot Damage 1 point.

He is the Killer! It is what he does… If you nerf his gun anymore Sawbones and other mercs will catch up and rage.

As for his nades I really dont care where SD goes with them but dont touch the timing and cooking. It very similar to other games.

The gravity and bounciness of the nades might need to be looked at to give them a little weight but that’s about it.

IMO this game is going to change sooo much in the coming months so people just need to sit back and enjoy the ride as I have been doing for 2.5 years!

Side Note: Maybe some people also need to get out of the 8v8 Objective servers and into the smaller 6v6 pub SW servers. “IF” those servers are balanced then its a really good feeling pub.

I think my bigger concern with the game is rag-doll bodies and the crazy amount of bullets to gib them. I can see 3 HS gibs and 1 knife but 20+ body shots with some guns is crazy…

(Szakalot) #39

I think there was already a silent nerf to cooking, somehow it feels 0.2-0.5second longer

(spookify) #40

Single Nade with Cool-down reduction for taking ammo packs?

Not many teams are running sky-hammers or Artys on maps, other then EV maps…

SD needs to give us a reason not to run 2 Fraggers in a 5v5…

People keep talking nerf nerf nerf well how about buff others so teamwork and game play out weighs the need for a nerf.

If you do that people will still run two fraggers. Killing is the name of the game…
Fragger
Fragger
Sky or Arty
Medic
Engy

Just wait for other mercs to come…

Bridger pump stage with an Aura and a merc to be named later is crazy… You will need the fragger to break that…

So settle down people because there’s more to come!