Finalizing the Core Mechanics (weapons/movement).

(stealth6) #21

That would be pretty cool, or just the sound of somebody breathing behind you.

(iwound) #22

nice… or both.

regarding speed. my preference is speed is good atm maybe a tad on the jump. but just restrict the movement while firing greatly. at least enough so i can hit someone :wink:

it was ok in etqw wasnt it? have great movement or fight, just not both at the same time.

(Ashog) #23

Since good things have been already mentioned :tongue: (also by me in a diff. thread), here are some, on my opinion, still imperfect thingies:

More speed and accelleration are needed for strafe.
Please nerf knives ASAP!
RoF still too high.
Classes should move at different speeds, at least some. Soldier too fast currently, regarding the firepower he carries (see iwound post).
Airstrike still a joke.
EV too fat - we need tools to damage it - airstrike, bullets and grenades do little damage to it, especially since there’s only 1 grenade per spawn.
Grenade physics feels still a bit strange (see Apples post).
Spawns still too short (but this is for another thread I guess).

Can’t judge jumping and sprint/reload story - needs more testing time. Was busy mainly shooting around and trying not to die from knives and snipers :slight_smile:

(INF3RN0) #24

What do people think of this?

-Reduced RoF
-Higher Headshot damage
-Creep spread begins after 15 bullets have been fired
-Creep spread receeds at a faster rate
-Reduction to strafing hip-fire spread at mid-range

Anti seems intent on having some sort of bursting be included in the game. I understand the reason being that the player with the better initial accuracy will gain advantage over the sprayer. The issue here is that bursting is a very bad tactic in the game at the moment, which makes the creep feel like a completely annoying and unattractive feature. The TTK in body shots vs bursting at the head in strafe is completely unbalanced. The gain in accuracy just is not enough to make anyone want to do anything but hold fire. On the other hand bursting in such small increments in a game like DB just feels awful and is bound to get a ton of negative remarks the more forceful the game makes it. There’s a ton of problems that encompass trying to include a burst fire mechanic in the game, which is that it makes it near impossible to kill more than 2-3 people in a single clip with perfect aim if engaged all at once. The way that firefights play out make it almost impossible for someone to burst down multiple people with headshots; especially with medics around to revive. I personally felt that ETQW was the perfect work-around to burst firing, where instead stances and positioning played a much more important role than weapon control. Now if creep spread were to stay in DB, then the first thing I would do in order to make this intended burst fire mechanic actually work would be to first reduce the RoF and increase the headshot damage. From there I think that the bursting rate would need to be adjusted accordingly in order to allow someone to kill up to 4 enemies in one clip in a reasonable amount of time; bursting atm is made just for 1v1s at mid range and even then the strafe spread just is too high for it to matter. Again the only way this could even begin to work is if the RoF was lowered so that players could have more control over the weapons. I still find this feature almost too troublesome to even be part of the game, but if it has to be there then we best be thinking of how to make it work while there’s still time.

(DarkangelUK) #25

I’d be happy to try that, seems fine to me.

(light_sh4v0r) #26

+1 on the odd grenade arc.

(stealth6) #27

I don’t agree on higher headshot damage, as long as the creep is reduced I don’t think hs damage will be a problem. 15 bullets until spread increase seems like a lot, but I would like to try it.
Agree on the other points, especially reduced RoF! I see comments all the time reduce RoF, reduce RoF. I saw in the echo trailer that the aim was 1 clip per kill. When you try to hold a doorway this = a bad time. With reduced RoF I’d miss less bullets (or at least that’s what I think) and will be able to get 1.5-2 kills out of 1 mag using pistol to finish off the second.

(Kendle) #28

I’d certainly like to see DB implement a good burst firing mechanism. RTCW had this but it was kinda lost in ET and subsequent SD games.

However, surely the way to promote burst firing is to make the time it takes for spread to increase (when firing) and / or reduce (when you stop firing) shorter, so tapping the fire button rather than holding it down gives greater accuracy overall.

Increasing the damage for headshots would promote better aim, which is good, but I’m not sure how it promotes burst firing over full auto, unless your assumption is you’d score more headshots due to the greater accuracy?

Reducing ROF is understandable because there are many ET players here, but tbh I’d favour increasing it, or increasing damage. Again the difference between RTCW and ET (and later SD games) is the TTK in RTCW is considerably shorter, which favours players with better initial aim and reaction times, and I for one would much rather have RTCW’s gun-play than ET’s.

(Mustang) #29

I think they’re mostly talking about reducing RoF for the feel, then bump up damage a little to compensate.

Although Anti has mentioned that it’s not “possible” to do right now, due to them not wanting to re-record the gun audio.

A high TTK is what makes the fun for me, it introduces movement and gunplay into the fight, otherwise it’s too much “he who shoots first wins”.

(stealth6) #30

The audio doesn’t match up already. :confused:

(DarkangelUK) #31

Initially I was against a low TTK, though I always favoured RtCW’s style over everything else. After seeing inferno’s stats, I think I’ve just become accustomed over the years to a gradually increasing TTK without even realising it, hence I’d like to head back down the way to RtCW level.

(tokamak) #32

ET has a pretty short TTK, but somehow feels much less frantic and random than DB. If it’s not the lethality then what exactly is it?

(Mustang) #33

I think you’re just getting old. :penguin:

(Kendle) #34

Ditto, although for me it’s slightly different. I got used to ET’s long TTK, thought it was the way games were meant to be, then played DOD and got anally shafted big time! And now, after getting used to that kind of unforgiving gameplay I feel like going back to ET is like trading in my assault rifle for a pea-shooter.

At the end of the day tho it’s about what’s right for the game. Guns that kill too quickly favour the defender (who’s usually waiting for you to come to him), which is why DOD’s guns (for example) wouldn’t really work in an objective mode game. However IMHO ET has gone too far down the low damage / slow ROF road. I’d like to get back to RTCW, which pretty much invented the objective game mode after all. :slight_smile:

(Apples) #35

I’m all for a long time to kill, I want to aim, not who sees first win the fight, I’m a bit extreme on that usually, but I like quake way more than CoD ^^

I know there are many things that fall inbetween these two games tho, but I rather a quakish style (tracking wise) than a CoD one

(tokamak) #36

A long TTK does drastically reduce the potential for killing streaks. That’s what I love about games with high lethality, a player in the right place at the right time AND with the right idea and skillset can mow down an entire team. In objective based games that’s just one of the most satisfying things possible.

(Ashog) #37

I don’t agree that higher TTK decreases potential for killing streaks. You might have got that feeling because objective play doesn’t really stimulate streaks necessarily.

I also am convinced (see stealth’s post) that when the RoF and creep gets decreased, the HS damage must not be increased, it will be compensated by better aim due to better tracking and lower spread. 3.5 HS to kill are imho optimal.

(INF3RN0) #38

The ETQW ratio between TTK body shots vs headshots is what made those fire fights so entertaining and skillful, along with the fairly slower RoF.

(Ashog) #39

Yeah. Agree, but there is always a message from someone that this is subjective :slight_smile:

(INF3RN0) #40

Anyone who just got in Alpha, I encourage you to please post your feedback here after you’ve had some time to get used to the game. We probably won’t see any major changes until more people speak up.