Few Suggestions

(savvyBanquet) #1

These are just my suggestions based off other FPS games I played and being a big Wolfenstien ET fan.

Class Limits: Hate to say this class limits are needed. Although it don’t happen all the time but in a 6vs6 game seeing 6 skyhmaeers, 6 rhinos, etc leads to a bad game. To me they did not think this one out. There should be limits like Wolfenstien ET had in place. Also this will improve teamwork since this is supposed to be a teamwork sort of game but there is a lack of it. This leads me to my second suggestion.

Character Limit: The fact you can only take 3 characters with you per match is a horrible idea. You should be able to access all characters you purchased and change to anyone simply by opening a menu and choosing who you want. This along with class restrictions will lead to more balanced gameplay.

Character Classifications: Each character should be classified as either attacker, heavy, support, engineer. Heavy should be characters like Rhino. Each match lets say 6vs6 1-2 engineers, 1-2 medics, 2 attackers, 1 Heavy. At all times there should always be one support and one engineer. This is subject to change based on the objective meaning if there is nothing to fix you will be allowed to switch to an attacker/support.

Character Training: Have training for new players to show them how to play each classification. If you do the support training it will show you the basics of how to play support. It should also teach you the differences between each support class Aura, Sparks, etc.

Also there can be modes lets say team death match where there are no limits to who you can choose.

(Yes) #2
  1. This isn’t good with randoms, it works fine in DirtyCups, just because those are teams where everyone knows each other and they communicate who does which role.

How would you feel if someone was playing as your favourite merc or someone was in a role and performing really poorly?

  1. The point of the squad limit is that you have to budget in which mercs you want and make the tough choice of who to not take. It would be pretty crap if everyone could take a merc to fill in each role, it would inspire even less team work.

  2. These already exist. [list]
    [] Engineer - Fletcher, Proxy, Bushwhacker and Turtle
    [    ] Medic - Sawbonez, Aura, Sparks and Phoenix
    [] Fire Support - Arty, Kira, Skyhammer and Stoker
    [    ] Assault - Fragger, Nader, Rhino and Thunder
    [*] Recon - Vassili, Phantom, RedEye and Aimee
    [/list]

  3. The best training is to just jump into a public match.

(titaniumCrouton) #3

[quote=“Clown;59445”]1. This isn’t good with randoms, it works fine in DirtyCups, just because those are teams where everyone knows each other and they communicate who does which role.

How would you feel if someone was playing as your favourite merc or someone was in a role and performing really poorly?

  1. The point of the squad limit is that you have to budget in which mercs you want and make the tough choice of who to not take. It would be pretty crap if everyone could take a merc to fill in each role, it would inspire even less team work.

  2. These already exist. [list]
    [] Engineer - Fletcher, Proxy, Bushwhacker and Turtle
    [    ] Medic - Sawbonez, Aura, Sparks and Phoenix
    [] Fire Support - Arty, Kira, Skyhammer and Stoker
    [    ] Assault - Fragger, Nader, Rhino and Thunder
    [*] Recon - Vassili, Phantom, RedEye and Aimee
    [/list]

  3. The best training is to just jump into a public match.[/quote]

Pretty much this. But that said I’ve been begging for a new game mode that has character limits. Something like a pick/ban phase and you have to have X amount of mercs unlocked…idk. just something so we can have the choice…

Twice today I’ve gone against 6 bushwhackers. It’s been a frustrating mess both times XP.

(savvyBanquet) #4

@Clown said:

  1. This isn’t good with randoms, it works fine in DirtyCups, just because those are teams where everyone knows each other and they communicate who does which role.

How would you feel if someone was playing as your favourite merc or someone was in a role and performing really poorly?

  1. The point of the squad limit is that you have to budget in which mercs you want and make the tough choice of who to not take. It would be pretty crap if everyone could take a merc to fill in each role, it would inspire even less team work.

  2. These already exist. * Engineer - Fletcher, Proxy, Bushwhacker and Turtle

  • Medic - Sawbonez, Aura, Sparks and Phoenix
  • Fire Support - Arty, Kira, Skyhammer and Stoker
  • Assault - Fragger, Nader, Rhino and Thunder
  • Recon - Vassili, Phantom, RedEye and Aimee
  1. The best training is to just jump into a public match.
  1. Many games that have class limits there was some communication but still very little to none. Played Wolfesntien ET for years no one communicated roles for pugs if something was locked i choose to be something else that the team needed. The game was far more balanced then this. Let alone shuffling teams was common.

If someone performed poorly can always just talk to the person and get him/her to switch. If they don’t well tell them what there doing wrong so they get better.

The point being like many games you can’t just be good at one character you need to be good at multiple characters for different situations.

Not only that how is it any different now? my favorite is skyhammer i’m like yea im going to play skyhammer get into the match not a single engineer. So forced to either loose or switch up anyways (which i do not have a problem with). It really is like that a lot of games where people are forced to play someone else to win or they know the outcome will be a loss.

  1. How are limits a good things? majority of FPS games have no limits and you can change anytime and they worked without issues. This is like the first FPS game i played that had a character limit. As for it promoting less teamwork i disagree it really would not change. I would actually be more happy for the fact i can use one engineer for one part of a mission and another at a different part which i cant do now (well you can but would be a bad play).
(savvyBanquet) #5

@titaniumCrouton said:
Clown wrote: »

  1. This isn’t good with randoms, it works fine in DirtyCups, just because those are teams where everyone knows each other and they communicate who does which role.

How would you feel if someone was playing as your favourite merc or someone was in a role and performing really poorly?

  1. The point of the squad limit is that you have to budget in which mercs you want and make the tough choice of who to not take. It would be pretty crap if everyone could take a merc to fill in each role, it would inspire even less team work.

  2. These already exist. * Engineer - Fletcher, Proxy, Bushwhacker and Turtle

  • Medic - Sawbonez, Aura, Sparks and Phoenix
  • Fire Support - Arty, Kira, Skyhammer and Stoker
  • Assault - Fragger, Nader, Rhino and Thunder
  • Recon - Vassili, Phantom, RedEye and Aimee
  1. The best training is to just jump into a public match.

Pretty much this. But that said I’ve been begging for a new game mode that has character limits. Something like a pick/ban phase and you have to have X amount of mercs unlocked…idk. just something so we can have the choice…

Twice today I’ve gone against 6 bushwhackers. It’s been a frustrating mess both times XP.

Yea that’s the problem the game was not tested or designed to have 6 bushwhackers on a 6vs6 battle. In some cases it’s impossible to win if your team does not have the right cards and you are not going to think there going 6 bushwhackers.

(Yes) #6

[quote=“savvyBanquet;59458”]2. How are limits a good things? majority of FPS games have no limits and you can change anytime and they worked without issues. This is like the first FPS game i played that had a character limit. As for it promoting less teamwork i disagree it really would not change. I would actually be more happy for the fact i can use one engineer for one part of a mission and another at a different part which i cant do now (well you can but would be a bad play).
[/quote]
This limit is good because it promotes teamplay. You have to think to yourself “Do we have enough medics?”, “Do we have enough people that can disable the EV?”, “Can anyone complete an objective quickly?” and “Is there anyone who is good at killing?”, if you could take one person for each role, then you wouldn’t need to rely on your team.

But anyway, why are you saying “How are limits a good thing?” when two of your suggestions are to impose more limits?

(savvyBanquet) #7

[quote=“Clown;59461”][quote=“savvyBanquet;59458”]2. How are limits a good things? majority of FPS games have no limits and you can change anytime and they worked without issues. This is like the first FPS game i played that had a character limit. As for it promoting less teamwork i disagree it really would not change. I would actually be more happy for the fact i can use one engineer for one part of a mission and another at a different part which i cant do now (well you can but would be a bad play).
[/quote]
Limits are good because they promote teamplay. You have to think to yourself “Do we have enough medics?”, “Do we have enough people that can disable the EV?”, “Can anyone complete an objective quickly?” and “Is there anyone who is good at killing?”, if you could take one person for each role, then you wouldn’t need to rely on your team.

But anyway, why are you saying “How are limits a good thing?” when two of your suggestions are to impose more limits?
[/quote]

You mean one? because allowing you to play all characters you purchase anytime is not a limit at all. Only limit is class restrictions simple because the game was not designed or tested for having 6 vs 6 of one character. That’s why a lot of games have restrictions because they know it can be game breaking.

Really they could just not have class restrictions but allow you to choose any purchased character you own. This way you can constantly counter any combo without any limits. Having 3 characters to choose from only is an issue. The fact is no one can predict they will go all skyhammers, rhinos, etc and if you don’t have the proper loadouts the match is done before its even started. The better and more skilled players are not the ones who always win because of this factor.

(Gi.Am) #8

@titaniumCrouton Don’t worry the devs have stated several times that they want to do a drafting mode (most likely part of ranked) and since everyone seems to like the idea, it is propably just a matter of time.

As for limiting classes/mercs several things.
Stacked teams are mainly a side effect of free rotation, everyone wants to test a merc as soon as possible.

In other games classses are avaible indefinitely you will be able to play your prefered class eventually. Free rotation on the other hand gives a timed window, especially for people that can only afford to play a few matches on the weekends limiting classes/mercs could very well mean they don’t get the oppurtunity to test them at all.

People don’t like if they can’t play what they want in general and lets be hoenst here convincing someone that you “could play that merc better” or “teaching people how to play that merc better”. Usually comes in the form of harrasment and toxic behaviour or results in leaving a game because you can’t play what you want. You can see that in games with limits all the time.

I still recon that giving every player 2 mercs to test for a week or two, random (+ whoever has just been released) would dissipate the problem without resorting to limiting anything, altho…

Stacked/unlimited teams are annoying no doubt, but not that bad.

  • They amplify both the strength of the stacked merc and his weakness making a stacked team situational at best and quite often easy to counter if you know what you are doing.
  • They teach everyone how to counter that specific merc very quickly (seriously I’m often surprised how much harder it becomes playing a merc after he was in free rotation).
  • They allow for the discovery of new team compositions, generate more varied team matchups compared to a rather rigid meta class limits enforce.

Afterall casual is just that a non serious playground to have fun and play around. Adding more tactical decision making in ranked by adding a draft mode sure would love to see that.

(savvyBanquet) #9

[quote=“Gi.Am;59536”]@titaniumCrouton Don’t worry the devs have stated several times that they want to do a drafting mode (most likely part of ranked) and since everyone seems to like the idea, it is propably just a matter of time.

As for limiting classes/mercs several things.
Stacked teams are mainly a side effect of free rotation, everyone wants to test a merc as soon as possible.

In other games classses are avaible indefinitely you will be able to play your prefered class eventually. Free rotation on the other hand gives a timed window, especially for people that can only afford to play a few matches on the weekends limiting classes/mercs could very well mean they don’t get the oppurtunity to test them at all.

People don’t like if they can’t play what they want in general and lets be hoenst here convincing someone that you “could play that merc better” or “teaching people how to play that merc better”. Usually comes in the form of harrasment and toxic behaviour or results in leaving a game because you can’t play what you want. You can see that in games with limits all the time.

I still recon that giving every player 2 mercs to test for a week or two, random (+ whoever has just been released) would dissipate the problem without resorting to limiting anything, altho…

Stacked/unlimited teams are annoying no doubt, but not that bad.

  • They amplify both the strength of the stacked merc and his weakness making a stacked team situational at best and quite often easy to counter if you know what you are doing.
  • They teach everyone how to counter that specific merc very quickly (seriously I’m often surprised how much harder it becomes playing a merc after he was in free rotation).
  • They allow for the discovery of new team compositions, generate more varied team matchups compared to a rather rigid meta class limits enforce.

Afterall casual is just that a non serious playground to have fun and play around. Adding more tactical decision making in ranked by adding a draft mode sure would love to see that.[/quote]

Personally I think they should just drop all limits problem solved. So your only limit will be not owning the character other then that there be none. So if a team goes all bushwhackers you can easily counter them and force them to switch up. That is one thing I liked about Wolfenstien ET is constantly switching classes to counter and get the job done. You also learn the game far far quicker.

The problem with limiting to only three characters as stated first your limited and second you cant predict what the other team is going to do. This can lead to the battle being over before it even starts which leads to a bad game because its going from skill based to luck based.

I get it Dirty Bomb wants to be different but there is a good reason why other FPS games don’t have this.