ET: Tactics -- A New ET Mini Mod

(Zaedyn) #1

ET: Tactics – A New ET Mini Mod

If the shooting and aiming aspect of ET is very important to you, then stop reading here.

Otherwise, if the teamwork and objective aspect is why you like ET, and if you like Role Playing Games (RPGs) or Real-Time Tactics (RTT) games, then continue reading.

As some of you have noticed, I’ve added a new game mode to etpub called Tactics (setting g_tactics to 1). The goal of this mode is to move all of the focus in ET to the tactics and teamwork each team uses to win the objective. There are two major changes ET needs to do this:

  1. Make aiming a non-issue. Like RPGs, RTT, and even Real-Time Strategy games, the computer will do the aiming. You just look in the general direction of the target and fire. The aiming will be perfect headshot aiming, however whether or not you hit the target will be decided randomly. It will be based on either your light weapons or heavy weapons skill (for the mobile MG42), the weapon being used, the distance to the target, and the battle sense of the player being shot at. If their battle sense is much higher than your weapon skill, you will miss more often, or get less headshots.

The point isn’t to make ET easier for all the n00bs, it’s to make it completely balanced when it comes to aiming. NO ONE will have an advantage. Dodging, strafing, and manually aiming will all be useless. Instead hiding, planning, sneakiness, etc., in other words Tactics, will be critical.

This will make aiming easier for some, and harder for others, but the same all around.

This has already been added, and now needs testing for balance and bugs.

  1. The second major change for ET will be the addition of “Commanders” Each team will have one commander. The commander will be able to freely look around the map like any spectator, except they will only be able to see enemy players that your members of your team can see. The other enemy players will be invisible. This spectator will be on your team, and their team chat will go to your team.

The commander will also have some limited ability to drop artillery strikes. It won’t work as well as a FOps, but enough to drop the occasional strike in a key location.

There are also plans to allow the commander a way to mark which paths the team should be taking with visual cues. So when you spawn, an arrow will appear telling you which general way to go. Or maybe a ghostly color trace you should follow. We’re still figuring that out.

This has yet to be added. I welcome programming help to do this.

Another thing I’m looking at doing is having it play in 3rd person mode, and auto-aim the pliers, since that’s been the hardest thing to use in 3rd person.

Why am I doing this? Because although I’m not a terrible shooter in ET (around 35% accuracy), the aiming part of ET is not what makes it fun for me. It’s the teamwork and tactics the teams use to win. I’m more of a Role-Playing Gamer (RPG) and also interested in Real-Time Tactics Games (RTT) like Rome:Total War, etc…

My idea is to start a new genre, the First-Person Tactical Game, where you get the immersiveness of a First-Person Game, and the strategy of a tactics game—without aiming being an issue.

If any of you are interested in this play style, you can help me in a few ways.

  1. Test it out on irc.bpark3.com:5123 where I run a temp ET: Tactics server. Test the weapons against each other, and try playing through some maps. Then, let me know how balanced the weapons feel vs. normal ET. Things like, the Sten is too good, or the rifles range should be higher, etc.
  2. Run a tactics server of your own (latest nightly etpub with g_tactics set to 1), or at least sometimes run your server in tactics mode. Give me the same info as in #1.
  3. Let me know what else you’d like to see in ET: Tactics.
  4. Don’t complain if you’re a big aimer and shooter, because this isn’t for you anyways. :nag:

Thanks!

(Dazzamac) #2

Sounds like full spectrum warrior to me. If everyone gets random headshots according to skill, whats to stop one team from pwning ass at the spawn and the other team doesn’t get a chance to execise their tactical skills?

(Zaedyn) #3

Full Spectrum Warrior is a really good game, but there are some major differences. Full Spectrum Warrior is definitely a RTT game, but not a First-Person RTT game. In fact, it lacks features you get for free in Enemy Territory, the hugest being NO COMPETITIVE MULTIPLAYER. It only has coop multiplayer.

Also, no First Person perspective.

Also, in Full Spectrum you move your entire squad, not just one player.

ET: Tactics brings RTT games like Full Spectrum down to the individual level, while preserving the tactical feel.

If everyone gets random headshots according to skill, whats to stop one team from pwning ass at the spawn and the other team doesn’t get a chance to execise their tactical skills?

Because it is still HARD to get head shots. When I say random I do NOT mean 50-50. I mean there’s a chance based on other variables that you will get headshots. You can average as high as 15% or more HS accuracy when you are leveled up in light weapons. Maybe higher, I haven’t tested it completely. In fact, I need testers to try it out and see if you head shot enough as is.

It’s also pretty hard to spawn kill when you spawn with a few seconds of invincibility and auto-aiming. You just spawn, hold down fire, and tear into any spawn killers.

It actually decreases spawnkilling.

Thanks for your comments. I think I’ll actually play some Full Spectrum Warrior.

I like Real Time Tactics games, I just want to see them brought down to the First-Person level.

(Dazzamac) #4

It sounds interesting, I wouldn’t mind givin it a go but I’m unsure as to how it’ll translate into a reality as far as gameplay is concerned.

(grudgebearer) #5

I fail to see how giving everyone auto-aim with random headshots based on stats, coupled with a team spectator that can only see enemies viewed by teammates makes a game more “tactical.”

First of all how do you orchestrate a combined assault when you know that the enemy just hast to be looking in your general direction for the bullets to possibly hit you, and your own bullets may possibly miss for the same reason? Basicly you sit everyone around the objective firing in one general direction and the opposition dies. How is this tactical in the least since the computer is doing calculations to determine if you hit an enemy? Cover won’t even matter since everyone has autoaim, even if only your foot is visible bullets will hit it if the computer “rolls” it.

ET has some severe limitations when it comes to the ideas of sneaking and hiding, since contrast and lighting are changed completely at the behest of the player, hiding is rarely a viable option unless you get directly behind a large object without making any noise, again I fail to see how this is any more tactical than normal ET.

The spectator/commander baffles me the most of all, if you can only see enemies that your teammates can see, how does that help you plan your tactics? On top of all of this, unless everyone has teamspeak or ventrilo or some other VCOM software then everyone is going to be sitting around typing up their “tactics” instead of implementing them.

Grudgebearer

(Zaedyn) #6

First, cover will help because no, the computer won’t hit your little foot sticking out. The hit detection itself is done exactly the same way ET does it. I just set a flag that determines whether or not the hits count. Not all hits are headshots, most are body. Hitting a little foot is just as hard as normal ET.

Second, it’s tactical exactly because you can just sit there on the objective and shoot out from it. It means the offense really has to be clever to get in there. Anyone who’s camped goldrush knows it’s still possible, even with auto-aiming. There are lots of ways to break a camp.

It’s more tactical because you can no longer break the objective camping by just sending a rambo medic in to kill everyone. You actually have to plan it out with your team.

Yes, this is a good point. The hiding and sneaking would be standard ET-style. Just being more clever in your confrontations, using cover, etc. I’m not talking about the kind of stealth you see in, say, Metal Gear Solid. Those are more for stealth games, although we could certainly change ET enough to allow some more interesting stealth features.

This is where things get really interesting. If you really want to know where the other team is, you need intelligence. You need FOps watching them from afar, you need Covert Ops in uniforms mixing it up with the other team and spying on them so the commander knows where they are.

I really like it because suddenly intelligence actually matters! You will actually send that covops in there to spot enemy locations so your commander can better guide the assault.

The commander will also be able to visually tell you which way to go. So you spawn and know which direction the assault will be, or where to strength your defense. This is down the road though.

As for teamspeak, yes, you have another good point there. You would definitely need to step up the communication.

This can be done two ways.

  1. Teamspeak, like you said. I don’t think we’re going to build VoIP into ET yet!
  2. Excellent visual tools for the commander to use. If any of you have played Savage (now free) you have seen how this can be done. Savage does it really well. So, like I said, the commander clicks on a few players (like a Real Time Tactics or Strategy game), and then tells them where to go. The players then see arrows telling them which way to go to get there. This allows for excellent tactical leadership without voice.

Thanks for your comments. We will have to take these issues into account as we refine the game and genre.

(kamikazee) #7

The only huge flaw you may encounter is: who will be able to be a commander?

(Jaquboss) #8

this mod sounds pretty cool
making aim in RPG style makes tactic part much bigger issue
however i am wondering if players will use it :-/

(Zaedyn) #9

It will be made a vote.

There’s also the “Highest Rank” option.

#10

That’s the reason why you should hide, not just camp at the objective. The computer doesn’t shoot for you, you’ll have to do it yourself. If the players are hiding, you can’t see them and why would you be shooting around just 'cause there could be an enemy.

(Dazzamac) #11

Went to the test server and it was empty. Perhaps scheduling a test would be a good idea?

(IneQuation) #12

I played a bit and to be honest I don’t feel any difference in shooting. :stuck_out_tongue: Maybe that’s just because of my poor accuracy. :wink: Still, I didn’t feel like the chances were even at all. Maybe it’s just me, though.

(Shanks) #13

You forgot to edit your original post…

(Meyerinchains) #14

I tried this out on the test server and to me, I didn’t see anyone being more tactical or being more of a teamplayer. No extra teamwork or anything. It just seemed like it was a server that was setup with a server side aimbot. You’re first objective said to ‘make aimng a non-issue’, but I feel like it has done the opposite. It seems to have made aiming the number one issue. I can’t just run out there and steal the objective cause even the noobs who can’t aim well will take me down in a few shots if they’ve been playing for a while and have higher xp stats. It doesn’t make me want to organize with my team, but rather makes me want to shoot the crap out of the other team just so they don’t shoot the crap outta me. I’m not saying this way of making a tactics mod is wrong, I’m just explaining how I felt after trying it out.

(BR1GAND) #15

Sounds really interesting… Love to help playtest this.

Sounds similar to my Commanders MOD idea…

http://www.splashdamage.com/index.php?name=pnPHPbb2&file=viewtopic&t=7262&highlight=

… except I would never take Aiming and Movement out of a FPS… Even Savage (which has melee + range + movement) still allows those with good aiming/movement skillz to excel. The Tactical component could still be there via the Commander position and I would add a similar recharge function to Squad/Team leaders too.

(carnage) #16

i have pretty big doubts about the commander role working. first you take away aiming and then you start telling players where they are going to move to etc. If there is anyhting i have noticed from pubing on ET players generaly like to do there own thing. As well as the obvious advantage of constantly chaging the attack route on every run making it much harrder to defend. Where one team commander would strugle to keep doing this for everyone or even 2 - 3 fireteams

as for some of the other ideas similar to the ones in br1gands post attack target commands and the like… how useful are they realy… i mean ET is such a fast game any target that is a player is likely to be so fast that by the time the attacking force arives there will be gone or moved and do you realy need to tell people to attack the fuledump

it could work perhaps as a 2 player game where each commander is in charge of a team of bots and can chose there classes and weapons, sort them into fireteams and give each fireteam directions and objectives. With some kind of scripting system where the players can make there own cutomized commands to avoid having to use command for too basic like just defend or attack

(Lanz) #17

If it’s a tactical game what you need is squad leaders, not commanders. Who can give context sensitive orders as in ET:QW for example.

(BR1GAND) #18

During pub play… the commander and squad leader postitions would just be an enhancement to game play. Many players will always opt to do their own thing and there would be no penalty for doing so. However in a game where both bonus XP and a boost to your charge bar help, there might be incentive enough for some to comply and work as a team. In competitve play this was usually accomplished by the Team Cpt screaming in vent. Having a top down view of the battle with the ability to issue commands from the map might actually have some benifits worth looking at.

But alas this is what the commanders mod idea was about not what Zaedyn is putting out. I dont mean to hijack the thread…

(carnage) #19

During pub play… the commander and squad leader postitions would just be an enhancement to game play. Many players will always opt to do their own thing and there would be no penalty for doing so. However in a game where both bonus XP and a boost to your charge bar help, there might be incentive enough for some to comply and work as a team. In competitve play this was usually accomplished by the Team Cpt screaming in vent. Having a top down view of the battle with the ability to issue commands from the map might actually have some benifits worth looking at.

But alas this is what the commanders mod idea was about not what Zaedyn is putting out. I dont mean to hijack the thread…

in coordinated clan matches were there is chain of command and more importantly trust that your leaders are doing the right thing then im sure this would work. Screaming in vent is not a good way to enjoy a game and a good player would probably get more xp but just doing his own thing since he is likely to reach enemy and objectives faster then waiting and being slowed down by an amaturish squad team

top down views of the map in ET are also a very bad idea. using the command map is ok but doenst realy give too much help for placing detailed orders and you cant see the exact terrain. and making a top down camera requires one powerfull rig as well as the maps not being set up from top down viewing so your gon have bugs and see lots of ugliness too. Also top down mapping is not very useful on maps like beach were there are large indoor sections and multiple floors

(BR1GAND) #20

Lol, thats what I was saying… Screaming in vent = current typical clan matches. Having a commander issue orders via an interface with visual and audio cues built into the mod would be the alternative.

If the squad is amaturish or not… If you comply with your orders you get bonus xp… if you do you own thing you dont… there is no penalty per say… so really there is no negative impact on gameplay only a positive one.

Your point about top down view in a multi-level building is well taken though… That would have to be addressed.