Downed -> Revive Suggestion

(watsyurdeal) #21

I have, the argument is simply that the amount of effort to gib is more than it is to revive. I have given the disadvantages, which are

  1. your health and ammo after a fight

  2. are defenseless if you are trying to use the knife for speed to reach and finish them off

  3. That even IF the medic was in danger, the revive shield protects him and his patient, giving the medic time equip their primary

  4. That in the vast majority of these instances, it goes from being a 1v1 to a 2v1 fight in half a second.

Please, tell me again what are the downsides of reviving?

Telling me to adapt isn’t going to work, because the reality is even in the best case scenario where you land all your shots and lose as little health as possible, you still MUST kill the Medic before he gets the revive, and even if you take away most of his health you are still outnumbered.

(Runeforce) #22

What can I say? Change your priorities? But let’s leave it at, we agree to disagree. :slight_smile:

(watsyurdeal) #23

So you don’t have an argument then, then that’s all there is to it.

(Runeforce) #24

[quote=“majesticClue;19546”]

So you don’t have an argument then, then that’s all there is to it.[/quote]

Ok.

So you want me to repeat myself? Go back and read what I wrote about gibbing being stacked against the medic. You wrote a lot of shit since, but you never acknowledged the facts I brought up (in fact, you ignored it.) Just a whole lot of the usual crybabing from your side.

(watsyurdeal) #25

[quote=“Runeforce;19547”]

Ok.

So you want me to repeat myself? Go back and read what I wrote about gibbing being stacked against the medic. You wrote a lot of shit since, but you never acknowledged the facts. Just a whole lot of the usual crybabing from your side.[/quote]

Here is what you said

[quote=“Runeforce;19531”]
That could not be further from the truth! You can only revive if you are close (untill Sparks comes back) and you move slower with your defibs out, than with your knife. Plus you can gib from distance, but the medic can’t revive from the distance (untill Sparks comes out.) In all, it is heavily stacked in favor of the gibber, against the medic.[/quote]

  1. You can only revive if you are close

Yes but you can see who is downed through a nifty little icon, and the speed of Sawbonez and Aura is 410 and 470 respectively, which is more than enough to get within range to revive, especially if it’s behind cover or if the victim is a fair distance away from their killer.

  1. you move slower with defibs out

So you’re telling me you’re running around holding the defibs out the whole time? Come on, the only time they are out is if a) you are doing a full revive, which is about 0.5 seconds to a whole second, or b) when you are reviving them right away, and you are not at any speed loss if you are close enough to actually use the ability

  1. you can gib from a distance but you can’t revive unless you’re playing sparks

Yes you can, but it costs ammo and time, time that the Medic has to revive the player and now you’re fighting 2 people, and the ammo you wasted trying to down someone is now null and gone. Plus, once the medic revives someone, the shield protects the patient and them, long enough to switch to his primary and start fighting alongside his ally.

And we haven’t talked about the part of the argument where the Medic can kill someone before reviving their allies, which isn’t hard at all since the Medic should be at full health, while the killer, is likely at 75% or lower, and should be an easy pick.

So, again, what is your argument? I didn’t ignore your points, I simply explained why I don’t think they hold up, and you haven’t given me any reason why to think they should other than saying I’m a cry baby and I should adapt.

(Runeforce) #26

That’s better. But your whole point is that you don’t like gibbing. You have in previously thread talked about how it’s unfair to your KDR, ignoring the fact that an incap counts as a kill and a incap does not count as a death (but a gib does.) All I read is how unfair you think this system is to you and your stats, and ‘what if’ scenarioes, and how you are not able to overcome impossible odds.
What I am telling you, is you have to change your priorities (in the moment,) instead of the game. Make smart plays! The way the system work is not because of beta stage or insuffeciant testing. It is how it’s supposed to work to encourage teamwork, instead of lone wolfing. It’s because of a reason that you can’t see your KDR while the game is underway.

(watsyurdeal) #27

[quote=“Runeforce;19553”]That’s better. But your whole point is that you don’t like gibbing. You have in previously thread talked about how it’s unfair to your KDR, ignoring the fact that an incap counts as a kill and a incap does not count as a death (but a gib does.) All I read is how unfair you think this system is to you and your stats, and ‘what if’ scenarioes, and how you are not able to overcome impossible odds.

What I am telling you, is you have to change your priorities (in the moment,) instead of the game. Make smart plays! The way the system work is not because of beta stage or insuffeciant testing. It is how it’s supposed to work to encourage teamwork, instead of lone wolfing. It’s because of a reason that you can’t see your KDR while the game is underway.[/quote]

Then you either completley misunderstood or I was not clear enough

I don’t give a shit about my KD but I do care if I can’t win or get shit done because the enemy simply WILL NOT DIE. No matter if I shoot them with nades or put them down with bullets, I have to either kill the Medic before he gets the revive, or retreat, it’s never as simple as kill them both. If it takes one person to kill another, then that’s how much it should take to finish them off, there’s no reason it should take two people to down a single person just to keep them from being revived.

Stuff like that creates massive stalemates, which means the game basically stops, because of revive chains or gibbing taking such a long period of time aside from knifing. That is my complaint, it means that my team basically needs to fight fire with fire in order to win, or in other words, have more Medics than the other team does. That is my issue, and nothing proposed in this thread would nerf Sawbonez or Aura, just force them to actually stick with their team to revive them, instead of giving them more than enough time to wander off and come back and revive as an afterthought.

(Runeforce) #28

I do reckognise the ‘stalemates’ you are talking about, but it’s not like it does not change. A ‘stalemate’ does not stay, but dynamically changes, according to team cohesion and actions. I think we agree on it, but the difference being you see it as a problem (against the individual to succeed,) while I am seeing it as a part of the fun, chaos and excitement.

(watsyurdeal) #29

I’m sorry but I do not see them as exciting, because if they occur, that usually means that it’s not a matter of whose team is better or has better tactics, it’s that a game mechanic is causing the game to stop because there is no viable counter for it.

Like if a Sniper is so good who’s nailing everyone before they can get to the point. That’s an issue with map design as it lacks flanks, or class mechanics as the class might lack a weakness to be exploited. Just an example, that’s why things like flinch and sway exist.

(Szakalot) #30

Just look at the dirtycup streams with pro teams fighting each other. Medics get all the revives, and fights get resolved with either one of the medics dying first, or some instagib nade. There was a hilarious moment in the US vs. EU with Inf3rno killing an engineer trying to repair the generator like 3 times, each time trying to go for the gib; with the medic swooping in and getting a revive. Finally he ran out of ammo and had to fall back.

Medic trains make this game into TDM, cause you can always bumrush the opponent; and rely on your medics to bring you back up.

(Ardez1) #31

You can argue about whether gibbing should be easier all day, but that is not what this thread was originally about. This was about a penalty for a player that took damage while down, so it becomes easier to down them again if revived ~ Because your bullets did go somewhere, didn’t they?

(watsyurdeal) #32

Agreed, and making it so they have less health each time they are downed means they are easier to gib each time they are killed, punishing them for dying too many times in a single life. Imo that would be a fair nerf that solves the stalemate issue without nerfing Medics too harshly. If anything it punishes people for going off on their own too much or not being good enough to win most of their fights.

(avidCow) #33

No, if you think it through it also punishes teams that win their fights. Lame.

(crimsonYouth) #34

How is dying over and over winning their fight? sounds like they lost… many times :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:

(avidCow) #35

Round starts. Defence loses the inital fight and is pushed back to spawn. Attacking team makes 5 revives during the fight. Attacking team now has a life disadvantage for having killed all the defenders.

It’s not rocket science.

(watsyurdeal) #36

[quote=“avidCow;19593”]Round starts. Defence loses the inital fight and is pushed back to spawn. Attacking team makes 5 revives during the fight. Attacking team now has a life disadvantage for having killed all the defenders.

It’s not rocket science.[/quote]

You could easily chose to spawn with the wave instead since A) the game tells you when the next wave is next to the time limit, B) it’s a lot faster than retreating back to the next point.

There’s nothing wrong with it as it encourages the game to move forward rather than stalemate.