Long jumping past him is also effective if you see the shimmer charging you. Rather than dump bullets into his cloak shield before he swings and doing zero actual damage to him you can long jump past him, he will probably swing, be stuck in a long animation and you shoot his head off.
Don't quit playing just because of Phantom
watsyurdeal
(watsyurdeal)
#22
[quote=“Alphafox;41733”]Some tips for people who have no idea on how to deal with him:
Tip #1: Vassilli players, use your heartbeat sensor, it’s something you should always do.
Tip #2: In future update when the other snipers will be released ALL of them will have a way to make his stealth 100% pointless.
Tip #3: Back away when you see a Phantom rushing you, Yes. It works.
Tip #4: Just like every merc, headshots do extra damage, yes I know it’s obvious, but I see most people panic, when 2 shotgun shots should kill Phantom.
Tip #5: Use your eyes, he can be spotted quite easily if you pay attention to your surrounding.
Tip #6: Play the merc, you will learn his strength and weaknesses.[/quote]
No offense Alpha but that doesn’t help.
-
Why should we have to play one merc to counter another? Rock paper scissors just sort of slows things down. It should really be more like, yes, scissors beats paper if he can catch me lol. It shouldn’t be so cookie cutter.
-
I’m sorry, but there is NO reason for cloak to allow you to tank damage, if the enemy is shooting at you, you’re spotted, and you should face consequences, not just shrug it off like it never happened.
-
Also, if the armor was nerfed, I think it’d be more reasonable to change cloak to perfectly reflect your speed. The faster you move, the easier you are to see, walking would make you entirely invisible, which is totally fine since everyone else will be moving at a great speed, so you’ll need to make real, tactical decisions in how you strike.
Alphafox1
(Alphafox)
#23
[quote=“Watsyurdeal;41742”][quote=“Alphafox;41733”]Some tips for people who have no idea on how to deal with him:
Tip #1: Vassilli players, use your heartbeat sensor, it’s something you should always do.
Tip #2: In future update when the other snipers will be released ALL of them will have a way to make his stealth 100% pointless.
Tip #3: Back away when you see a Phantom rushing you, Yes. It works.
Tip #4: Just like every merc, headshots do extra damage, yes I know it’s obvious, but I see most people panic, when 2 shotgun shots should kill Phantom.
Tip #5: Use your eyes, he can be spotted quite easily if you pay attention to your surrounding.
Tip #6: Play the merc, you will learn his strength and weaknesses.[/quote]
No offense Alpha but that doesn’t help.
-
Why should we have to play one merc to counter another? Rock paper scissors just sort of slows things down. It should really be more like, yes, scissors beats paper if he can catch me lol. It shouldn’t be so cookie cutter.
-
I’m sorry, but there is NO reason for cloak to allow you to tank damage, if the enemy is shooting at you, you’re spotted, and you should face consequences, not just shrug it off like it never happened.
-
Also, if the armor was nerfed, I think it’d be more reasonable to change cloak to perfectly reflect your speed. The faster you move, the easier you are to see, walking would make you entirely invisible, which is totally fine since everyone else will be moving at a great speed, so you’ll need to make real, tactical decisions in how you strike.[/quote]
-
Was really just a extra suggestion. There is no rock, paper, scissor there, any merc can get rid of Phantom really. I’m just saying that even more counters to him are on the way.
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I’m not sure that I get that one, isn’t every merc able to just run away? From my experience while using the cloak and getting damaged you lose it’s duration and the armor, you don’t really shrug it off.
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I agree with this one, even if I find the cloak pretty visible already.
watsyurdeal
(watsyurdeal)
#24
[quote=“Alphafox;41747”]
- Was really just a extra suggestion. There is no rock, paper, scissor there, any merc can get rid of Phantom really. I’m just saying that even more counters to him are on the way.
- I’m not sure that I get that one, isn’t every merc able to just run away? From my experience while using the cloak and getting damaged you lose it’s duration and the armor, you don’t really shrug it off.
- I agree with this one, even if I find the cloak pretty visible already.[/quote]
No, they can’t, any merc with less than 90 hp is pretty much boned, I had a feast on all the Auras, Proxies, and Sparks’ last night. Add in chopper and it’s even more ridiculous. The only real counter is to take down his cloak, which takes forever and by the time you take it away he’s already closed in for the kill. Look at this video at 1:50-2:00, that Nader could do NOTHING to stop him. Until the cloak drops people are utterly helpless against him, and once he gets within range it’s very difficult to counter him. Melee range is where Phantom is king.
Alphafox1
(Alphafox)
#25
[quote=“Watsyurdeal;41751”][quote=“Alphafox;41747”]
- Was really just a extra suggestion. There is no rock, paper, scissor there, any merc can get rid of Phantom really. I’m just saying that even more counters to him are on the way.
- I’m not sure that I get that one, isn’t every merc able to just run away? From my experience while using the cloak and getting damaged you lose it’s duration and the armor, you don’t really shrug it off.
- I agree with this one, even if I find the cloak pretty visible already.[/quote]
No, they can’t, any merc with less than 90 hp is pretty much boned, I had a feast on all the Auras, Proxies, and Sparks’ last night. Add in chopper and it’s even more ridiculous. The only real counter is to take down his cloak, which takes forever and by the time you take it away he’s already closed in for the kill. Look at this video at 1:50-2:00, that Nader could do NOTHING to stop him. Until the cloak drops people are utterly helpless against him, and once he gets within range it’s very difficult to counter him. Melee range is where Phantom is king.
[/quote]
That Nader aim seemed to be quite off tbh…
But melee range is his domain… It’ pretty much like saying that Rhino shouldn’t be able to be good with his minigun. On my side everything I did yesterday was to hunt Phantoms with Aura and my shotgun. Of course it’s difficult to counter him in his domain, that’s the way it should be, I don’t expect to ‘‘outsnipe’’ Vassili when i’m on Sawbones.
watsyurdeal
(watsyurdeal)
#26
Melee range is his domain yes, but my point was that the cloak, as it is, is way too good at getting Phantom in said range. Getting there stealthily is one thing, but that small 5 second moment sums up exactly why people are upset.
It’s unreasonable, it’s too forgiving and one sided for Phantom.
Eox
(Eox)
#27
Maybe we should find a way to make him go “teamwork”. How about replacing the “tanking” thing of his armor by a “sensor” thing ? So he can spot enemies that goes near him when he’s invisible or something ? Or we give him this in the for of a “sensor pulse”. Like Phoenix’s healing pulse, but that works like Vassili’s sensor.
Alphafox1
(Alphafox)
#28
[quote=“Watsyurdeal;41764”]Melee range is his domain yes, but my point was that the cloak, as it is, is way too good at getting Phantom in said range. Getting there stealthily is one thing, but that small 5 second moment sums up exactly why people are upset.
It’s unreasonable, it’s too forgiving and one sided for Phantom. [/quote]
That’s a way to see it I guess? Tbh no matter what people will be upset, just like people are upset when a nader kill them with martyrdom, get killed by a shotgun,a turret, rhino minigun or pretty much anything else. I could argue about all day, but there is no point in doing that.
I would like that too.
triteTongs
(triteTongs)
#29
Cloak will be adjusted i bet.
Louder sound when cloaked, and a bit more visible to see (since he can tank bullets while cloaked anyways). The cloak timer may be adjusted too, or there could be some sort of penalty to the cloak timer if it get’s shot. That’s what I’d start by tweaking first, if I was a dev.
[quote=“Amerika;41710”]
94-20 with 30k score while learning Phantom. To some that might make it look like Phantom is “OP”. But that was a pretty average score and below average compared to if I was using Fragger, Skyhammer or Vassili and I honestly didn’t feel as if much could be improved beyond my decision making on some maps overall.
In other words what you are saying isn’t really accurate since competent veteran players can pull those scores with just about any class fairly easily and it’s not indicative of a mercs power overall. Let things play out a bit, let people get used to him being in the game and start to notice pick up on how to spot him easy and then let SD adjust if it’s needed.[/quote]
Exactly.
That’s a point i’m trying to make too. If I went a different merc— I would probably have a better score than I do with phantom. That goes with ANY “OP” merc… I’ll just do good whatever I go. Period.
ZeroSorrowsong
(ZeroSorrowsong)
#30
Biggest issue is not his balance, it’s the fact that this game did not have a stealth guy was nice. Since they just tend to be very tedious and annoying.
I am also not worried about his killing prowess but more his objective prowess. He is really good at staying near an objective and just quickly killing anyone who get near like a living landmine. or spawnkilling. 2/5 games today were lost because it took a whole lot of time getting that guy out of our spawn 24/7.
(i am a noob, but still :P)
Nail
(Nail)
#31
no one is going to nor has quit, it’s all baby talk. There’s 11,000 people playing right now
watsyurdeal
(watsyurdeal)
#32
[quote=“shiftyUniverse;41874”]Biggest issue is not his balance, it’s the fact that this game did not have a stealth guy was nice. Since they just tend to be very tedious and annoying.
I am also not worried about his killing prowess but more his objective prowess. He is really good at staying near an objective and just quickly killing anyone who get near like a living landmine. or spawnkilling. 2/5 games today were lost because it took a whole lot of time getting that guy out of our spawn 24/7.
(i am a noob, but still :P)[/quote]
Honestly, I really don’t get why people get so upset about stealth guys, yet nobody seems to mind the Medic trains, or Vasilli basically locking down an area till you kill him, which is easier said than done.
Point is, there are definitely more than obstacle or challenge in this game, and part of being a good player is figuring them out, rather than taking the easy route and saying it’s op, nerf pls.
ZeroSorrowsong
(ZeroSorrowsong)
#33
[quote=“Watsyurdeal;41878”][quote=“shiftyUniverse;41874”]Biggest issue is not his balance, it’s the fact that this game did not have a stealth guy was nice. Since they just tend to be very tedious and annoying.
I am also not worried about his killing prowess but more his objective prowess. He is really good at staying near an objective and just quickly killing anyone who get near like a living landmine. or spawnkilling. 2/5 games today were lost because it took a whole lot of time getting that guy out of our spawn 24/7.
(i am a noob, but still :P)[/quote]
Honestly, I really don’t get why people get so upset about stealth guys, yet nobody seems to mind the Medic trains, or Vasilli basically locking down an area till you kill him, which is easier said than done.
Point is, there are definitely more than obstacle or challenge in this game, and part of being a good player is figuring them out, rather than taking the easy route and saying it’s op, nerf pls.[/quote]
A sniper tend to stay in the same spot and you try to get to him and kill him. Or watch for mines. Or know where the turret is. The stealth guys are always highly mobile and most of the times you spot them its too late. Makes them annoying ;>
frzn
(frzn)
#34
I just imagined a game with 16 phantoms: everyone stands around and thinks the server is empty.
Sinee
(Sinee)
#35
[quote=“Amerika;41710”][quote=“murkyCook;41643”]A levle 7 Phantom just did 55-6 at pub server
yeah he’s not OP at all.[/quote]
94-20 with 30k score while learning Phantom. To some that might make it look like Phantom is “OP”. But that was a pretty average score and below average compared to if I was using Fragger, Skyhammer or Vassili and I honestly didn’t feel as if much could be improved beyond my decision making on some maps overall.
In other words what you are saying isn’t really accurate since competent veteran players can pull those scores with just about any class fairly easily and it’s not indicative of a mercs power overall. Let things play out a bit, let people get used to him being in the game and start to notice pick up on how to spot him easy and then let SD adjust if it’s needed.[/quote]
Thiiiiiiisssssssssssssssssssss.
Since Phantom was released, my level 21 partner is currently using Phantom and people just cry and cry about how OP Phantom is, but they do the same thing with Vassili if he uses him. He’s been playing FPS for years. Of course any merc in his hands is OP, and he’s clearly had ample time (in being at level 21) to acclimate to the pace of DB and excel. He gets wicked good k/d’s.
People just forget that there’s a player behind the merc that might be freakin’ competent.
Yahiko94
(Yahiko94)
#36
In my opinion, Phantom is definitely OP.
But to be honest, I wont leave that game only because of Phantom.
First of all, Aura was op. Then it was Rhino with his minigun or Nader with nade launcher.
Now it is phantom. I guess they are just bringing mercs being stronger than the last one.
What about releasing them for testing purpose at first. So players can test them without being able to buy them. Like the dome test weekend.
Eox
(Eox)
#37
[quote=“Yahiko94;42073”]
What about releasing them for testing purpose at first. So players can test them without being able to buy them. Like the dome test weekend.[/quote]
Heh, that’s not a bad idea actually.
WolfWithAKnife
(WolfWithAKnife)
#39
I’m certainly not going to leave because of him, but I feel the concept actually is bad for this game. I like holding a point having a bunch of players working together to hold their ground, and this guy just ruins that so fast.
If they make him squishier or better yet really slow when being stealthy (lets face it that armor would be ringing like bells!) then maybe I could deal with him. Also people who say the sniper counters not everyone owns the sniper yet. So next character please be a recon person with lots of map control plz.
Potato_Potasto
(Potato Potasto)
#40
Phantom is pretty subpar outside of pubs, and in pubs he’s just another merc that does a good job of killing everyone. I think once his katana is fixed and the hitboxes aren’t as ridiculous as they are now, he will be a lot easier to deal with.