Dirty Bomb Closed Alpha Progress Update - August 6th 2013

(INF3RN0) #141

Brink is a pretty bad example though. Lights were superior because the way the weapon mechanics worked and that everyone had the same weapons. Movement speed was all that mattered at that point.

(DarkangelUK) #142

The heavies in Brink weren’t the juggernauts they should have been and the lights weren’t as flimsy either… again it felt like they didn’t want to upset the players that chose the light class by having them die quicker, even though that was meant to be the downside to the body type.

(prophett) #143

Aside from Ice Hockey on the NES, Brink is the only other example I can draw on from experience. I would rather have everyone on a level playing field in terms of speed.

(ailmanki) #144

Well it wasn’t about playerspeed, but the time it takes to construct, arm, repair, disarm.

Later on they can still implement different mercs with different running/walking speed. But tbh that has nothing to do with the current update.

(Rex) #145

So the attackers can only plant one charge at the objective, but every defender can defuse it. How is that fair?

(Evil-Doer) #146

Playing many maps after the implementation of this, it can be very hard to keep up with all these defuses.

(Rex) #147

This strengthens the defenders too much as they clearly have the advantage here.
And in general if the defenders advantage is too big, the chance of fullholds is becoming more likely. Fullholds don’t work in a stopwatch game, since the attackers always have to win.

(RasteRayzeR) #148

With that combination you will always get the same characters being played by everyone with the same weapon combination because one load-out will stand out as being the most efficient. This basically kills all the strategy part of the game and we were already complaining that there was only one way or two to get to the objectives, now the little team coordination that was required to get a plant or a diffuse is thrown away down the toilets. Now it’s only about rushing an objective and this makes the game really repetitive (even more than before), not to say pointless.

Frankly I don’t see this working for DB. It’s an incentive to play alone and leave the objectives aside, dispatched from your team, with your beautiful skin and weapons shining in the sun … This reduces the team play to get refills of hp and ammo and the strategy to just rushing. It’s not a lemming kind of game as far as I know.

Also I felt powerless in close combat situations without my grenades. Lot of the fun disappeared as now I have to be a soldier to get a grenade. From the shoutcasts we have seen that a lot of the fun comes from the three or four men grenades, and this has almost disappeared now. And with the new character-oriented abilities, you will need more than 5 players per team to get the range of skills you need in your team, and we know that 5vs5 is the only playable way to make competition right now.

As much as I enjoy the new aiming style and ttk, I can’t help but notice that DB is looking more and more like Brink, and not only in terms of graphical design elements (way too neat maps), but also in terms of gameplay as now there are no classes anymore (cf. Brink stations to change your class without having to die), as you bring a lot of customization content, as maps are too linear, lack both the motivation to do the objectives and the background story.

So I will keep testing this variant, but imo this will let a lot of people down, including myself. I really believe that a simple game, with 5 classes, objectives to achieve as a team and good weapons should be all that this game needs. That’s what made W:ET a success I believe.

(BomBaKlaK) #149

So when can we expect a new build ?

(Erkin31) #150

With killstreaks and no objectives ? :stroggtapir:

(Kl3ppy) #151

Instead of constant whining and bitching give some constructive feedback how to improve the current system. Dont start with going back to the old one …
There is already enough whining here, SD is aware of the problem, let them try some different settings and when it’s still not working as intended then SD can switch back.

I want to have a hybrid of classless objectives and classbased objectives which means, there is a special merc for certain things (engie for building/repairing/disarming, covie for hacking, Assault for planting) and the other classes can do objectives too, but at a much lower rate, maybe they need twice the time than the special class. This gives back the advantage of having certain classes in certain situations but teams can still finish objectives without having the special class.

(slanir) #152

what shifty said.

I think classless objectives may work very well if splash damage gets the time required per class right

(RasteRayzeR) #153

[QUOTE=Shifty.;463870]Instead of constant whining and bitching give some constructive feedback how to improve the current system. Dont start with going back to the old one …
There is already enough whining here, SD is aware of the problem, let them try some different settings and when it’s still not working as intended then SD can switch back.

I want to have a hybrid of classless objectives and classbased objectives which means, there is a special merc for certain things (engie for building/repairing/disarming, covie for hacking, Assault for planting) and the other classes can do objectives too, but at a much lower rate, maybe they need twice the time than the special class. This gives back the advantage of having certain classes in certain situations but teams can still finish objectives without having the special class.[/QUOTE]

So basically you’re also bitching about the current system ? :smiley: Everyone now does everything with the difference that they can carry different weapons … As I said, I will test it for the sake of trying out something new. If it turns out to work well then I’ll be more than happy since DB would finally have its unique trademark. But right now I fear this will just kill the team spirit, shut down almost all strategies and reward ramboing through the stages of the maps …

Plus, it’s hard for us to follow these big changes because we have been accustomed to another class system from the start, and now we have to test this which is really different. And in the midst of all that, our old feedback starts kicking in and is not always following all these changes. So yeah, we complain a lot, but that’s why we are here : to say what we think about the game and the related experience.

Then you said that SD could still “revert the changes”. Haven’t seed much of this … usually they listen to us to tweak the existing, not for removing stuff or reverting back to old systems and mechanics. Even less when it comes to core elements of the game.

(Kl3ppy) #154

No, I’m not bitching, I’m just not happy with the current settings in classless objectives. I’m offering constructive feedback with a possible solution I think could improve the current system :wink:

Going back is the absolute last possibility if the new system doesnt work as intended, even when they changed the settings etc. so it’s the last resort :wink:

(INF3RN0) #155

[QUOTE=Shifty.;463876]No, I’m not bitching, I’m just not happy with the current settings in classless objectives. I’m offering constructive feedback with a possible solution I think could improve the current system :wink:

Going back is the absolute last possibility if the new system doesnt work as intended, even when they changed the settings etc. so it’s the last resort :wink:[/QUOTE]

True dat Shifty.

(Erkin31) #156

[QUOTE=Shifty.;463870]Instead of constant whining and bitching give some constructive feedback how to improve the current system. Dont start with going back to the old one …
[/QUOTE]
Already did ! http://forums.warchest.com/showthread.php/37219-Classless-objectives-Role-system
I have no other ideas to keep the advantages of a class-based objectives without limiting SplashDamage to do what they want to do with mercs.

(Ashog) #157

…
This +1

(TS420) #158

All classes play objectives might work if they did thebuild/hack time right. The correct class should be able to get it done way faster than an incorrect class such as a medic constructing compared to an engineer. It should take 3 medics to construct as fast as 1 engy. Same with all classes playing outside their class. This might help things work better. I have seen few full holds with this new build. If anything it seems to push the game play along a little faster. Or at least this has been my experience so far.

(Samurai.) #159

I haven’t read any of the previous feedback written in this thread as there is too much, and i was on holiday for a week when this patch got released so kinda missed the best time to discuss everyone’s ideas. Anyway a lot changed and this is my perspective on it all.

  1. The launcher - why add the extra screen? it’s really annoying having to log in to a screen which basically tells you nothing at all and then launch the game before you get to anything useful like the barracks & server browser, makes me want to check the status of servers during the evening less often as its more of an effort.

  2. Classless objectives - Extremely sceptical when i read it, it actually played out better than i thought however im not so sure i prefer it to the old system of certain classes dedicated to certain objectives. I wouldn’t mind trying a hybrid system in which everyone can still do objectives, but certain classes are better at doing certain objectives, so when an engineer can construct/defuse faster than other classes, or a soldier can plant C4 faster, recon hack faster etc… This keeps the classless approach but still provides a layer of strategical choice which could be beneficial in comp setups where more thought is put into team structure and individual roles.

  3. New Characters
    Nader (Soldier) - Introduced the grenade launcher - a weapon i hate with a passion in every game it is implemented in. Nothing more to say as I just have a personal vendetta against this kind of weapon. Also confused what this “Martyrdom” feature is, it appears to let you blow your body up when your dead, if this is the case it is super lame and would like to see it immediately removed. Essentially i have no time for a character like this in Dirtybomb it has all the lame features i don’t want to see in the game.

Slugger (Engineer) - I like the design of the new shotgun, however it seems a little weak. Also confused why we now have 2 shotgun engineers. Would rather see a nice even split of Shotgun/SMG/AR for the 3 characters as their primary weapons. The SMG secondary it carries i haven’t really made my mind up it seems a bit “meh” i’d much rather a standard pistol or try a CS:GO Tech-9 type of pistol to mix things up in terms of handling. Im not really a fan of the sticky mines it’s very confusing which are you own teams and which are enemies, also they should have much less range on being thrown to balance them out rather than them being like a grenade. Essentially i just feel like this character is a slightly more gimmicky and less balanced version of Proxy which leaves me asking why have this character at all? it needs a new primary, different secondary and a more unique ability away from mines.

BBQ (FieldOps) - Really like the primary weapon, the pistol is okay as well. The molotov is a nice addition that keeps the character slightly interesting, I find this class to be pretty nice standard layout however the ammo station really leave you feeling like this character doesn’t have much substance or impact on gameplay compared to like mortar/airstrikes the alternate characters have. I think you need to find a way of making the abilities more effective as essentially you have a character that has really bad ammo packs right now as its main ability. In general the weapon base of this character is really enjoyable for me just the ability needs improving.

Footloose (Medic) - Not a fan of the primary weapon, the SMG is the same “meh” model as sluggers, like i said before would rather see a Shotgun/SMG/AR split between the 3 characters, send one of the old soldier AR’s to this character maybe? The revolver is cool, nothing more to say. Healing Aura seems a bit crappy would rather see a different kind of healing system maybe the old standard health packs (no regen)? And well self revive, need i say anything about this… its pretty lame alongside the “Martyrdom” feature of the soldier and doesn’t contribute towards teamplay for a medic character which should be all about supporting your team. Think of a new ability please and stay away from the COD trash like abilities you seem to be importing over, there is no place for them in Dirtybomb, thanks.

Ghostly (Recon) - Need to play more with the rifle as haven’t properly grasped it, from the brief moment of playing it felt the same as the bolt action, which i have no moans about as that is my favorite kind of sniper. The silenced pistol is welcomed. The active camouflage is very interesting and actually works i must say which is impressive! It may need a little tweaking to be more balanced in terms of energy management and what you can do, but i actually like this addition its something new for Dirtybomb that isn’t completely stupid.

  1. Removal of Grenades - Would like to see grenades back for all characters as they are a key component of FPS games, but maybe more interesting grenades that don’t have to be standard frag grenades… the molotov is a great example, just need more options like these to spread across the characters (Smoke, EMP etc) … i just feel like all characters should have access to some form of grenade.

  2. Bring back the minimap - I miss my minimap. The old one was pretty hard to use and didn’t display a lot of useful information… i would really like to see terrain added to the map like you see in ETQW rather than the outlines of pathways etc. Just in general improve it and bring it back please. Also while on the HUD can we remove the weird health + character boxes at the top of the screen - i never look at it, i shouldn’t know that information about the enemy team and it seems like it would be more beneficial for a spectator HUD than player hud.

  3. Make characters weapons more similar/generic - My point here is that the base weapon selection of many characters are just too varied and you are using abilities/nades as a balancing factor. The ideal scenario for all the characters should be like the BBQ character. This character has a balanced standard fun to use weapon bank in terms of a standard AR and pistol and a useful grenade. Although the ability for this character is pretty meh right now (ammo stations), you still get a lot of fun out of playing this character because his weapons aren’t really crazy or unique to handle. I’d much rather see all the weapons be more generic and similar, and the difference between each character be emphasised in their ability (airstrikes/camouflage etc). This is something i think the game needs in which the Soldier/Medic/Engi/Fops need 3 characters that each have a similar Shotgun/SMG/AR primary. Then let the abilities differentiate them all.

That is all i can think of right now, hope it gets read amongst the sea of posts that has come with all the new invites recently, which kinda dissuades you to post as there’s so much going on all the time.

(RasteRayzeR) #160

Martyrdom is nice ! I got some good kills with it … :tongue: