Competitive Ruleset Idea

(Guilte) #1

So after watching the Kira Roll Call video, it got me thinking that when all mercenaries are added, that we still may have an issue with balance.

Imagine playing Chapel attack against a Skyhammer and Kira. It would be very difficult. Also Bushwacker is another annoying issue that has been happening a lot. 2 turrets cross firing the objective can be extremely good, and basically covers the objective completely. Obviously the argument can be made to just destroy it, but some placements make it very hard to destroy.

So I got to thinking of a possible way to balance everything, but I wanted to get everyone’s opinion on it. Obviously, this is just theory, because we have not played with Kira. We don’t know if she still one hits the EV. But regardless, I feel like it would be a decent way to balance.

My idea would be to separate mercs into categories. So for example, Rhino and Fragger would be in the same category, as well as the other heavies. And then from there you limit that category to whatever you need to balance the game. This still allows all the mercenaries to be used, but limits the amount of said class per team.

So a quick example could be:
1 Heavy (Fragger, Rhino, etc.)
2 Medics (Aura, Sawbonez, etc.)
1 Assualt (Skyhammer, Nader, Kira, etc)
1 Engineer (Bushwacker, Fletcher, Proxy, etc)
1 Recon (Vasili, Red Eye, etc)

Not only just would this possibly balance, but it would also make the game more consistent. When you gib the engi, the engi is gone. You don’t have to worry about them randomly switching to 2 engineers mid way through the game.

Like I said, this is just a rough idea. This could all be fixed when drafting mode is added, and we can ban certain mercenaries.

Let me know what you guys think.

(Ardez1) #2

This would absolutely ruin casual and thus the playerbase to do.

Example

I just spent 50k on Fragger ~ Can never use because somebody else has him selected. Same scenario for ANY merc. Also, what if you don’t own a merc class, but that is all that is available to play? Like what if you don’t own a recon and that is the only open slot? You don’t get to play?

Your ruleset is for 6v6. What about 7v7, 8v8, 5v5?

It doesn’t feel like a balance. It feels like fascism. Not sure if the draft mode will have ban options, I think it is going to more be to remove duplicate mercs than anything. Which means you could have a Redeye and a Vassili. It doesn’t help that not all mercs of the same category are the same. Not every recon is a sniper. That means you would have to pick between having a Phantom OR a Vasili or choosing between Bushwhacker or Proxy. Playstyles are totally different.

Besides, what is balance? Could you explain how your system is more balanced than the current system. It is definitely more restrictive, but in the end it comes down to team comp/skill and not class limits that will really prove who wins.

(Guilte) #3

I said for competitive, which would mean 5 v 5. It would not ruin the casual player base, as it is completely separate from competitive. I literally just explained how it would balance in the post.

(Ardez1) #4

lol, sorry. The only time you said comp was in the title >.<

Either way, this was considered when they were setting up the tournament but they decided to go with only limiting Fragger/Nader for the latest Dirty Cup. I think it went quite well with the rules they used. A comp game is very fluid and part of that is taking advantage of the 3 merc choices. Having well rounded players able to switch at a moments notice is just as important as having specialists who are good with 1 merc in particular.

I feel like this would hamstring many strategies and make most matches cookie cutter rather than something new almost every time. I like that Dirty Bomb has such a fluid match structure and how diverse a team can get over the course of a single game.

(Guilte) #5

1 merc rule makes is easy to do and is simple, which is why I think it’s the best. But I could see issues coming from it.

(Ardez1) #6

I just don’t see a problem with multiple Assaults, Medics, Engineers or Recons. Sometimes to counter a setup you need to be unorthodox. And the unexpected strat can be huge if played right. This kind of limit removes a lot of creativity and theory crafting from DB.

(Szakalot) #7

I just don’t see a problem with multiple Assaults, Medics, Engineers or Recons. Sometimes to counter a setup you need to be unorthodox. And the unexpected strat can be huge if played right. This kind of limit removes a lot of creativity and theory crafting from DB.[/quote]

no-limit ruleset limited creativity too, as everyone would run 2 fraggers + 2 sawbonez + 1 other class.

(LifeupOmega) #8

Could easily be assigned to each merc individually. So Fragger would have a limit of 1, but another merc would have a limit of 2 or 3. Pretty simple overall.

(MissMurder) #9

Thoughts on the Dirty Cups rule set? http://dirtycups.gg/tournaments/rules/

(LiNkz) #10

@MissMurder So apparently kira and rhino are banned for no real reason? I think you should be able to play them just to show what’s good / weak / strong / bugged about them.

otherwise fine.

(Guilte) #11

Fragger and Rhino on one team is an example of why there needs to be something like this.

(Ardez1) #12

There is a big difference between hard coding a restriction and tournaments having their own ruleset. I think what you are trying to do is propose a hard code so this can never happen, right?

(Ardez1) #13

[quote=“LiNkz;21446”]@MissMurder So apparently kira and rhino are banned for no real reason? I think you should be able to play them just to show what’s good / weak / strong / bugged about them.

otherwise fine. [/quote]

MissMurder doesn’t control that. DirtyCups does. And they are banned because they are still quite new. Many games follow a similar policy for new content.

(Guilte) #14

I’m talking about rules for a tournament.

(Ardez1) #15

Then maybe this belongs on the DirtyCups forum?(Or ESL)

You could always start a tournament with your own ruleset too! :slight_smile:

(Guilte) #16

Rule set should be standardized. No point in having a bunch of different tournaments with different rules. It’s bad for the competitve community.

(Szakalot) #17

rules should be experimented with. Its bad for a competitive community to get stuck in one ruleset, if its bad.

No better time to experiment and see what works than at the beginning.

(Guilte) #18

rules should be experimented with. Its bad for a competitive community to get stuck in one ruleset, if its bad.

No better time to experiment and see what works than at the beginning.[/quote]

I’m saying that after all the testing, if everyone is playing a different ruleset, it’s bad for the competitive community. Obviously things need to be experimented with lmfao.