Brink Interviews Make Weekends Better

(H0RSE) #61

[QUOTE=Humate;246507]Provided the advantage is significant (with SMART).
Would be great to see a video demonstrating this, with a timer.

Ive been made aware, that there are certain spots on maps where one can only manually SMART to get there. Knowing that SD wouldn’t remove auto-smart, I’m hoping there are quite a few of these manual only spots.[/QUOTE]
You can’t expect that doing SMART manually will grant a significant advantage over just holding the button down. I know you want some type of advantage for being “hardcore,” but one of the goals of Brink, is that it allows everyone to have fun - some new guy getting owned because he doesn’t perfect his movement scheme does not equal fun… You can’t demand advantages for one side, and totally neglect the other.

(Humate) #62

You can’t expect that doing SMART manually will grant a significant advantage over just holding the button down. I know you want some type of advantage for being “hardcore,” but one of the goals of Brink, is that it allows everyone to have fun - some new guy getting owned because he doesn’t perfect his movement scheme does not equal fun… You can’t demand advantages for one side, and totally neglect the other.

I’m not expecting nor demanding anything, thanks.
If you read the posts in this thread, you will understand the context of the post you quoted.

Its coming from - “IF the game was made for me” point of view.
I’m very well aware that it isnt. :wink:

(Exedore) #63

The SMART system won’t do lateral wall-hops, as are seen in the Shipyard video from a while back. Only Light bodytypes can do those.

The manual timing aspect isn’t quite as significant in most cases, but it’s a nice touch for those that really want to maximize every aspect of their play.

(Mad Hatter) #64

Call me a softcore console guy or whatever, but I want Brink to be a fast-paced, action-packed shooter first and foremost. I like the fact that it is objective-based, but I personally believe that anything that slows down or gets in the way of the action should be sped up or changed in some way. So far, everything I’ve seen looks very nice in that respect. It all looks very fluid and intuitive. With the game mechanics being this easy to figure out and use, it really comes down to playing better and/or smarter than your opponents rather than “who is better at using the controls.”

(Humate) #65

Yes, just as I thought. Thanks for the confirmation :slight_smile:

[QUOTE=Exedore;246513]
The manual timing aspect isn’t quite as significant in most cases, but it’s a nice touch for those that really want to maximize every aspect of their play. [/quote]

Out of curiosity, do you believe that the majority of players would have a hard time with the manual controls? Thanks.

(Cankor) #66

[QUOTE=Humate;246468] It would be a bit counterintuitive, if they included autoswitching to speed things up, and then add a mechanism that says “hang on buddy you have too much bling on your gun, this will take a while”
[/QUOTE]

I’d actually call it counterintuitive if the switch back speed from a tool was the same for all weapons, I don’t buy the logic that it makes sense to let people defend themselves quickly no matter what weapon they have simply because they are doing the objective.

Assuming this is the case (switch from tool to weapon is same as from weapon to weapon), it should grant some hope to Tokamak (and those of us with similar thoughts on tool pre-selection) because if this were the case the pre-selection mechanic is actually back again, but not as far as pre-selecting your tool, but instead in the form of preselecting what weapon you want to have while doing the objective.

Do I want to be able to defend myself real qucikly while doing the objective? Then make sure you have a gun with a quick switch speed in your hand before you start doing the objective. So preselect your weapon, not your tool.

This mechanic would reward players who play smart, which was the whole point of pre-selecting tools in ETQW and W:ET.

And again, what’s the point of having a penalty for having a clumsy weapon if it materializes in your hands instantly just because you were doing the objective? Unless the size of your equiped weapon slows you down (does it?), the majority of your weapon switching is going to be from weapon to tool and back again anyway.

(brbrbr) #67

[QUOTE=Senethro;246430]Assuming there is a long weaponswitch time.

Rahdo made an (old) post saying there is not a long weaponswitch time. You’re stuck in the ETQW mindset and keep ignoring this.

Would someone who has played Brink feel able to comment on the length of time required to switch to construction/hacking/explosive tool?[/QUOTE]

but most potential ETQW buyers, are “stuck in the ETQW mindset” and await corresponding response/game development decisions.
point is not try to screen/disguise you[unbacked] IMHO-based decisions in Management/Engineering/Coding as “consumers-necessary” and thus - evade punishment from publisher after possible failure of project.
ie[/in short] infantile/unreliable/incompetent personell[regardless rank/task] are fail/fail HR resource and thus should be ex-terminated.

(zcw1230wwa) #68

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(Humate) #69

[QUOTE=Cankor;246569]I’d actually call it counterintuitive if the switch back speed from a tool was the same for all weapons, I don’t buy the logic that it makes sense to let people defend themselves quickly no matter what weapon they have simply because they are doing the objective.

Assuming this is the case (switch from tool to weapon is same as from weapon to weapon), it should grant some hope to Tokamak (and those of us with similar thoughts on tool pre-selection) because if this were the case the pre-selection mechanic is actually back again, but not as far as pre-selecting your tool, but instead in the form of preselecting what weapon you want to have while doing the objective.

Do I want to be able to defend myself real qucikly while doing the objective? Then make sure you have a gun with a quick switch speed in your hand before you start doing the objective. So preselect your weapon, not your tool.

This mechanic would reward players who play smart, which was the whole point of pre-selecting tools in ETQW and W:ET.

And again, what’s the point of having a penalty for having a clumsy weapon if it materializes in your hands instantly just because you were doing the objective? Unless the size of your equiped weapon slows you down (does it?), the majority of your weapon switching is going to be from weapon to tool and back again anyway.[/QUOTE]

You dont have to buy the logic. :wink:

The logic stems from SD’s attitude towards class actions. There is no point including a non-bank-system, that speeds up the process of class actions and minimises the risk involved in class actions - and then include a mechanism that puts them at risk for doing that class action.

And you’re preaching to the converted regarding weapon banks.
Trust me :wink:

(H0RSE) #70

[QUOTE=Humate;246589]You dont have to buy the logic. :wink:

The logic stems from SD’s attitude towards class actions. There is no point including a non-bank-system, that speeds up the process of class actions and minimises the risk involved in class actions - and then include a mechanism that puts them at risk for doing that class action.[/QUOTE]

This is kinda how I see it also.
Killing people is a skill. Between movement, aiming and reflexes, etc. It essentially comes down to who is better, regardless what weapon you have, so if you have a ridiculously tricked out gun or a heavy gun or whatever, it makes sense that it takes longer to equip when switching to yet another gun - it helps balance out the skill vs firepower involved in firefights.

Objectives on the other hand, are more of a team effort and don’t really require a great deal of skill for the individual himself to complete - you go to where you need to go, you hold a button down, it completes. Yes, you need situational awareness and such, but the individual skill needed to outgun a player vs completing an objective, are at opposite ends of the spectrum. This, coupled with the fact that Brink is an objective based game, I can see weapon switch speeds being affected when switching weapons, but it being universally the same when switching from tool to weapon, so no matter what gun you have, your ability to defend yourself when “doing the right thing,” and trying to complete the objective, isn’t penalized.

Killing people is going to happen regardless - Everyone is gonna have to kill somebody, so if you want the badass gun, you get a penalty when switching between weapons. Everybody is not necessarily going to be completing objectives, so those players that do should not have a penalty against when /if they need to defend themselves. I see it as another “perk” for doing the right thing and trying to complete the objective.

Seeing as the game is focused around completing objectives and they already “bribe” the player to do them by smothering them with XP, making sure that switching from weapons to tools is the same for everyone, helps assure that regardless of what weapons you have, no one is at a disadvantage to defend themselves when completing objectives. I see it as another mechanic SD would do to promote helping the team and complete the objectives, vs just standing around killing people.

(tokamak) #71

Doing objectives and fighting over them are not two seperate games, they’re both a team effort. They’re not both ends of a spectrum at all, they both belong in the sphere of actions one player can chose to take in a hostile environment.

Having a fully kitted out or a heavy gun should take more time to equip or unequip whether you want a different weapon or do an objective. That way players can chose to have an advantage in the objective field should they chose to. Better organised teams can even divide roles and make sure that there’s always one dude who has an empty light weapon as well as a few objective perks so he can be the specialist.

Making it equal for everyone just removes a bit of texture from the game. You’re removing the choice whether to specialise in doing objectives and the chance for players who aren’t really combat-savy to be better at other things.

(LyndonL) #72

I agree with Tokamak for a change. Why put the delay in the guns at all? Isn’t the whole point of the game to DO the objectives, so if you’re doing it right the objectives are where you’ll be spending a large portion of your time? So why then completely negate a dynamic that serves to BALANCE the game?

(Cankor) #73

Exactly. It makes no sense to make it a penalty for weapon switch speed so you can trick your gun out and then not have that penalty apply where it’s most important: going from no gun to a great big giant gun.

I would be pretty surprised if the weapon’s equip speed doesn’t apply when switch from tools, despite what you guys are saying it just doesn’t make sense (at least not to me).

And saying it again, this brings back some of the skill involved in doing the objectives and replaces that previously required for pre-selecting tools: instead you pre-select a fast weapon before you jump on the thing in case you need to leap back and defend yourself quickly. It’s a way to reward people for playing smart at the objectives and choosing lighter weapons with less crap haning off them. All kinds of reasons to make sure equip speed is applicable in this situation, no good reason to do otherwise.

(H0RSE) #74

And saying it again, this brings back some of the skill involved in doing the objectives and replaces that previously required for pre-selecting tools:

for it to bring back some of the skill that was involved with pre-selecting tools, it would have to have involved skill in the first place - which it didn’t.

(LyndonL) #75

Irrespective, there’s no point having a mechanic in place, then completely ignoring it when it matters most.

(H0RSE) #76

That’s kinda the point - it follows the whole “friendly for everyone, helping the team/completing objectives comes first, kills are secondary,” formula that Brink keeps showcasing.

Besides, I’m not saying this is how it should work - I’m saying this is how I think it works.

(LyndonL) #77

To what extent do you take “friendly for everyone”? Auto Aim? That then allows us to focus on objectives and not have to worry about that nuisance business of having to shoot the enemy.

I think that if they’ve implimented it in one place, it would be stupid to ignore it where it counts. You’re MUCH more likely to be changing weapons from tools than from a primary weapon to a secondary. I sincerely hope that they don’t ignore it for going from tool to weapon. It doesn’t make sense to do it the other way at all!

Exedore? Yoohoo??

(H0RSE) #78

To what extent do you take “friendly for everyone”? Auto Aim? That then allows us to focus on objectives and not have to worry about that nuisance business of having to shoot the enemy.

Actually, no it doesn’t - it’s auto aim, not auto shoot - and you would still have to switch to a weapon first.

I’m simply saying that if they want to encourage players to do objectives and such, having it so everyone can switch from tool to weapon at the same speed, deters any frustration players might have when attempting objectives. or players with monster guns saying, “no way! my guns too big and slow, let someone else do it.” By assuring that switching from weapon to tool is the same for everyone, it eliminates another headache and/or excuse for players not attempting objectives. It just seems like something I can see them implementing. At the very least, I can see switching TO your tool being the same for everyone.

Brink also differs from previous games with objectives, since you can’t arm another players charge. In ET and QW, if you were doing an objective and stopped to fight off guys and died, a teammate could finish arming your charge, so it wasn’t a total loss. In Brink, if you stop, there is no left over charge for teammates to finish - you have to start all over again (as seen in the bomb defusal vid.) This makes stopping mid way a lot riskier and potentially, a lot more counter-productive, which makes assuring player can switch back to their weapon quickly, a lot more crucial. It also leads to less people actually stopping midway, and just trying to plant the damn charge.

You can argue, “well then it adds even more depth to the game,” and yes, to veterans of SD games, it would, but Brink isn’t catered specifically for SD vets - one of its goals is to attract new players and that may include, as you guys like to say, “dumbing it down,” with a mechanic like this.

I prefer to say streamlining and making the game more accessible to wider audience, and overall, more fun.

(Humate) #79

[QUOTE=Cankor;246675]Exactly. It makes no sense to make it a penalty for weapon switch speed so you can trick your gun out and then not have that penalty apply where it’s most important: going from no gun to a great big giant gun.
[/QUOTE]

Makes perfect sense.
It balances the ability to go from one powerful weapon to another powerful weapon.
The equip speed is not there to prevent players from defending their own charge.
Its there to prevent mass rape.

(LyndonL) #80

I can see bringing the tool up being the same speed for everyone, but bringing the weapon up: I don’t see it.

I guess time, or a friendly dev, will tell.