Beta!?


(PixelTwitch) #1

Come on guys…

The game has reached an unplayable state for me now, and I do mean literally unplayable. Since the last update an issue that was happening fairly infrequently is now happening dozens of times a match. Basically, at random times (however, quite often after an explosion) my game will halt rendering completely for 2-3 seconds. I say halt rendering rather than freeze because the game continues running, just without me being able to see it. In fact, I am still able to hear my actions during this time, for instance, if I shoot I hear my weapon fire. Once the render stats up again, I am either synced with what my actions where during the halted render time or I will be in the original position and then warp to the correct place a couple of hundred milliseconds later. The frequency of this makes the game unplayable and very frustrating.

However, that is not the only issue I am having. Since the Containment War update and the latest fine tuning update, there have been dozens of bugs introduced to the game. What makes this such an annoying problem is that many of the bugs, glitches and exploits that were introduced, have actually been in the game at some point or another in the past, and been fixed. Here is a big list of just some of the issues I have run into within the last couple of weeks.

[ul]
[li]Elevators no longer make sound while being used.
[/li][li]Stokers Molotov Cocktail now does very limited damage to objectives (not in patch notes).
[/li][li]Players are sometimes invisible.
[/li][li]Mercs sometimes spawn with the wrong loadout and/or abilities.
[/li][li]Secondary objectives are sometimes rendered in the wrong state.
[/li][li]Turrets some time shoot silently and without warning.
[/li][li]Dying while throwing packs or using abilities can use all available packs and/or grenades.
[/li][li]Redeyes smoke grenade timing no longer matches animation (slow throw).
[/li][li]Healing station now no longer plays a sound when entering radius and starting healing.
[/li][li]Big drops in frame rate when getting in a close 1 vs 1.
[/li][li]The audio that plays when getting hit is now far too loud.
[/li][li]Objectives showing wrong state in cinematic sequences.
[/li][li]EV is sometimes invisible to players.
[/li][li]Increased frequency of players warping during strafe battles.
[/li][li]Players going up and down none flat surfaces appear to stutter step.
[/li][li]MG nests sometimes appear invisible.
[/li][li]Sometimes see a black rectangle in the center of screen when respawning.
[/li][li]Wrong audio plays during cinematic sequences.
[/li][li]Some objective warnings are very delayed.
[/li][li]Footstep audio seems to be much quieter.
[/li][li]General performance seems to have decreased substantially.
[/li][li]Redeyes inferred vision not always showing enemies.
[/li][li]Certain audio queues seem to not be synchronized (delayed reload sounds and revive sounds).
[/li][li]No firing animation or wrong weapon in hands of enemy.
[/li][li]Game goes into the wrong map after a lobby sequence.
[/li][li]Lobby not always saving my loadout changes.
[/li][li]Fire can vanish when hitting small ledges (come on guys this was in the game years ago)
[/li][li]& much, much more…
[/li][/ul]
All the things listed above are either NEW bugs, or bugs that have been reintroduced very recently. These are also just the bugs that I have witnessed in the new build so there are almost certainly many more. Also, to be clear, I have not listed any of the spectator bugs that were also recently introduced. On top of all this there are hundreds, if not thousands of other individual bugs and issues waiting to be fixed. What really makes this all the more concerning is that I honestly can’t remember the last update that fixed more bugs than it introduced! Granted, there have been updates and patches that fix much more serious bugs than they introduce, but does that mean its “ok”?

Forgetting bugs for a moment… The progress on meaningful updates and improvements is far too slow. The game has been in open beta now for around 6 months (we will get back to this later) and it still lacks many important features. Not to mention that many of the features and mechanics in the game are still what many would class as “minimum viable product”. I have been playing the game for around 18 months now and I can honestly say not only do I have much worse performance and a game that also looks worse in some ways but we also have so many really small bugs that have not been fixed. Instead it seems like its more about content then polish which would be fine if the average person that downloaded the game played enough to even get through the content we already have. In the amount of time it took to get dome we could and should have seen the rest of the maps improved. Not only design wise but simple things like collision mapping and fixing some art issues. Terminals forward spawn STILL does not have a texture applied to it!

This post was made because of something I saw in-game today. 3 low level players complaining about the game, with 1 of them angry he paid for the starter pack. His argument was that he would not have paid if he knew the game was in beta. That’s when it hit me… Sure the game has an easy to miss beta warning on the front page and in game but where else is that warning these days? Both the steam front page and the official Dirty Bomb page does not mention beta at all. This guy had watched a video (paid for promotion) thought the game looked good so got the starter pack and then realized he was crashing and low fps. He even said he did not know the game was in beta.

Why this worries me so much is that if your willing to spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on promoting a game, charge for stuff and remove all beta warnings from official channels… Your not only asking for trouble but it tells me that this is the game as it is… Sure things may get a bit better with updates and stuff but kinda “deal with it”. I feel that the marketing right now is really sketchy and from my perspective the game is already feeling like its in the cash out stage. I am no longer confident that even the smallest bugs will ever be addressed!

The problem with Dirty Bomb is not LACK OF CONTENT! It’s how it feels to play and the lack of refinement that every single aspect of the game struggles with! I like all the guys that I have seen/met/spoken to from Splash Damage and I honestly believe they have what it takes make a great game! I’m just not sure its going to happen…

Makes me sad :frowning:


(Nail) #2

try again next year, maybe you’ll like it then

btw, it says BETA everywhere in game


(Smooth) #3

Lots of good points raised, we’re actively pushing to get more bug fix and polish time available for each release.


(PixelTwitch) #4

Which would be cool but it honestly feels like the releases should stop and the polishing should start. You guys have a great game that is bogged down by horrible implementation and refinement. Adding stuff at this point is just adding even more problems :frowning:


(Protekt1) #5

I am not encountering any major problems other than the lack of new content. So I definitely disagree about stopping new content to polish. Both can happen at the same time.


(PixelTwitch) #6

I have to completely disagree, the game is a mess…


(mcaso123) #7

I would rather have a game run and function well in a state with low content than a buggy mess with lots of content.
One of the issues I’d like to address about the game is lack of user support for commands.
I think one of the things people liked about this game in early closed beta is all the refinements people could do to the game to make it run more fluidly.
Getting rid of minimaps, config optimizations, even disabling particles.
Now, I uset to run this game @ 300 fps on a config with a 960 and a 4790k not ocd.
I now run a 6700k @ 4.8 and dual zotac 980 ti amp extremes. I don’t get anywhere near that fps anymore even on low.
Infact, I got around 90 fps before I switched over to win 10 and used one of the more updated configs that still work with the game.
Plus with the ability to **** with commands, it just made the game function better to be honest. Performance is a big issue in a game like this, where one of your main worries is fast reactions and good tracking,which is hard at low fps.
Another thing is the streamlining of this content for a pub audience. The higher up player side of the game is slowly dieing for good reason, because the lower level populus is being kept in mind. Snipers and sparks, one of the highest skilled classes to play in my opinion, are now bogged down highly, vasili being essentially useless now. His main job was to kind of weed out enemies and get opening picks, and if you’re in an enviornment where anyone has a clue what they’re doing medic wise, you’re ****ed, because you can’t gib in time. Not to mention most of the classes put on free week and getting buffed are classes which rely on gimmicks instead of skill (fraggers grenade being low time, fletcher nades, proxy mines). You can simply run in throw a couple bombs within a 10 foot radius and rape with fletcher in pubs, and with proxy mines just suicide run in and blow em up on yourself. Abilities and the easyness of them has started to take place of the true skill of this game, its kind of sad.
The game has lots of potential but if sd keeps focusing on trying to branch out of their current formula its only going to create more problems.
I also think we can all agree execution is mostly useless due to the lack of balancing in teams making it very one sided, as well as overall not great map design, although Market is decent for what its worth.
When I played Dockyard I had high hopes cause it was actually a map that I could see myself playing and enjoying, yet we’ve been seeing more priority towards other things that aren’t for the better of the game.
Not to mention that pings are getting higher and higher for some reason across all servers.
The games optimization, gameplay and fps wise has just been going downhill. The formula that made this game great and reeled alot of people in is slowly taking a spiral down the toilet, and lets be honest, the beta sticker slapped on this game is no excuse for what the game has become. The game was better when the sticker on it said “closed beta” or even when it was in Alpha, so that voids that excuse.


(fubar) #8

As usual.

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to PixelTwitch again.


(Rémy Cabresin) #9

I’m getting so close to giving up on DB, I’ve always been a big fan of SD and I think most of the guys there are great people. But the disappointments in trying to play Dirty Bomb, especially competitive, is just piling up again and again. DBNation and DirtyCups get a lot of **** for “incompetence” but the majority of their issues is also down to DB just missing functionality and bugs. We’ve discussed setting up a 3rd party ladder for DB to try and boost activity abit, but even that is impossible as teams can’t even manage a match on their own ingame. We need admins in every server because commands as basic as pausing or map changing are not available to teams properly. Rulesets have to be enforced manually and on good faith because it’s been ignored for months now, DirtyCups figured out after ONE tournament that without a ruleset the game was hopelessly broken yet MM still hasn’t received a ruleset to promote better balance.

Please SD… don’t force us to give up. If you’re stuck on what to do, finish the re-release mercs, make an SDK and just release the game as it is than and let the community take it further like you did with ET.


(Glottis-3D) #10

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to adeto again.


(Runeforce) #11

Welcome to the club! I’ve given up on DB more times that I will count, but each time I come back it’s better then what I could have hoped for when I left.

My personal impression about this thread in particular: Aura; v795!

As for the last part, this is the only thing that has not been confirmed to be their intentions. Aura: v795!

‘SD is making the game I want, but it’s taking toooo damn looooong!’ Only thing I have to add to that is, Aura: v795!


(Protekt1) #12

I’ve seen more people stop playing this game due to a lack of content than anything else. You might have particular issues with bugs but that doesn’t mean that is an issue everyone else shares.


(PixelTwitch) #13

Over 90% of the people that install the game don’t even manage to play 1 full hour before leaving the game never to return.
https://steamdb.info/app/333930/graphs/

I am not talking about subjective bugs here or stuff that other people may avoid.
The audio IS horrible, the graphics ARE dated, matches are NOT balanced.

Obviously people are able to tolerate different things and that must be where we differ.
I would rather play the same 5 maps and 20 mercs from now till the end of time in a game that was made well then what we have now with 1000 maps and 50 mercs.


(Runeforce) #14

[QUOTE=PixelTwitch;541425]Over 90% of the people that install the game don’t even manage to play 1 full hour before leaving the game never to return.
https://steamdb.info/app/333930/graphs/[/QUOTE]

Sounds about like your average Joe. And I would be careful with the word ‘never’.

[QUOTE=PixelTwitch;541425]I am not talking about subjective bugs here or stuff that other people may avoid.
The audio IS horrible, the graphics ARE dated, matches are NOT balanced.
[/QUOTE]

Now you’ve gone ahead and confused me, because you are not usually attempting hardcore ‘self-defeating’ irony.


(watsyurdeal) #15

To be honest, I don’t think this is a beta, this is just as bad as those Early Access games.

Once people are spending MONEY it is NOT a beta anymore, get that straight first of all.

Second, after all the original mercs are back, and we have Turtle as well even, that’s 20 mercs, that should be MORE than enough for a while.

I want to see more maps, some fixes, some ui updates, I want to see you take what you have and REFINE it BEFORE you add anything new like mercs. Get that understood, now, because adding more content in the hopes of keeping people playing DOES NOT WORK. What does it taking what you have and perfecting it, period


(Protekt1) #16

[QUOTE=PixelTwitch;541425]Over 90% of the people that install the game don’t even manage to play 1 full hour before leaving the game never to return.
https://steamdb.info/app/333930/graphs/

I am not talking about subjective bugs here or stuff that other people may avoid.
The audio IS horrible, the graphics ARE dated, matches are NOT balanced.

Obviously people are able to tolerate different things and that must be where we differ.
I would rather play the same 5 maps and 20 mercs from now till the end of time in a game that was made well then what we have now with 1000 maps and 50 mercs.[/QUOTE]

That is the nature of f2p, especially f2p in early access.

My point is that we need more content just as much as we need polish. Personally I think we need more content than polish, but certainly not one at the expense of the other.

I don’t know why you’re complaining about the graphics. Who gives a **** if they are “dated”. They weren’t even noteworthy when the game was first revealed.


(PixelTwitch) #17

[QUOTE=Protekt1;541431]That is the nature of f2p, especially f2p in early access.

My point is that we need more content just as much as we need polish. Personally I think we need more content than polish, but certainly not one at the expense of the other.

I don’t know why you’re complaining about the graphics. Who gives a **** if they are “dated”. They weren’t even noteworthy when the game was first revealed.[/QUOTE]

I give a **** if they are dated and run like **** at the same time.
lol


(INF3RN0) #18

Not more content for me. In most cases it’s unpolished design and repetitive game play. Everyone agrees the game has immense potential at the core and is enjoyable, but all that becomes shadowed by other features or lack there of that limit the experience. Longevity and dynamism is being sacrificed for “accessibility and ease of user experience” and all that has resulted in is that audience calling it “another generic shooter”. Esports has never been my motif, but here are my opinions of things that I feel would massively improve the success of the game.

Priority Issues

*Map/obj layouts/mechanics and general mode mechanics make the game feel like a frustrating grind on attack and overly repetitive on defense. The lack of dynamic map/mode play is culprit to the same design changes (reduction rather) that were made in Brink. The poor mechanics in these areas is the number one problem area with the game experience in my opinion. We will never have good maps without good mechanics- and I believe the mechanics are responsible for the majority of the “bad map” experience.

*Competitive mode has always been a lesser experience than public because most of the time it is a five stack against poorly matched opponents or the main place to run into hackers. Not to mention the lack of any malleable reward beyond a meaningless rank (because in most cases it only represents grinding lesser skilled players). Please understand that solo/duo should exist- the only reason you don’t see it happening statistically is only because of the aforementioned issue of imbalance and five-stacks.

*The loadout card system has likely done more damage to the general player base than you might think. RNG is fine as an alternative option, but as the main mode (in a complete and permanent form) to get better loot it becomes a major turn off. No one is benefiting from the system on either end. This is one of the biggest complaints I have seen from the casual player. I also still think much more unique skins, especially at the highest tiers, will be more beneficial to the financial stability of the game- to the point that even as a competitive minded player would be worth dealing with the potential issues that come along with it.

*Performance has always become progressively worse in my experience. Perhaps it isn’t as wide spread an issue, however in alpha I was getting 200-300 fps with an ATI 6850 and now I typically get 80-150fps on an NVIDIA GTX980 SC on low settings.

More Personalized

*Merc experience is still too inconsistent in my opinion, which I think a consistent vision of ability functionality for all mercs would be most realistically achievable in short term (referring to simple things such as ammo station blocking, alt-fire/usage such as airstrikes being used as grenades, etc).

One of the only things I actually like about Over Watch is the highly unique merc identities that they were able to achieve through variety in general mechanics and weaponry, and the dynamism of their use. Instead of more mercs, I still believe that giving the current set more depth and dynamism would greatly add to the longevity of the fun factor instead of the grind factor. We’ve discussed this topic plenty of times here (ie ability counter system, synergies, unique movement abilities, non-auto damage ults, etc).

Consistent merc design is also an issue I see as something that should be more future proof. Most mercs balance out quite well statistically, however there are many cases where the balance between weaponry, ability, and player skill input do not. It may not be a huge priority for most people, but these differences are widely recognized by the overall player base from my experience.

For example there is no reason for Rhino to be the only merc in the game to have such a low player skill requirement and such a high situational output. A high situational output in any other case typically involves a high skill input, which to most players justifies the outcome.

Additionally you have weapon-based ability mercs that feel very inconsistent. Nader is possibly the most refined experience, where it is very necessary to utilize all of your tools to do well. On the other hand Rhino, Sparks, and Fletcher typically are most effective when using their ability almost all of the time due to the nature of short c/ds or no c/ds.

When it comes to future mercs, I think Phantom is a prime example of a poorly utilized design in terms of how it fits into the meta. Phantom feels like a gimmick for casuals and perhaps that was the point, but that is more due to his lack of a real role for the team. Some examples of how I think a merc like Phantom could have been better utilized; Phantom as an engineer, to which the cloak/shield would compliment for obvious reasons. Separating the cloak and shield, but having them use the same energy bar. Applying a percentage of the shield effect to teammates within a small AoE around Phantom when activated. Of course these are just random ideas I had, but you can see how much better the concept of Phantom becomes when it has realistic value.

Anyway /end… for now :stroggtapir:


(mccrorie) #19

Sometimes I really wonder about this game…

I recently noticed I’m seeing into enemy spawn from spectator mode sometimes. Just randomly…

The other day I shot a Stoker while he was running up the stairs inside the barrier room on Bridge, and when he died he shot upwards onto the ceiling like a rocket! I was just stunned for a second… I must assume this kind of occurrence happens in “competitive” matches too, haha.

Lots of other things are off too, like upon joining a match being able to see the map void while the map body and wireframe assets and character models (blue men) load-in, and my sound is automatically muted with an audible POP every time someone uses the inbuilt mic system! This is super bad stuff and looks extremely unprofessional… I’m not sure SD recognise this as a bug either.


(BomBaKlaK) #20

[QUOTE=adeto;541397]I’m getting so close to giving up on DB, I’ve always been a big fan of SD and I think most of the guys there are great people. But the disappointments in trying to play Dirty Bomb, especially competitive, is just piling up again and again. DBNation and DirtyCups get a lot of **** for “incompetence” but the majority of their issues is also down to DB just missing functionality and bugs. We’ve discussed setting up a 3rd party ladder for DB to try and boost activity abit, but even that is impossible as teams can’t even manage a match on their own ingame. We need admins in every server because commands as basic as pausing or map changing are not available to teams properly. Rulesets have to be enforced manually and on good faith because it’s been ignored for months now, DirtyCups figured out after ONE tournament that without a ruleset the game was hopelessly broken yet MM still hasn’t received a ruleset to promote better balance.

Please SD… don’t force us to give up. If you’re stuck on what to do, finish the re-release mercs, make an SDK and just release the game as it is than and let the community take it further like you did with ET.[/QUOTE]

This is all