A few questions regarding crouching, and jump shooting

(watsyurdeal) #1

  1. Do you think there should be a mechanic in place to reduce crouch spamming? Such as a sort of meter that forces people into a crouching or standing state in they do more than 3 to 5 squats, in a 0.25 second time frame.

  2. Do you think jump shooting should be there, for all weapons? Do you think we can make it more skillful in that your spread widens when you start the jump, as you hit the peak it gets wider, and as you descend it widens again till you hit the ground?

(ClemClem7) #2

Jump shooting must be a thing, but bunnyhopping must not. The problem is to have one without the other.

The idea of reducing the effect if it’s spammed is a good thing, for either crouch and jump. But it’s not a thing everybody will agree with.

For jump shooting, you can reduce the spread when you’re touching a surface (walljump) and increase it otherwise.
Or reduce the spread when your momentum is low (at the peak of your jump)

(watsyurdeal) #3

Well if their accuracy is trash until they reach the peak of their jump, they aren’t much of a threat. The goal is to still allow jumping as a maneuver, but basically make it overall less effective as a spammy technique.

When I say your accuracy is trash, think about the max possible spread for each gun, being immediate upon jumping.

(GatoCommodore) #4

[quote=“Watsyurdeal;32638”]1. Do you think there should be a mechanic in place to reduce crouch spamming? Such as a sort of meter that forces people into a crouching or standing state in they do more than 3 to 5 squats, in a 0.25 second time frame.

  1. Do you think jump shooting should be there, for all weapons? Do you think we can make it more skillful in that your spread widens when you start the jump, as you hit the peak it gets wider, and as you descend it widens again till you hit the ground?[/quote]

who spams crouch? how do you spam crouch?

i thought bouncing to a wall to get speed then shoot a guy in the face is cool m8.
bunny hopping is not efficient and you know that.
wall jumping then cricket smash is better.

(ClemClem7) #5

The problem is about shotgun, on which spread doesn’t act the same, it only increase the area where the pellets go. But it’s not random like with sniper rifle.
This and people who jump-kiratana, you can deal with them, but they’re annoying.

(watsyurdeal) #6

[quote=“ClemClem7;206430”]The problem is about shotgun, on which spread doesn’t act the same, it only increase the area where the pellets go. But it’s not random like with sniper rifle.
This and people who jump-kiratana, you can deal with them, but they’re annoying.[/quote]

True, but the shotguns got enough problems as it is

I mean let’s be honest, they’re trash compared to an M4, the instant kills and simplicity of them is all they have going for them. Personally I don’t see the point of them having headshots, I’d rather they’d just be accurate.

(Dagasawr) #7

  1. i dont think crouching matters to much i play quite a few PUG/SCRIM players that use crouch spam and i think it just adds alittle more diversity to fights.

  2. i think that would be quite a cool mechanic :slight_smile:

(Dagasawr) #8

[quote=“Watsyurdeal;206431”][quote=“ClemClem7;206430”]The problem is about shotgun, on which spread doesn’t act the same, it only increase the area where the pellets go. But it’s not random like with sniper rifle.
This and people who jump-kiratana, you can deal with them, but they’re annoying.[/quote]

True, but the shotguns got enough problems as it is

I mean let’s be honest, they’re trash compared to an M4, the instant kills and simplicity of them is all they have going for them. Personally I don’t see the point of them having headshots, I’d rather they’d just be accurate. [/quote]

i agree that they shouldnt headshot because it would make the kills feel slightly less random

(Amerika) #9

I think limiting the speed at which you can crouch would make the game feel sluggish. I’ve played games that do this and I’ve disliked every single one of them. I dislike people crouch spamming but I don’t see it as much of an issue personally as you can easily beat it/make it work against the person doing it. I think it’s better to have fluid gameplay that feels good as opposed to restricted gameplay that fixes a particular issue. See the mouse 2 melee attack “fix” as an example of what not to do in regards to restricting movement to avoid some other issue.

Jump shooting tends to not be an issue with people who are using automatic weapons. The way DB handles it is just fine in my book as they will not hit me more than I will hit them (even if it’s all body shots). The issue is with weapons like shotguns that can do it at close range. They get a huge spread penalty when you jump but at the ranges people tend to jump with it that spread penalty doesn’t matter much.

As long as the penalty for jump shooting outweighs the your gain in regards to making your TTK go up then I’m fine with it. If you can’t shoot for crap but you live a bit longer when you start mashing jump then I’m fine with it.

(watsyurdeal) #10

I don’t disagree with what you’re saying, just thinking of ways to possibly improve the game.

And the truth is I won’t know till we try it :\

And ironically enough, Counter Strike has done both of these things…

I fucking hate that game, but it’s got some design choices I can respect.

Granted I would make the crouching thing much more forgiving, when I think of crouch spam, I think of some guy literally mashing the key as fast as possible, as opposed to careful timed taps to avoid headshots.

(pumpkinmeerkat) #11

Leave movement alone! If anything, give shotguns more spread mid air and make the bolt actions accurate at the peak of a jump.

(Dagasawr) #12

[quote=“Watsyurdeal;206443”]I don’t disagree with what you’re saying, just thinking of ways to possibly improve the game.

And the truth is I won’t know till we try it :\

And ironically enough, Counter Strike has done both of these things…

I @$!# hate that game, but it’s got some design choices I can respect.

Granted I would make the crouching thing much more forgiving, when I think of crouch spam, I think of some guy literally mashing the key as fast as possible, as opposed to careful timed taps to avoid headshots.[/quote]

i mean csgo and dirty bomb are very diffrent. csgo is a much slower game so to compare mechanics is a bit silly

(GatoCommodore) #13

[quote=“Watsyurdeal;206443”]I don’t disagree with what you’re saying, just thinking of ways to possibly improve the game.

And the truth is I won’t know till we try it :\

I @$!# hate that game, but it’s got some design choices I can respect.

Granted I would make the crouching thing much more forgiving, when I think of crouch spam, I think of some guy literally mashing the key as fast as possible, as opposed to careful timed taps to avoid headshots.[/quote]

i mean you can just shoot the lower stomach and be done with it

this is not CSGO where weapon spread are stupidly big.

(Terminal_6) #14

I haven’t seen a whole lot of effective crouch-spamming or bunnyhopping in my time, but I get accused of bunnyhopping a lot. And I jump a lot, but to me, bunnyhopping has always been about spamming the spacebar while strafing back and forth to throw someone’s aim, which isn’t really applicable in DB.

Unfortunately I won’t be able to play for a long time, so I can’t go and analyze right now, but what is generally considered jump-abuse in DB? imo, the ability to wall jump makes “abuse” widely redundant, but I’ve had decently high-level people call me out.

As for crouch spam, I’ve never really seen it used. I duck every now and then to throw a sniper, but spamming it seems ineffective.

(KUST__LunarTM) #15

Combat Arms recently* put out a patch that limits you to only a certain number of crouches before your crouch gets locked out for several seconds. There could be something like that.

*Not super recent, but sorta recent?

(Sorotia) #16

[quote=“sweetColumn;206429”][quote=“Watsyurdeal;32638”]1. Do you think there should be a mechanic in place to reduce crouch spamming? Such as a sort of meter that forces people into a crouching or standing state in they do more than 3 to 5 squats, in a 0.25 second time frame.

  1. Do you think jump shooting should be there, for all weapons? Do you think we can make it more skillful in that your spread widens when you start the jump, as you hit the peak it gets wider, and as you descend it widens again till you hit the ground?[/quote]

who spams crouch? how do you spam crouch?

i thought bouncing to a wall to get speed then shoot a guy in the face is cool m8.
bunny hopping is not efficient and you know that.
wall jumping then cricket smash is better.[/quote]

Except it is…just it isn’t as long distance as it used to be.

(GatoCommodore) #17

[quote=“Sorotia;206473”][quote=“sweetColumn;206429”][quote=“Watsyurdeal;32638”]1. Do you think there should be a mechanic in place to reduce crouch spamming? Such as a sort of meter that forces people into a crouching or standing state in they do more than 3 to 5 squats, in a 0.25 second time frame.

  1. Do you think jump shooting should be there, for all weapons? Do you think we can make it more skillful in that your spread widens when you start the jump, as you hit the peak it gets wider, and as you descend it widens again till you hit the ground?[/quote]

who spams crouch? how do you spam crouch?

i thought bouncing to a wall to get speed then shoot a guy in the face is cool m8.
bunny hopping is not efficient and you know that.
wall jumping then cricket smash is better.[/quote]

Except it is…just it isn’t as long distance as it used to be.[/quote]

its not about the length of the jump, its about the sheer terror of a guy getting pellets in the face.

(doxjq) #18

What guns are actually affected by jumping any way? If I know I’m going to lose a battle because I’m low in health quite often I will quickly double jump off a wall as a distraction and tbh with the Stark and Grandeur 9/10 times my bullets go exactly where I aim them.

Does wall jumping not affect the spread the same as just jumping or am I just getting lucky / is the added spread so small you’ll barely notice it?

(moccasinSign) #19

@Dox

I think it’s a bit of both luck, small spread and the fact that you’re somewhat close to your opponent so the bit of spread won’t matter much. That’s what i think, but it would be interesting to see it put to the test. I have had the same experience though, especially with the grandeur… I can definitely feel the spread increase with burst/auto weapons though, i think.