XP and the mission system

(Apoc) #21

[quote=jazevec;211509]

Brink throws W:ET wisdom out of the window. It’s not a secret to anyone familiar with MMORPGs that they’re so succesful because they reward mediocre players. Any mediocre player can get to max level with time. Today, MMORPGS reward mostly patience and dedication of time. Few or none of them reward skill. Most likely, a player with high level rewards in Brink will just mean a lot of patience, not a lot of skill.

I don’t like that. In theory, I could see ways to make xp growth strongly dependant on skill and performance, but I doubt that’s where Brink is going. I think the rewards are a nod to mediocre players. Unless, perhaps, all reward gadgets require high skill to use… and we know Brink is a console game with PC port.[/quote]

Firstly i hope that brink, will have the only unlockable rewards as outfits and stuff, not performance enhancing things, as that just unbalances it for new players.

Secondly i also hope that brink is not a console port. I cant see why people cant make little changes to suit the platform :\

(DarkangelUK) #22

With the whine and stick that developers get from some of the PC community, it’s quite easy to understand why some devs would make the switch to consoles… far greater return for far less bitching. Not saying console players don’t whine, they just don’t have that snobby elitest ‘i know better than you’ attitude about them when they do.

(Rahdo) #23

Well, the mission system exists for 2 reasons primarily:

  1. level the playing field a little so that players who are new to a given map can still actively contribute to their team’s success, even when playing with guys who know the map like the back of their hand

  2. ensure quick and efficient communication between players.

the 2nd one is why you’d still have auto-chatter tied to mission selection. if i’m a medic, and you’re incapped, if i select the mission to revive you, you automatically hear my character saying “hold on, medic inbound!”. no one else hears it, but you do, and you need to hear that, so you know whether to tap out or wait for me.

same thing is true if you’re out of ammo and i’m a soldier who’s going to bring you more. it’s true to a lesser extent for other intra-related team stuff, but it’s always nice to know that some engineer is on his way to improve the power of your gun. you might even wait a second before charging the enemy, if you know the buff is coming.

(Rahdo) #24

it does take distance to targets into account for priority, but even more important, it takes into account what you’re looking at. so if you’re a soldier looking at the support column that you have to plant a bomb on, if you tap the mission key, you’re going to declare to your whole team “going to plant bomb on the support column!” (which is good for them to know). but if you’re looking at some teammate who is out of ammo and tap the mission key, he (and only he) will hear you say “ammo inbound!”, and that will be your mission.

if you’re not looking at anything in particular, that’s when tapping the mission key will take into account your class, what’s going on in the mission, and your distance to stuff, and automatically pick for you a mission.

and the HUD makes it clear what you’re going to get when you tap the mission key, before you do it. if you don’t like the one it’s going to assign you, you can hold it instead, and choose one for yourself.

(WhiteAden) #25

big thing about console players is that half of them won’t bother posting on forums about their whine… school example for this is a friend of mine, he whines about almost every game he buys, (minor issues he had with it mostly) yet keeps playing & buying new games… he doesn’t bother posting them somewhere to get it fixed/explained to him… he just complains to his friends… lol

(Cankor) #26

[QUOTE=Rahdo;211533]it does take distance to targets into account for priority, but even more important, it takes into account what you’re looking at.
[/QUOTE]

That seems like a great way of doing it. Sounds like I just lost one of my mouse buttons for binding the mission button to as that mission button is going to be pretty important (so please implement context binds for weapons so us gimpy left-handed guys can have our mouse buttons perform different functions with different weapons).

In regards to permanent unlocks, I can’t see any way this won’t encourage padding. And as others have said, SD knows temporary unlocks are the right thing as proven by how they designed the ET games, but they apparently know as well that they will sell more games with permanent unlocks because that is what the majority wants. COD4+ found a way to please both camps by limiting the unlocks with the perks system where only a few could be in play at any one time, it sounds like Brink will have something similar?

(MILFandCookies) #27

From the selection of items and abilities you have unlocked… you are limited to how many you can use in game. Forgot the specific number.

(3Suns) #28

I agree. It is good, and I like.

And the entire mission select system sounds (and looks) very intuitive.

:stroggtapir:

(DoubleDigit) #29

[QUOTE=Rahdo;211533]it does take distance to targets into account for priority, but even more important, it takes into account what you’re looking at. so if you’re a soldier looking at the support column that you have to plant a bomb on, if you tap the mission key, you’re going to declare to your whole team “going to plant bomb on the support column!” (which is good for them to know). but if you’re looking at some teammate who is out of ammo and tap the mission key, he (and only he) will hear you say “ammo inbound!”, and that will be your mission.

if you’re not looking at anything in particular, that’s when tapping the mission key will take into account your class, what’s going on in the mission, and your distance to stuff, and automatically pick for you a mission.

and the HUD makes it clear what you’re going to get when you tap the mission key, before you do it. if you don’t like the one it’s going to assign you, you can hold it instead, and choose one for yourself.[/QUOTE]

Here they come again, the ones who don’t like having a dedicated grenade button. Now they have another one to map somewhere on their useless two buttons mouse or 5 keys keyboard. You are doing this on purpose, aren’t you? :smiley:

(Apples) #30

@ jazevec, while I gree on most of your statements you sound really like an elitist guy…

“mediocre” players quite enjoy games too, and I dont see why they should be punished cause they havent time neither envy to get better if they already enjoy the game… Persistant upgrades are OFC silly as hell, but still, its this kind of elitism that splitt the community into console vs pc / noobs vs pubstars / wannabe players vs pro etc etc list goes long.

If you are so unhappy with etqw or brink you can still play W:ET to show the 1337 skills and pown some noobs cuz ya know…its fun :smiley:

(Shishio) #31

[QUOTE=Rahdo;211533]it does take distance to targets into account for priority, but even more important, it takes into account what you’re looking at. so if you’re a soldier looking at the support column that you have to plant a bomb on, if you tap the mission key, you’re going to declare to your whole team “going to plant bomb on the support column!” (which is good for them to know). but if you’re looking at some teammate who is out of ammo and tap the mission key, he (and only he) will hear you say “ammo inbound!”, and that will be your mission.

if you’re not looking at anything in particular, that’s when tapping the mission key will take into account your class, what’s going on in the mission, and your distance to stuff, and automatically pick for you a mission.

and the HUD makes it clear what you’re going to get when you tap the mission key, before you do it. if you don’t like the one it’s going to assign you, you can hold it instead, and choose one for yourself.[/QUOTE]

Awesome and intuitive… Like it.:stroggbanana: But If I may ask, did the 2 side will share the same mission, or did each side will have their own missions, and will them change depending on the fact that we did or fail the previous one?

(3Suns) #32

Shishio, not only will the opposing sides have different missions, but the reasons behind the missions will be different! (I can’t find the interview/post right now, but literally, the reason the Resistance will be attacking is because they think the need to obtain X, while the Security will be defending something because they think it it Z.

So, I think that there is going to be the use of misinformation and false intel. I don’t want to get my hopes up too high, but I think an element of poker “bluff” may even come into play. And poker, as you all know, is the pinnacle of all card and board gaming. That, and Diplomacy because it uses bluffing. :wink:

Rahdo or someone from SD, please nip this rumor in the bud if I am way off base.

(Exedore) #33

Yeah, that’s all present in the narrative side of things; things aren’t very black and white, as with most modern conflicts. The truth will be as elusive as ever. :smiley:

(Cankor) #34

for the one touch mission selection button, hopefully make it so your aim doesn’t have to be very precise when pointing at something (fallen player to revive). If I am running up to some guy to revive him, I never tale a direct path, I will usually dodge radically on the way in and aiming while moving like that is harder. You should be able to just get close.

i.e. huge outsiized hitboxes for mission selection (although I suppose this could be an issue if one hitbox occludes another behind it you really want to select).

For reviving (and I guess healing), an ‘area affect’ communication would be better than targeting a single player, that way you could aim in the middle of a pile of bodies to tell everyone at once you are coming to revive them. If there was only one guy there that’s ok, it just means your aim doesn’t have to be that good.

I’m sure this is harder to implement since the game has to figure out your intent (were you coming to heal those guys or do something else) but maybe within the context of each class it’s easier since there are fewer overall options.

If it’s too hard to do, maybe the area effect could be a vsay (saw that mentioned earlier in the thread) which is an area effect. That way the game doesn’t have to figure out which mission is best, the vsay does it (of course it’s harder to find that vsay button dodging around that it is a single one button does all missions button).

I’d like to add that it’s very heartening to see you guys listening to the community, it seems you’re doing this a lot more than was done on ETQW. Maybe it’s just a perception thing, you’re certainly communicating more, which gives the impression your listening more than was done previously. Either way it should be a win/win because the fans feel like they get to be part of the process and you get the benefit of a large think tank working for you for free (even though some of the “thinkers” are drunk half the time).

edit: I just saw where Rhado says if you’re not looking at anything tapping the mission button will take into account your class, what’s going on, and distance to stuff, etc. Cool…hopefully though select multiple downed guys at once to revive?

(BioSnark) #35

I don’t think the radial mission menu is as streamlined as it could be.

As opposed to a radial I would have much preferred holding down this mission button and just seeing the little mission icons on the screen (like Quake Wars mission waypoints) plus a distance and xp measure. Maybe just display distance and have their size represent how much xp they give (and presumably how important they are to the team). Aiming at them would display more details and releasing the mission button would select. More intuitive and streamlined than opening a menu in my opinion.

(H0RSE) #36

for the one touch mission selection button, hopefully make it so your aim doesn’t have to be very precise when pointing at something (fallen player to revive). If I am running up to some guy to revive him, I never tale a direct path, I will usually dodge radically on the way in and aiming while moving like that is harder. You should be able to just get close.

Like Rahdo said above:

if you’re not looking at anything in particular, that’s when tapping the mission key will take into account your class, what’s going on in the mission, and your distance to stuff, and automatically pick for you a mission.