Which obj map is most in need of a balance rework?

(Wolf_Darkrose) #21

[quote=“STARRYSOCK;c-220790”][quote=“tominatorx;c-220787”][quote=“STARRYSOCK;c-220784”]
I agree. I wish SD would add more cover to spawn areas so they would be extremely hard to attack from the other team. There really shouldn’t be any combat in those areas.[/quote]

Brink had indestructible turrets which protected the spawn areas. I’m surprised Dirty Bomb hasn’t got it tbh.

[/quote]

Yeah, I’ve thought about that too. Or even just something like Overwatch, where players physically can’t go into spawn because of a wall[/quote]

wall would make sense but then snipers would use it to camp. then add in the damage resistance at start yaaaaa.

(AlphaUT) #22

The fact that UG defenders can camp on the balcony and roof once they see a chance. The elevator is just a dead end. Attackers will need to face the attack from roof and balcony while not going to have a chance to push far. Especially when you have Nader or Fraggers or good snipers. A Higher spot is better than lower spot. It has a distance for the attacker to reach the roof.

Same as for attackers, once they see a chance to camp defenders, it is going to be extremely hard for defenders to push back, although defenders’ elevator could actually help. However, defenders have closer distance to the roof, which will help them to get on the roof faster.

On the other hand, Terminal has multiple paths to go, right side tunnel, left side has multiple exists, or mid for trick jumps, etc. Compare to UG, I would say Terminal is way much better than that.

(Press E) #23

[quote=“AlphaUT;c-221060”]The fact that UG defenders can camp on the balcony and roof once they see a chance. Elevator is just a dead end. Attackers will need to face the attack from roof and balcony while not going to have a chance to push far. Especially when you have Naders or fraggers or good snipers. Higher spot is better than lower spot. It has a distance for attacker to reach the roof.

Same as for attackers, once they see a chance to camp defenders, it is going to be extremely hard for defenders to push back, although defenders’ elevator could actually help. However, defenders has closer distance to the roof, which will help them to get on the roof faster.

On the other hand, terminal has multiple path to go, right side tunnel, left side had multiple exists, or mid for trick jumps, etc. Compare to UG, I would say Terminal is way much better than that.[/quote]

Idk, I’ve mostly just been going off the fact that a lot of the Terminal games I played result in attacker spawncamp and a very boring match, more often than any other map.

A lot of people have raised good points about Underground though, the lack of routes can make it very difficult once either side is dug in. Most of my underground matches go smoothly for attackers, but when it does go wrong, it’s absolutely awful.

Well, there are a lot of ways it could be done to avoid this. Such as placing cover so the walls don’t have a direct line of sight to the battlefield, almost like the entrances to public washrooms in real life.
Or simply making it impossible to shoot through.

(DeadAlive) #24

I still think Dome needs some work, although it is much improved now. The problem that still remains with Dome is that it is just too wide, with too many splinter paths. All of the other maps are much more limited, which keeps the action tighter and players closer together for revives.

This is really only a problem on the last 2 objectives.

[quote=“Sploosh;c-220695”]Terminal has 2 objectives that cause some issues. The generator is often the “main focus” rather than the forward spawn and planting the C4. People focus too much on the generator and not on what’s important: the forward spawn. I think a big problem is that the forward spawn isn’t noticeable. It’s not really marked on the map so people don’t realize it’s importance. It’s essential to win, generally speaking. People don’t defend or go for it which has cost me tons of games. I end up being the only one while the rest are waiting in the generator room rather than pushing the main objective.

Maybe some tutorials for these things would help, but probably not. [/quote]

You know, I know about the F-spawn but…I tend to forget about it. :confused: You’re right it should be better marked on the map. It needs a big fat hud symbol, the symbol needs to periodically pulse on screen as a reminder, and the narrator instructions at the beginning of the map should mention it as well. Add those things in and it would help a ton.

I agree. I wish SD would add more cover to spawn areas so they would be extremely hard to attack from the other team. There really shouldn’t be any combat in those areas.[/quote]

Yeah, add some intermittent partitions on the ground leading up to the obj, and then how about an elevated, semi covered walkway down the middle, close to the ceiling, and the end of it is just a drop off on to the obj roof.

(GatoCommodore) #25

make the objective icon dissapear if you go ADS

its really annoying when you cant see anything because the Yellow Icon is hindering my vision

now i get why adam jensen said “i didnt ask for this”

(Donbot) #26

Joins Underground “Match Just Started”
Spawns at Defenders’ final spawn point.
C4 already planted.

(pr0nflakes) #27

Bridge has a great design fault in the last stage. Bridge is to be modelled on Enemy Territorys map “Goldrush”, nearly a 1:1 conversion. In the original Goldrush, Defenders spawn in the middle between attackers spawn and objective and have therefore the chance to break the line. But on Bridge, Defenders need have to run after the Attackers once the Obj is taken. This is a big flaw in map mechanic which imho needs to be fixed.

(Xenithos) #28

I’m going to be straight up honest, I don’t think ANY of the maps NEED a rework. I WANT a rework of Terminal though, since after the MOFO update, I’ve never WANTED to NOT take that closer spawn until now. Once Attackers get that forward spawn, defenders seem to get a huge boost considering the only way up there now is on a difficult jump on the right that seems only easily doable with lighter mercs…

I also believe that Underground and Bridge could have very slight alterations to improve flow, and open up further opportunities for both attackers AND defenders.

(Nail) #29

all the maps need work

(Press E) #30

@sweetColumn I just move over slightly so it’s not covering whatever I need to see, lol

(GatoCommodore) #31

@STARRYSOCK try that on the crouching proxy that is trying to return the objective

(K1X455) #32

[quote=“Xenithos;c-221138”]I’m going to be straight up honest, I don’t think ANY of the maps NEED a rework. I WANT a rework of Terminal though, since after the MOFO update, I’ve never WANTED to NOT take that closer spawn until now. Once Attackers get that forward spawn, defenders seem to get a huge boost considering the only way up there now is on a difficult jump on the right that seems only easily doable with lighter mercs…

I also believe that Underground and Bridge could have very slight alterations to improve flow, and open up further opportunities for both attackers AND defenders. [/quote]

Among the cosmetic changes is the change of “C L A M S” to “CLAIMS” in Underground… :smiley:

What sort of clams are being sold at a terminal? Snack food?

(Press E) #33

[quote=“K1X455;c-221149”][quote=“Xenithos;c-221138”]I’m going to be straight up honest, I don’t think ANY of the maps NEED a rework. I WANT a rework of Terminal though, since after the MOFO update, I’ve never WANTED to NOT take that closer spawn until now. Once Attackers get that forward spawn, defenders seem to get a huge boost considering the only way up there now is on a difficult jump on the right that seems only easily doable with lighter mercs…

I also believe that Underground and Bridge could have very slight alterations to improve flow, and open up further opportunities for both attackers AND defenders. [/quote]

Among the cosmetic changes is the change of “C L A M S” to “CLAIMS” in Underground… :smiley:

What sort of clams are being sold at a terminal? Snack food?[/quote]

It’s intentional, lol. Apparently it’s a reference to some “Oyster Card” or something they have for the London Underground

(bgyoshi) #34

Chapel doesn’t need a balance change, more like a design change. The fact that spawn camping is an actual required strategy is pretty crap.

(Press E) #35

I think the whole idea behind Chapel is that the first stage is supposed to be completed almost instantly. It’s not really supposed to be defended that extensively, which is the reason the layout heavily favours attackers in that stage.
It’s not a required strategy, it’s supposed to progress almost instantly. And if it does end in spawn camping on that first stage, it’s doubtful the team would have made it farther anyways

(bgyoshi) #36

I think the whole idea behind Chapel is that the first stage is supposed to be completed almost instantly. It’s not really supposed to be defended that extensively, which is the reason the layout heavily favours attackers in that stage.
It’s not a required strategy, it’s supposed to progress almost instantly. And if it does end in spawn camping on that first stage, it’s doubtful the team would have made it farther anyways[/quote]

In my experience, there is always at least several minutes of fighting in that first EV area before repairs, unless the defending team is entirely incompetent.

Once the EV reaches the second corner and attackers start spawning there, it’s nigh impossible to competently defend and avoid firing directly into the attacker spawn location. Likewise, once attackers have pushed the EV into the final turn to the return point, it’s nigh impossible to continue attacking without camping the defender spawn location.

And when returning the EMP as attackers, refusing to aim/bomb directly into defender spawn makes winning a whole lot more difficult.

(wuaffiliate) #37

TBH I don’t find any map specifically stands out as unbalanced.

(Press E) #38

I think the whole idea behind Chapel is that the first stage is supposed to be completed almost instantly. It’s not really supposed to be defended that extensively, which is the reason the layout heavily favours attackers in that stage.
It’s not a required strategy, it’s supposed to progress almost instantly. And if it does end in spawn camping on that first stage, it’s doubtful the team would have made it farther anyways[/quote]

In my experience, there is always at least several minutes of fighting in that first EV area before repairs, unless the defending team is entirely incompetent.

Once the EV reaches the second corner and attackers start spawning there, it’s nigh impossible to competently defend and avoid firing directly into the attacker spawn location. Likewise, once attackers have pushed the EV into the final turn to the return point, it’s nigh impossible to continue attacking without camping the defender spawn location.

And when returning the EMP as attackers, refusing to aim/bomb directly into defender spawn makes winning a whole lot more difficult.[/quote]

None of it is very hard to stop though, that’s the thing. A good team will push the EV forward so they don’t have to deal with that point (which isn’t that bad anyways).

The idea of that last area is in other maps too. Take Trainyard for example, you have to push the defenders back or you can’t deliver, it’s the same concept. It’s not necessarily a bad one either, because attackers still win a more or less equal amount of matches compared to defenders in Chapel

(Xenithos) #39

I think the whole idea behind Chapel is that the first stage is supposed to be completed almost instantly. It’s not really supposed to be defended that extensively, which is the reason the layout heavily favours attackers in that stage.
It’s not a required strategy, it’s supposed to progress almost instantly. And if it does end in spawn camping on that first stage, it’s doubtful the team would have made it farther anyways[/quote]

SNIP

And when returning the EMP as attackers, refusing to aim/bomb directly into defender spawn makes winning a whole lot more difficult.[/quote]

Um… as far as I can tell, EVERY single map has MULTIPLE objectives and spots where it’s supposed to be camped or circulated frequently. The game is a constant tug of war to get the objectives done. That’s what’s so fun about it. You have to push, and MAINTAIN the ground you’ve pushed. That’s the true reason many people don’t like Dome, is that there aren’t multiples upon multiples of spots for a large constant tug of war. The map is TOO big for the usual feeling in the game to persist on it.

Also, that first objective of chapel? If you bring a nader, a sparks or pocket medic, and an engineer. That first objective is almost always a cakewalk. Just nade the room above and have a kira or something laser the other parts while your team repairs and has a medic station. The only thing that stops this is a skyhammer, in which case you just move out of the way and then resume after the hammer drops.

(Xenithos) #40

I think the whole idea behind Chapel is that the first stage is supposed to be completed almost instantly. It’s not really supposed to be defended that extensively, which is the reason the layout heavily favours attackers in that stage.
It’s not a required strategy, it’s supposed to progress almost instantly. And if it does end in spawn camping on that first stage, it’s doubtful the team would have made it farther anyways[/quote]
SNIP
And when returning the EMP as attackers, refusing to aim/bomb directly into defender spawn makes winning a whole lot more difficult.[/quote]

Um… as far as I can tell, EVERY single map has MULTIPLE objectives and spots where it’s supposed to be camped or circulated frequently. The game is a constant tug of war to get the objectives done. That’s what’s so fun about it. You have to push, and MAINTAIN the ground you’ve pushed. That’s the true reason many people don’t like Dome, is that there aren’t multiples upon multiples of spots for a large constant tug of war. The map is TOO big for the usual feeling in the game to persist on it.

Also, that first objective of chapel? If you bring a nader, a sparks or pocket medic, and an engineer. That first objective is almost always a cakewalk. Just nade the room above and have a kira or something laser the other parts while your team repairs and has a medic station. The only thing that stops this is a skyhammer, in which case you just move out of the way and then resume after the hammer drops.