This will be controversial.

(Humate) #101

Shooting is actually a preventative measure to reviving as a Medic.
The more players you kill and gib in the moment, the greater the numbers advantage, the less chance of your teammates being killed and the less revives you need to worry about.

(Poster_Boy) #102

[QUOTE=LyndonL;273206]Your face is a stupid head
/fact

sorry.[/QUOTE]

:frowning:

/sadface

(Weeohhweeohh) #103

So heading into a full on fire fight as a light medic is a good idea? Sure if i hang back with a light rifle and whittle down enemies (hopefully steal some kills), am I contributing to the tea? No, I will try to buff my kills and not my team. If I am focused on keeping the heavy hitters/objective cappers alive am I not helping my team out? Yes. Sure I could snipe (most likely away from my team) or I can smg people in the face (or in the effective range of the smg) but if I’m more worried about kills and not keeping my teammates up/reviving them, why not play another class? I will do dmg and shoot a lot of shots while assisting my team, but if it comes down to giving a dmg dealer/objective capper hp/a revive, I will heal/revive. That is just my opinion.

(Weeohhweeohh) #104

All I’m trying to say is that if I, being a medic, focuses on keeping damage dealers up so that they hopefully take out key players (other scalpers or players trying to get objectives) do their kills transfer to me? No. I was the one that got them a few extra kill. The kills that turned the tide of the battle. I am living and killing vicariously through them. If I was not there, they wouldn’t have kill that guy that was .5 seconds away from planting that bomb or repairing that bot. If I build a toon totally focused on buffing the team (while dealing low dmg and not completely focused on killing blows), am I not contributing to the team.

I am playing a bit of the devil’s advocate here. I’m not necessarily planning on playing a totally team centric build type character, but if I was, I do plan on dieing a lot in the hope of bolstering my team. Just saying, if you see a guy on xbox live with the name of weeohhweeohh, you are most likely gonna be met with a chain gun and a turret.

(LyndonL) #105

“Toon”? WHAT?
Oh Noooo! MMORPG player!

Killing is important to win, reviving is important to win, objectives are important to win. They all work hand in hand. Why can’t people sit in the middle ground. K/D ratios are nothing more than epeen measurements, and mean nothing.

I have played lots of games where the best player on the map has had a K/D of roughly 1.2 and they did most of the work and won the match. Killing is important, but dying goes hand in hand with being in the middle of the action where the enemy is focussing their attention.

(V1cK_dB) #106

[QUOTE=LyndonL;273229]“Toon”? WHAT?
Oh Noooo! MMORPG player!

Killing is important to win, reviving is important to win, objectives are important to win. They all work hand in hand. Why can’t people sit in the middle ground. K/D ratios are nothing more than epeen measurements, and mean nothing.

I have played lots of games where the best player on the map has had a K/D of roughly 1.2 and they did most of the work and won the match. Killing is important, but dying goes hand in hand with being in the middle of the action where the enemy is focussing their attention.[/QUOTE]

I agree with what you say. I’d still like to see MY progress in kill/death. I’d like to know where I personally stand. I couldn’t care less about “epeen measurements”. Maybe all stats should be eliminated. Wouldn’t want somebody getting a “revive epeen”.

(LyndonL) #107

Yeah, personally visible stats are ok. I agree with others though that they shouldn’t be permanent but on a match by match basis.

(Weeohhweeohh) #108

Indeed.891

(DarkangelUK) #109

I don’t mind K/D at the end of a round, just don’t make it accumulative or trackable. RtCW had K/D at the end of the round, but stats weren’t constantly tracked, then they added tracking to some servers and playing on them was very obvious. There was a complete shift of focus from the players and their mentality in-game, and this reflected on the length of the games, the amount of camping, the amount spam, holding back and not taking risks… rather than potentially winning a match, they’d play the safe card so it didn’t affect their deaths.

(Apples) #110

@ Tok : I wont spend too much time because I know it can become pretty circular talking with you, we’ll just play a game once the game is out, and you’ll take a bunch of lemmings who cant kill anything versus a beasts shooter team, and it’ll show you my point I guess… Even if you do a bazzilion revives, the enemy is still here, covering for the objective, and you wont be able to make it.

On the other hand, it is pretty trivial to say that if you have a team only focusing on killing you cant win, if no one do the objective :rolleyes: and even that would work in defence, but by killing the opposite team, you allow your obj guy to do his work, while the opposite is not true, as when you lemming like a mindless… well, lemming, you dont even cover for your mates and usually you end up all dying and getting tbagged. I’m not a super killer myself and I usually play support or whatever float my boat in the peculiar part of the map, but at least I try to kill first, even when I’m rushing with anansi to finish a quick hack for exemple, I dont just rush and crash, I try to kill some enemies first, even if not for me, that are enemies who wont be able to kill my mates for the next X seconds, and that is helpfull.

By “knowing how to kill”, I was pretty unclear, I mean knowing when to pursue a guy or standing in your position, knowing when to sacrifice yourself to kill the objective class, etc etc. It was more oriented as “knowing how to play”, but yes its pretty trivial also.

Anyway, discussing here seems pointless, a game should fix the problems :wink:

(tokamak) #111

By “knowing how to kill”, I was pretty unclear, I mean knowing when to pursue a guy or standing in your position, knowing when to sacrifice yourself to kill the objective class, etc etc. It was more oriented as “knowing how to play”, but yes its pretty trivial also.

Which translates better into xp (as you get more xp for making relevant kills) than bodycount or k/d

(Senethro) #112

Toka, until theres a demonstration that XP is a good metric of anything but your ability to gain XP, its not reasonable to say that.

(tokamak) #113

It is. A mediocre or even a rough distribution of xp is better than just bodycounts or k/ds as at least all if not most actions are encompassed and weighed in it.

(Zekariah) #114

[QUOTE=Wraith;273191]Speaking of controversial. Certain people online and off have been telling me that Brink needs other game modes like TDM or capture the flag in order to be successful.

Care to comment?[/QUOTE]

We aren’t going there again are we?

(tokamak) #115

Well it WOULD make the game more accessible…

(Senethro) #116

Not reasonable to say that either as the relative importance of all the different actions to winning the game isn’t known. You’ve made an assumption that XP will be the best measure of a player’s ability to win the round and whenever someone suggests otherwise, you claim XP wil accurately measure whatever alternative they’ve suggested as well.

Its quite plausible that frags near objectives could be the most important contribution a player makes while disguising gives you the most XP/min. In this case bodycount/game could be a better predictor of w/l than XP/game.

Wait and see.

(Bridger) #117

[QUOTE=Poster_Boy;273204]You can’t complete objectives when you’re dead.

/argument[/QUOTE]

This is a much more succinct way of putting it. I’ll defer to this from now on.

(Bridger) #118

OK, i’ll take this bet. If servers have stats, we can take a look. I predict that 95% of the teams who win will have better K/D ratios than the team that loses. I also think the winning team will have more XP.

(tokamak) #119

Well then.

(JeP) #120

Don’t you understand that neither XP nor K/D will tell you who is the best player ?

SD has just made a choice to promote team action over kills in XP, to help people understand they’re crucial (cause having no more ammo and soldiers around not willing to throw a box is a real pain), cause whatever happens, Brink is still a shooter, it’s still the main element of gameplay and people will kill bad guys and just enjoy seeing enemies fall to the ground, just by itself.