State of Play: Modes, Movement, Mercs, & More

(Kendle) #161

By the same token why reject “what ET did” just because it was ET and ET is not DB? If something from previous games works, why not use it, or at the very least use it as a starting point?

What SD should’ve done is make attacker spawn time = 20s, defenders = 30s, make travel time to objective 15s for attackers and 10s for defenders, then we would have a workable structure on which to build (defender travel time being less means they initially get to the objective first, as they should, difference in spawn time + travel time being less for attackers means the map is offensively biased, which for Stopwatch is imperative).

If they’d done that as a starting point, then tweaked out from there to make the game more “pub” friendly (if necessary, which I doubt) we wouldn’t be having this debate.

ET’s spawn system worked. RTCW’s spawn system, upon which ET’s was based, worked. They worked in comp, and they worked on pubs. They formed an important component of each team’s strategy in comp, and were simple enough for pubbers to understand and employ if they so chose. And none of that is opinion, it’s first-hand experience, which anyone who played either game would almost certainly agree with. Why re-invent the wheel?

(Anti) #162

[QUOTE=Kendle;501338]By the same token why reject “what ET did” just because it was ET and ET is not DB? If something from previous games works, why not use it, or at the very least use it as a starting point?

What SD should’ve done is make attacker spawn time = 20s, defenders = 30s, make travel time to objective 15s for attackers and 10s for defenders, then we would have a workable structure on which to build (defender travel time being less means they initially get to the objective first, as they should, difference in spawn time + travel time being less for attackers means the map is offensively biased, which for Stopwatch is imperative).

If they’d done that as a starting point, then tweaked out from there to make the game more “pub” friendly (if necessary, which I doubt) we wouldn’t be having this debate.

ET’s spawn system worked. RTCW’s spawn system, upon which ET’s was based, worked. They worked in comp, and they worked on pubs. They formed an important component of each team’s strategy in comp, and were simple enough for pubbers to understand and employ if they so chose. And none of that is opinion, it’s first-hand experience, which anyone who played either game would almost certainly agree with. Why re-invent the wheel?[/QUOTE]

This worked too, but not many of us would still want to drive one :slight_smile:

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When we make games we try to improve every aspect, some times it works, sometimes it doesn’t. I think in this case we’re happy to agree that the spawns aren’t where they should be and some of our experiments with them didn’t work.

We plan to fix it although we don’t agree that just extending the potential range of waves times to be from 0 to 30 or 40 seconds is the best way to do it. Your suggestion about more consistent travel times is closer to what we’re thinking of but that requires slightly more intensive map adjustments to achieve…which means the change will take a bit longer to appear in-game.

(onYn) #163

[QUOTE=Anti;501381]This worked too, but not many of us would still want to drive one :slight_smile:

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[/QUOTE]

After all it still has a steering wheel, 4 wheels, luggage space a front shield and is powered by an fuel burning engine. After almost 100 years, you still find all those key components in a modern car just improved in a way that fits the original purpose even better.

We all agree if something can be improved, that it´s better to take the step and change it. But changing something, doesn´t automatically make it better just because it´s different from what we use to play with - even if it seems to work out to some extent.

I think that stuff like spawn times, TTK, (some sort of) advanced movement and different objectives on interesting maps (and maybe objective specialized classes) really are key elements for an “objective based fast paced FPS”. Improving them is totally fine and I think that stuff like the movement, the map and objective design of games like ET:QW can be improved by a lot. New things are already added to the game since the start, like the mercs for example and we all like them.
It´s obvious, that many things (=key elements) were made in past SD games for good reasons - they are congruent and created a gameplay that was enjoyable regardless of bugs, bad hit registration and all kind of different issues the games suffered. Changing one, will most likely cause changes that will affect ALL of the elements and after all making this game definetly not the “objective based fast paced FPS” that this was and still is intended to become I belive.

Just think for a second about how many changes needed to be done, and how different motorcycles have become, just by taking away 2 wheels…

(Erkin31) #164

“Perfection is finally attained not when there is no longer anything to add, but when there is no longer anything to take away.”
Antoine de Saint Exupéry

(BrightIs) #165

I would prefer travel times to be longer than spawn times.

At least you can get into the game faster and not being bored or frustrated at lack of game time.

However if comp players want longer spawn times then perhaps allow settings to be different on different servers. IDK. :confused:

(Kendle) #166

[QUOTE=Anti;501381]This worked too, but not many of us would still want to drive one :slight_smile:

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[/QUOTE]

And yet all modern cars still have round wheels. What you’ve tried to do is use square wheels and a complicated suspension system to smooth out the ride. :slight_smile:

Different != better

(Kendle) #167

Don’t need to be different on different servers, just use longer offensive biased spawn / travel times for Stopwatch and whatever Joe Public wants for Objective, because comp won’t play Objective. I’ve always said treat them as 2 separate game modes and tweak both for their main audience, SW = comp, Obj = pub (for the most part).

(onYn) #168

[QUOTE=Kendle;501390]And yet all modern cars still have round wheels. What you’ve tried to do is use square wheels and a complicated suspension system to smooth out the ride. :slight_smile:

Different != better[/QUOTE]

Thanks for being so much better in saying what I actually mean in 2,5 sentences :smiley:

(BrightIs) #169

+1 Agreed, that’s a better idea!

Sound common sense!

(Smooth) #170

This thread is getting too long, a bit petty and starting to go in circles. Closing.

Please take specific discussions to their own threads in the general forum if you wish to continue :slight_smile: