Rockwall tutorial

(CptnTriscuit) #41

Just found sock’s tutorial a few days ago. Amazing method for rock faces! I used to loath making caves and cliffs, now I can’t seem to stop!

(G0-Gerbil) #42

Well I’m glad you found the original tutorial useful in helping you to produce better cave designs. Once I get some more time I will finish off the next cave tutorials.

Useful is an understatement. I was on the verge of scrapping the caves idea for Helms Deep because all the methods I’d tried before looked crap and took ages (pretty much trisouping etc).
Of course, now I CAN do it I’ve ended up making the caves so bloody big it’s ridiculous… :wink:

(G0-Gerbil) #43

Oh thought I’d mention, I am doing the ground differently too - I am trisouping and making the vertices match up with the bottom of the walls - same goes for ceiling.
It’s not always a straight ‘wall to wall’ effect though, I’m insterting extra tris in lots of places to allow for more interesting effects.

(Chruker) #44

Any pointers on how to make the roof?

I have made a tunnel with a few bends. The wall template I used had a large brush on top so that it could cover the top of the tunnel. But, heh, they don’t met very well, so any pointers?

I guess I ask because I’m unfamiliar with the excact concept of trisouping. Do you just make the entire roof of triangular brushes?

(G0-Gerbil) #45

I have done yes.
You can either do simple spanning (a triangle looking down touches two points on one side of the roof, 1 on the other - you alternate which side gets the 2 connections as needed), or you can insert extra splits in the middle. A screenshot might be simpler…
Currently I’ve just levelled them off, but I intend to go back and change the heights more to have a lot of variety throughout the cave system though.
I can post a screenshot of the triangle stuff if needs be, although that’ll have to wait a while since I’m busy this precise moment.

(Fusen) #46

gerbil I thought you were English? if so how coem you got a foreign XP version =X

BUY VAPORIZER

(G0-Gerbil) #47

Cos I’m living in Colombia in south america at the moment, and bought a new computer to use while out here.
Your choices for languages are spanish, spanish, or spanish :smiley:

(Ifurita) #48

No portugues?

(G0-Gerbil) #49

Not a chance, that’s Brazil only. Trust the largest of the South American countries to choose a different language to the rest of the place!

(Fusen) #50

or… cough warez cough

Ford Center History

(G0-Gerbil) #51

Everything on the computer when I got it was warez.
It’s actually bloody hard to buy legit stuff here.
All they do is burn a drive image onto your HD which contains the OS and a billion bits of software (mmmm encyclopedias - useful!).
The stuff I installed on it is probably the first legit software these computers have seen :slight_smile:

(Chruker) #52

Gerbil, regarding trisouping, you should just have referred me to your screenshot, where we can see the black trinagles from which the roof/floor is constructed.

So, this it what I got so far.

Black triangles are the trisouping and the blue stuff, is the wall templates.

This is what it looks like from the inside, with r_showtris 1

I edited the templates the way Gerbil has illustrated. However only after doing it and rereading the post, I see that :slight_smile:

It was mostly trial and error that let me to it. You have to look carefully to make sure that group-skewing doesn’t mess up the brushalignment, but when thats mastered its really reduces the number of moves you have to do.

My roof looks at bit boring/simple/organized, but I’ll leave it for now and come back if I decide it need some more roughness.

As for stretching and clipping the back of the tunnel wall. That took time and I don’t really know if its worth it, since you only see it in the editor.

(BXpress) #53

hm, i like socks method. i dont have to spend too much time on my cave :wink:

thx sock, nice tut!

(ReFlex) #54

yes, nice tut!!!

i have made the tunnel in my TrueCombat map with the tutorial… :smiley:

Edit: http://www.reflexsuite.com/gallery/map_tc_mine.php

(ratty redemption) #55

eh, Gerbil, remember those converted hereitic2 .map files of mine, I sent you when you asking for boulders and rocks about the middle of last year?

well I know the rtcw .map version didn`t have any tex and was just caulk, but they had brush sheering and trisouping like you and sock have been talking about in this thread, only I was doing stuff like that 3 years ago.

(sock) #56

well I know the rtcw .map version didn`t have any tex and was just caulk, but they had brush sheering and trisouping like you and sock have been talking about in this thread, only I was doing stuff like that 3 years ago

Yes tri-souping and brush shearing have been around for years probably as far back as the quake 1 engine. But there are very few articles about it and most people who do know about it dont seem to pass on the information in an easily readable format, like a tutorial for example.

Remember this is not a pissing contest and there is no copyright issues on who owns want ideas/methods. This thread (and most of this forum) is not about who gets there first or who knows more its simply letting newer people (new to ET for example) know about different ideas and solutions for mapping.

Sock
:moo:

(ratty redemption) #57

oh I wasnt saying Im better, just that Im also experienced enough with some of this stuff to write tutorials, in case anyone was doubting my credentials, which would be understandable as I havent actually released a q3 engine map to the public.

but my q2 engine maps did use very similar techniques to what you and Gerbil recently posted pics of, and in the past I had written qe radiant tutorials for my team mates, but like you say, not many people released to the public decent tutorials …in fact I never even thought of doing so, not because I was being competitive or deliberately keeping secrets, but because the small h2 community I hung out with, seemed to pref mapping buildings, rather then outdoor maps, of which I was one of the only people doing for h2, which was a shame as I had to figure most of it out myself which took months.

plus I was curious why when I saw an early version of helmsdeep, why Gerbil had used a new and very different technique for his cave work, which he then apparently scrapped, in favor of one Id previously shown him the results of (if not explained) in the map files Id sent him.

maybe hed forgotten, but either way thanx to your tutorial, more mappers are now building rocks and caves the way I like to see them being built, which pleases me, as it means the techniques I was using cant be that bad if you guys are now using them, but I agree it`s not important who did them first.

and I know some of the terrain mapping Ive been doing recently, is very tedious and involves too much trial and error for my liking, so Im excited to see what some of you guys can come up with to help me improve my techniques, because Im not totally convinced Im being very efficient, even for hand built terrain.

does that make sense?

(sock) #58

oh I wasnt saying Im better, just that Im also experienced enough with some of this stuff to write tutorials, in case anyone was doubting my credentials, which would be understandable as I havent actually released a q3 engine map to the public.

I dont think I have heard of anyone doubting your ability to do something but if you have a wealth of experience then write it down and contribute towards the community. Turning up telling people that “I was doing that years ago”, “you should have listened to me ages ago” or “I told you so” is not really helpful. :wink:

“respect is earned, not demanded”

Like you say in your signature if you want people to respect you or not doubt your ability then write up your thoughts, post freely sample maps of what you are doing, discuss your ideas with the community. This forum is always looking for talented people to discuss their ideas and offer constructive help to others.

Sock
:moo:

(ratty redemption) #59

cool and I wasn`t actually saying “I told you so” to my fellow rodent, Gerbil, as I had neglected to spell out the advantages to him, of building caves like this, although I can see how my post in this thread could of sounded harsh or arrogant, neither of which I ment …sorry :eek:

further explaining my motives for wanting to help dime in the opposed tutorials, is that I`m soon going to be moving from rtcw mapping to ja (jedi academy) …but as I have learnt tons from the rtcw and q3map2 forums, and a lot quicker then me working stuff out on my own, I would like to give some thing back to the rtcw community, now evolved into your et community.

I have been talking about on the rtcw jolt forums, for about the last 6 months, releasing a series of water test and small terrain maps, but never got round to releasing them as I was constantly improving the techniques I was using, or trying out new techniques like the dotproduct2 blending, and I do feel guilty about “all talk and no action”

but my latest test map, which turned out to be huge and will hopefully become a playable et map, when I finally hand it over to a fellow rtcw mapper to build his castle on as requested, has become the intended source files I want to release as the .map and shaders are the ones I`m most pleased with of my work …although I might offer the older maps up with a few notes, just in case anyone finds them inspiring.

and to be honest, my ego does play a small part in all this, as I would like to be remembered when I leave the rtcw, et community, and your right I do believe in what I state in my signature… so I would like to be remembered for being a talented and helpful member of the community, and not some asshole… not suggesting any one here is, but on the jolt forums, we had a few trolls who tried to hinder our progress at every opportunity, and I personally had very little respect for them.