Making Competition Accesible

(tokamak) #21

I wouldn’t say that. WoW features unrated matches where you can join in for random teams, with friends, or let your friend group be filled in with random players and then enter in for other teams. It’s incredibly fun and widely used.

(kilL_888) #22

just had a thought about the matchmaking system. to ensure this you need stats, right. you collect stats on the master server i guess?!

ok, but there are public (dedicated) servers. how in hell would work matchmaking on dedicated servers? heres how, i hope i get it right:

you have to add a “function” to the server software that communicates in a specific interval with the master server. every few minutes the master server collects info/player stats from the dedicated servers and puts an icon (skill level based icons) on each server in your server browser.

so, now you can choose (an automated function which automatically selects the server which fits your skills most can be added, too) the server you want to play on based on your skill level.

dunno if its technically possible to do such things, but its an idea.

the idea is basicly that you have to implement server funtions that collect stats (in a specific intervall or via refreshing the server list) and generate a server skill level. just like the quakelive server browser but with dedicated servers. pretty easy idea actually, but no one ever built this into a game. only stats you see nowadays are ping and number of players on a server. there must be more possibilities.

(channa) #23

early release of sdk will make the comp scene

(tokamak) #24

That´s exactly my concern. There will be a comp scene no doubt, but I dread it will be just as obscure as the ETQW comp scene.

I think an integrated toolset and team match-making system will at least lower the bar so much that any casual player can at least experience it. After they’ve got a taste they might or might not want to enter in on the self-organised leagues. The whole thing is meant to involve players more without them having to work for it like the comp players had to do in other games.

Just anything except thousands of players being unaware of all this. Brink tries to lure singleplayers into multiplayer, they might as well do it right and lure them into a competitive environment as the next step.

(Cankor) #25

As far as the comments about casual gamers not wanting to get into comp and all that, having an in game screen which allows matchmaking between groups could easily encourage a lot of casual gamers into joining a clan so they can compete with them (this was why I joined GzR after watching some comp on ET.TV), or encourage casual clans to play in more formal competitions.

Myself, I think it’s a great idea because it could potentially open up a whole new world for a lot of players. there are guys who never go to forums, who wouldn’t know this kind of thing even existed. If however there’s an in-game menu that takes you to a ladder (or ladders for various flavors/game types) I think it would be a huge success.

The thing is, being able to schedule instant matches with other teams would require a huge player base, so we’re assuming Brink is as successful as say MW2 or BC2, right? Otherwise, scheduling teams for a later date, how would this be different from a site which has a ladder set up?

(DarkangelUK) #26

It’d be nice to have comp info available in-game, Brink-TV and league demo of the week etc. Casuals can then watch the demo in-game and see some organised play. Pub play and friends is all fine and well, but there’s nothing like watching a well honed team owning it up in a clan match with complete precision.

(Wolfmeister) #27

If you want to play in a clan theres no “easy” way, you really have to do the whole social thing and expect to play at certain days and times.

Theres a middleground though called PUG:s (Pick Up Groups) where a Group Leader, usually in IRC, starts a PUG, sets the skill level (low-med-high) and then wait for players to signup. If the skill level is set to low its agreed that new players will get help to get started. Theres also usually a Voicecom requirement. When the PUG is full everyone is taken to the server and the game starts.
In some PUG channels where players starts to get to know eachother after a while they chose two captains first, one for each team, that then choose their teams. This ensures that the teams will be as fair as possible

I dont know how the mechanics will be in Brink but if theres a World Chat channel of some sorts they could “easily” implement a PUG feature. (in IRC its just a script made of a few couple of lines of code)
Of course, they could do it the hard way with a fancy UI, friendslist connections etc.

PUG:s are a very good way to go from Casual to Competetive playing.

(PSG_Mud) #28

Pugs are very good for that yes. But, not everyone can get to even that level to be acceptable in the social circle.

Just to put something in perspective,

A competitive gamer can be comparison is like Marusz Pudzianowski versus a regular every day joe in an Ironman contest.

Verus

Some people are just not born with the genetics/talent to play games. There comes a point in which talent proceeds skill by a huge margin. No matter how much you practice, train or whatever, you have absolutely no chance to win. In gaming there is normally no divisional rankings or conferences to balance talent in competition. This leaves alot of people out, and alot of potential talent to sit and do nothing.

What if Sports stop having low level competition. Like Highschool soccer/football/track… The end game athletes would diminish in numbers because less people would be playing, working themselves up into the system.

College football here in America have Divisions based of school scouting talent. I, I-A, I-AA, II, III. Teams/colleges can move up and down divisions based on how well they do. But, overall its to divide talent up to avoid “steamrolling.” A 1:1 win ratio for majority of teams regardless of talent means the system is working. This provides competition among peers of your own skill/talent level.

If your average Joe wants to play, but, realizes he just isn’t good enough. There is nothing he can do to make it. My dad is horrible at gaming, he wants to play competitive MW2, but I am sure he wouldn’t beable to even maintain a 1:100 k/d ratio. He is that bad. There is really nothing out there to put him against players of his own talent level, and he gets extremely frustrated playing.

I don’t see how its fair, me playing him. I don’t ever do play against him, and I feel its unnecessary because he can’t beat me if I tried. There is absolutely nothing he can do to play and have fun. Sometimes he gets lucky with the noob tube package I set him up with. He goes crazy over 1 or 2 kills to 20-30 deaths in one game. Its unnecessary for some people with high skill to be playing in games where the level is so low. Its nothing more than an enjoyment from bullying people around, the feeling of power over someone else.

Now, imagine this scenario with someone whos “ok,” but not good enough to compete at the highest level. There comes a point in which, playing to win, isn’t something reasonable to believe in. Thats where divisions come in. RT tournaments and other things that don’t require a prereq. Something my dad could join in, and say hey I played in a competitive match, and got my ass beat lol. But, the point is to get more involved, you have to expand outside of just playing for the “the best.” Because, the best isn’t something viable for people who don’t play.

(MILFandCookies) #29

You dont need to join a basketball club to play competitively, you can rock up to your local court and play a pickup game with a bunch of rands. The end result is the same - a competitive game. However if you want to play in a LEAGUE

(tokamak) #30

I really like that. Simply a list of (easy controllable) serverside demo’s of this week’s competitions is a nice addition. If you’ve got an official rating ladder it can automatically pick the top 5 highest matches played that week.

That as well. Competition doesn’t need to limit itself to extremely high level of play. Just like in online chess you can just enter in and be competitive on your own level (and still aspire to climb that ladder).

(Wolfmeister) #31

If i saw a Iron man contest in my town today and decided that that would be cool thing to do today they wouldnt let me, the system wouldnt let me.
They would expect me to start from the beginning just like in any other competition.

Its the same thing with competetive gaming, youre expected to,

  1. Play well and get to know the maps on PUB:s
  2. Play and communicate well on PUG:s (where the amount of clanners are higher cause they tend to like more organized teamplay using voicecom)
  3. Start your own clan or get invited into a existing one.

All this talk of divisions is fine and all that but if the game isnt doing very well there wont be the luxury of more than one Division and one division usually means that new clans and players get raped over and over again.
Its a sad fact that non war and especially SciFi games have a hard time to get a large playerbase these days. Global Agenda is a recent example.

If Splash Damage put mechanics into the game to make the transition from casual to competetive playing easier it might give a similiar effect that WoW had when it came out. (Got people that usually didnt play games to actually become online gamers)

(Wolfmeister) #32

One thing i always liked in Guild Wars was that they automatically posted the matchresults (“Team A beats Team B by 3-1”) in the World Chat Channel. A simple but effective way to highlight that the game had a healthy competetive scene.