How many of you are glad there are Operatives,not Snipers?

(INF3RN0) #61

Then there are pros who don’t require a crosshair. CSS has some very reflexive snipers.

No offense, but although some might have a misconception about these things… the most able competitive players are all about balance and this is one of those things only newbies cry about. There’s more to the player skill levels than just aim ability, it’s an overall understanding and mastery of the game itself. You don’t hear people complaining about these things when they are playing for a prize, because people that are good enough to take things out of their intended comfort zone are respected for their ability to beat the average humans capabilities. Not to mention you have to aim for the dam head in ET games… that makes CoD snipers look like trash.

(tokamak) #62

In other words, everyone who disagrees doesn’t know how to play the game, or at least, doesn’t go through the trouble of figuring out all the exploits. I can spent a few afternoons practising the quickscope the quickscope and all my points would still stand. Again, my issue doesn’t lie with the difficulty of this exploit. It’s the one-sided confrontation.

(.Chris.) #63

Like when a tank kills an infantry player?

(tokamak) #64

Naturally it’s hard to beat a tormentor with a knife as well.

We’re talking infantry here, more specifically niches within infantry fights. A shotgun is supposed to hold the close combat niche and even that weapon can’t kill in one shot.

(Thundermuffin) #65

[QUOTE=tokamak;379949]Naturally it’s hard to beat a tormentor with a knife as well.

We’re talking infantry here, more specifically niches within infantry fights. A shotgun is supposed to hold the close combat niche and even that weapon can’t kill in one shot.[/QUOTE]
That’s a problem with the shotgun, then; the shotgun is extremely weak in ETQW and is kind of a joke weapon. That doesn’t mean, however, that it should be the only thing to be useful in close combat. You also don’t have a lot of risk with a normal shotgun (one that isn’t ET:QW’s, think Q3 or TF2); you have a big spread, pretty good damage, and a pretty easy to learn weapon. That shotgun gives an okay/good reward for it’s little risk. There’s a lot of risk associated with using the sniper rifle in close quarters, therefore you get a lot bigger reward. To me, it’s nothing more than risk-reward.

Also I’ve played vs INF3RN0 and his quickscoping, and it isn’t a one sided confrontation. It’s completely dependent on how well I shoot and move just as much as how well he shoots and moves. If he shoots and misses then, yes, I should most likely kill him but I can still screw up and miss a lot of my shots and he could get that second chance and kill me.

INF3RN0 brought up CS a few posts up; how are your feelings on quickscoping/noscoping in CS (just using this game as a way to see if you hate it in all games or just ET:QW as I’m truly curious)? You still have a 1 shot kill sniper rifle at any range, but you also have almost every other weapon that can potentially 1 hit kill at all distances too. I’ve been in situations where someone 1 shots me with a scout as I walk around a corner and he quickscopes, but I’ve also been able to 1 hit people far, far away with nothing more than an AK/M16 and heck even a pistol. Do you think that’s fair? It’s the same principle. It all comes down to how well the other player moves and fights back and how well the sniper can react and move. That’s a lot of things that sniper has to account for.

(INF3RN0) #66

[QUOTE=tokamak;379949]Naturally it’s hard to beat a tormentor with a knife as well.

We’re talking infantry here, more specifically niches within infantry fights. A shotgun is supposed to hold the close combat niche and even that weapon can’t kill in one shot.[/QUOTE]

2 body shots vs 1 headshot… hmm I think the shotty is much easier at close range considering the hit box difference. Even someone with a scoped rifle that is accurate can outkill a rifle, and that gun ain’t designed for dat!!!There’s no practice required for quickscoping, just the added unscope if you want that; though it’s not necessary. Just do the zoom+shoot and please post your results. No one ever would have imagined that you could just zoom and shoot at the fastest allowable speed when there’s a target in front of you… exploit… jesus.

(Humate) #67

When I first got the beta of etqw, the first thing I learnt was how to stroybomb. I did this by stroybombing a tree cough until I was confident enough to know the exact distance/time required to get the stroybomb to explode on impact. Then I learnt another skill in being able to rail people as I was strogchutting out of an icarus. I developed the skill as a counter to the icarus sniping.

When you combine both the stroybomb skill and the mid-air rail it becomes a one sided confrontation once the sniper decides to engage. The stroymbomb either kills them or it acts as interference, forcing them out of scope. If they choose to avoid the bomb, they lose their crosshair on the icarus leaving enough time to get railed. The only way they can survive, is if I miss or they somehow get the shot on me anyway.

With rambo sniping, its only one sided based on how the “victim” engages the sniper. The counters available, do not require the same amount of skill - and therefore these counters are available to everyone (unlike dealing with mid-air rails). I will state that it does require game knowledge and battlesense to know what to do in that predicament, but you dont go playing scrabble when you’re dyslexic.

(tokamak) #68

People seem to be under the impression that once they learn a trivial trick, no matter how difficult, they’ve obtained the right of an unfair advantage over other players. Do note however, that my entire point still applies when two people of the same skill (including quickscoping) meet where one player has a sniper and the other any other weapon. It’s tempting to take this smug assumption that people only complain about quickscoping because they can’t do it themselves, at least that deals with the dissonance that all the other arguments against it stir up in you.

(.Chris.) #69

The world would be boring place if everyone followed the rules.

(INF3RN0) #70

It’s a tad more ignorant to categorize something as an exploit with no experience in the field and a foggy understanding of everything that is actually going on. SD didn’t intend for people to be able to scope in and out so quickly, but the actual ability to quickscope was part of the game. It’s not a trick to zoom and then shoot, and those that have faster reflexive aim benefit with the weapon by its design, but suffer under it’s balance measures. The fact that you still seem to have no idea what quickscoping actually is makes everything you say sound like utter nonsense to anyone with experience. In fact it’s all completely illogical from the point of view of a weapon balance expert. A highly rewarding weapon should not be accompanied by an incredibly steep skill curve of use? Don’t they have these things in EVERY good game? What makes this any different… it’s even harder in this situation considering you have to hit the head. Again, quickscoping is the act of zooming in and shooting instantly after… that’s all. The rest is conveniently blurred together with the main act to make it appear as if it’s something more than it is, by the spectators that pose it as an issue. The unzoom is a trick, but comes after the kill and isn’t quickscoping. The weapon swap bug is the exploit. If it appears “too good to be true” in the videos that’s because your gaming abilities are sub-par. Anyone can quickscope, but it’s always the players with good aim that hit a target. That’s just how it is, and it’s been an issue for the same reason why Brink has non-functional guns… because people that think it’s tricks and configs that make things work out of their intended use, but have never actually taken the time to figure out what is actually going on. It’s smug to think you have any qualifications when it comes to taking the substance of your words seriously, especially when they reflect a pure lack of knowledge on the subject. Sorry to be brash, but you’ve only proven that you like to form opinions based on instinctive impulses and self-imagined reasoning.

(tokamak) #71

You negate the sway, the sway has been implemented to make up for the lack of spread on the weapon. SD never intended the weapon to have 100% accuracy.

(INF3RN0) #72

You do realize there is only sway at max zoom? There’s multiple zoom levels…not to mention sway can be easily controlled. Sway only makes it harder to use at a very log distance, which makes you wonder what those other zoom levels might be used for. It is a 100% accurate weapon in the right hands. SD makes the mistake of reading threads on their forums suggesting things, and then assumes that it represents their entire player base. Barely anyone uses these forums, and I really don’t think they should be altering their games based off of feedback here. There’s way too many bad ideas that get thrown around and then when they end up in the game, people say “oh you just didn’t do it the way I imagined it working in my head”.

(beautyyen) #73

I don’t think you should have classes that are just based around a weapon type.

(Nail) #74

I think 5 year old posts are already dead

(freidadye) #75

I agree the operative is nothing like a sniper…