Augment Feedback

(Violator) #21

I have (had? Not tried the new patch yet) 18 augments and not one is for any of the 3 chars I use (Vassili, Bushwhacker, Nader) so not really been able to test. Fragger with the cricket bat was fun though :). Not looking forward to having to grind to get Bushwhacker again :frowning:

(Violator) #22

Once you hit level 9 its a mega-grind to get to level 10, the XP for a match win also seems to be massive compared to anything else. Are we going expect resets like this once the game goes live (e.g. for new content etc.)?

It is very annoying not being able to access your crates etc. from the lobby. As only one server is usualy active and full at a time (due to having no queuing system mainly imho), having to leave to see what you have / unlock new mercs usually means end of session.

The only one I’ve really found useful is the disarm perk on Proxy - makes quite a difference. The reload etc. ones don’t make much diff as I’m usually dead / retreated by the time a clip is spent. Reloading in combat is usually death.

(Mustang) #23

I haven’t found it too bad until level 13/14ish, a slightly flatter exponential curve would be appreciated though, especially if early levels are going to be tied to important gameplay changing features, like merc availability.

(Silvanoshi) #24

[QUOTE=Violator;509050]Once you hit level 9 its a mega-grind to get to level 10, the XP for a match win also seems to be massive compared to anything else. Are we going expect resets like this once the game goes live (e.g. for new content etc.)?

It is very annoying not being able to access your crates etc. from the lobby. As only one server is usualy active and full at a time (due to having no queuing system mainly imho), having to leave to see what you have / unlock new mercs usually means end of session.

The only one I’ve really found useful is the disarm perk on Proxy - makes quite a difference. The reload etc. ones don’t make much diff as I’m usually dead / retreated by the time a clip is spent. Reloading in combat is usually death.[/QUOTE]

Just to make things clear, we have no desire to carry out progression resets once the game goes live. There will be some wipes between now and then though, we want to make sure that the levelling system is sorted and working well before the final wipe.

The lobby situation won’t be quite as problematic once we go live as we’ll have plenty of populated games then.

(Kl3ppy) #25

[QUOTE=Silvanoshi;509094]
The lobby situation won’t be quite as problematic once we go live as we’ll have plenty of populated games then.[/QUOTE]

If the retention rate is not as bad as it was since the last year.
I strongly advise a queuing system because I want to chose which server I join. When a friend is playing on a full server, I want to join the queue so I can play with him/her on the same server even if I have to wait a couple of mins. Keep that in mind and don’t purely relay on matchmaking.

(Silvanoshi) #26

[QUOTE=Kl3ppy;509099]If the retention rate is not as bad as it was since the last year.
I strongly advise a queuing system because I want to chose which server I join. When a friend is playing on a full server, I want to join the queue so I can play with him/her on the same server even if I have to wait a couple of mins. Keep that in mind and don’t purely relay on matchmaking.[/QUOTE]

We’re right there with you Kl3ppy…we want to get queuing in as well :).

(Alchemy) #27

[QUOTE=Silvanoshi;509094]Just to make things clear, we have no desire to carry out progression resets once the game goes live. There will be some wipes between now and then though, we want to make sure that the levelling system is sorted and working well before the final wipe.

The lobby situation won’t be quite as problematic once we go live as we’ll have plenty of populated games then.[/QUOTE]

I really think being able to see if you got a new crate aswell as being able to open it in the lobby would be best. You can do it in between ques in CSGO and change skins/loadouts. It also create some compulsive buying, if you see new shiny box you wanna open that box as soon as possible.

(potty200) #28

After playing an understanding the way you want this to work a bit more I am really worried about how competitive play will work. Will some players have all unlocked with amazing augments while new teams, at a generally lower skill level, will have the basic few?

If I want to play a game competitively I refuse to unlock new stuff. This is why Tribes Ascend did not do it for me. Is competitive play going to remove augments and unlock all mercs/weapons/abilities?

I do not like the fact augments are locked to that card. I would honestly prefer to have all augments unlocked and stick to skins and camo for the unlockable. It has worked perfectly before so it can work perfectly again. Just have super rare things. Foil cards - which are essentially weapons with skins/attachments. (Note: All attachments and augments should be available to new players otherwise this game WILL be brandished as a pay to win system - It has happened to many games before)

(prophett) #29

[QUOTE=potty200;510215]After playing an understanding the way you want this to work a bit more I am really worried about how competitive play will work. Will some players have all unlocked with amazing augments while new teams, at a generally lower skill level, will have the basic few?
[/QUOTE]

Also concerned about this. Make them all available for comp or have a server setting to disable them.

(INF3RN0) #30

Augments are pretty non-impacting. If anything it’s all about refining a preferred play style to a minor extent. If they add a crafting system where you can combine individual parts (under restriction ofc) into the cards you want, then most anyone could craft their most used 3 mercs into exactly what they want by level 10 without a doubt. Either way I haven’t played against an augmented merc I felt had advantage or was stronger.

(potty200) #31

As seen with CS once that was “mastered” the slightest change in game play can affect the outcome of games. When they changed the accelaration people had to change their game up completely.

If one team is willing to invest to get the BEST cards which are super rare to come by they might have a slight advantage even if it is the slightest difference. We all know what the gaming communities are like when you have game changing things like this in a free to play game. They will brand it as pay to win and that is almost a given.

(INF3RN0) #32

The only real difference is the weapons you can wield, which are still balanced anyway; it all comes down to personal preference. BEST card in DB currently has the same effect as putting designer clothing on a basket ball player. If augments in their current state can be proven to dictate outcomes, I’ll glady eat my hat :slight_smile:

(Violator) #33

Some crate stats - still no Bushwhacker cards in two patches :confused: Do they exist?


Merc        Cards   Games Played
Arty        2       0
Aura        5       0
Bushwhacker 0       27
Fletcher    2       0       
Fragger     2       15
Nader       3       48
Phoenix     2       0
Proxy       8       45
Redeye      0       3
Rhino       1       0
Sawbonez    1       6
Skyhammer   2       10
Stoker      0       0
Thunder     2       14
Vassili     1       42

So 5 cards for a class I’ve never played (Aura) and 1 for one I’ve played 42 times, and 0 for one I’ve played 27 times.

The only use I’ve found for them is swapping out for a better secondary and the defuse reduction.

(Humate) #34

I think i have all your bushwaker cards vio.
I’ll trade you all of them for 1 vassili… thx

(Anti) #35

I’ll be looking into the balance of these again at some point this week, so if anybody else has any feedback on specific augments it’d be good if you could post it now :slight_smile:

(spookify) #36

3 pages and only 1 I like…

(INF3RN0) #37

They don’t appear to be imbalanced, but not sure if it’s simply because the impact is so low that it’s hard to tell they are even there to begin with. With the way the card drop system works it’s really quite difficult to acknowledge perk combinations as I usually end up picking the card for the weaponry rather than the perks. Plus with the overall inflexibility of the system I feel inclined to mostly ignore them altogether and get this weird feeling that the higher tier cards are maybe better? It sort of diminishes the idea of perks as being a means to promote my play style. A crafting system or interchangeable perks or both would be ideal to me. The drop ratings ought to only apply to merc/weapon skins, and the player should feel like weapons/perks are interchangeable and meant to procure play style rather than scaling in value.

(PixelTwitch) #38

Ok, so after a lot more time with them lets do this…

FOCUS - Seems decent but overall I still find the flinch mechanic broken due to client side network stuff.

LOCK ON - Seems fair as long as you understand that you are buffing abilities.

SPARES - A very strong perk with certain Mercs (Nader, Sawbones, Phoenix, Fragger and Thunder) but useless for Mercs with Ammo packs.

STEADY - Good for turrets and deployables, could be a frustration factor for mines for both player who threw them and player shooting them.

TOUGH - Good and fair but also useless on medic classes.

UNSHAKEABLE - Awkward really… Does not allow survival of multiple mines, airstrikes, arty strikes and others. When it comes to numbers it seems good but is never the difference between surviving more then one explosion. Only time I would consider this would be if I was playing as a Nader, Proxy or Fragger really.

BIG EARS - Not enough difference.

BOMB SQUAD - Used with a Phoenix card, Current implementation does not work well in certain locations and overall its quite understated. Not as valuable as perks you would be able to use more often. Should come with an audible beeping and/or location put on mini map based on radius.

SPOTTER - The biggest joke of a perk on the list so far. Remove it.

UNDERCOVER - Again, buffing abilities… Seems fair in this case but you need to fix the smoke before making it longer. Also, the smoke often causes more frustration to the redeyes own team then it does the enemy.

UNTRACKABLE - I think the one thing worse then buffing abilities is nerfing them with perks. I feel this crosses the line.

ARMOUR PIERCING - While on paper seems fine. The truth is that due to low general bullet damage, this does still not entice you to shoot the EV in the first place. Either you up the damage to 45% or remove it.

BIGGER BLAST - A huge buff. this could have been handled much bettter if you also decrease the damage of the nades but increase the blast damage a little more. Personally think its a bad idea.

CHOPPER - Waste of time. Even more of a waste on a baseball bat. In general I think all strong swipes from all weapons should do around 150HP damage (this includes the jug) The bat should be balanced on speed of swings and not the damage here.

COOL - Very map/merc dependent perk. Would never use on a user designed card. Overall fair.

DRILLED - OP but I love it. This perk basically is strongest of the current line up and will also be the most desired. I would start by reducing to 20% faster reload in the next patch and then try 30% the patch after till you find the sweet spot. Right now its OP.

EXPLODYDENDRON - Again a buff to a main ability. Personally do not understand why “BIGGER BLAST” is considered a separate ability. Will most likely be the highest desired card on the enabled mercs other than DRILLED.

FAIL SAFE - Only really something I would consider on Stoker and Proxy. This could be stacked on Nader, Fragger and Thunder with UNSHAKEABLE.

ICE COLD - A choice between this and NITROS. I feel ICE COLD should be considered a Defensive ability.

NITRO - Technically I would consider ICE COLD to be the better choice in most circumstances. However for an aggressive Rhino this would likely be an option.

QUICK DRAW - A decent perk but still not as desirable as the quicker reload in the majority of cases.

DOUBLE TIME - Feels clunky in its implementation on Fletcher. I have no real problem but It would consider it more of heavy Merc ability for weapons with long reloads. The concept is good. Without a doubt the more desired Scout perk.

ENIGMA - Not strong enough but also I don’t feel you could get it strong enough without making it OP. It is also very situational and I don’t think people are likely to build cards based on it unless you add BF style spotting.

FLYING PIG - An attempt at a joke I assume? Useless really due to both lack of height in game, lack of fall damage and the wall jump. Remove or make it that you take NO fall damage.

QUICK EYE - Not had chance to test this yet, however I feel it is safe to say that 20% is not going to be enough. I would personally start testing at 50% and work down.

SNEAKY - Not worth it in the current build when sound is quite unreliable already. 10% is only scaled on the players volume so if lots of people took this ability people would start increasing their volumes.

SPRINGY - I would more make this remove the slowdown after a long jump. Then in this group of perks you have QUICK DRAW, DOUBLE TIME, QUICK EYE and SPRINGY all as viable/desirable pick ups.

GUARDIAN ANGEL - Kind of a good thing but due to it activating even when its due to friendly airstikes when FF is off it can cause frustration. I would also say a buff is needed to the airstrikes in general that I will make a post about later. Personally in this (the worst perk category) GUARDIAN ANGEL and LOOTER are the only desirables though.

LOOTER - Small health pack should also trigger natural regeneration and give 25hp. Ammo should be 1 full clip. Seems fair. I like it.

PINEAPPLE JUGGLER - Simply it does not work… Most people cook nades as well so this makes it even more useless. Due to client side networking there is a delay from throwing to seeing the nade in the first instance. Waste of a perk. Maybe try having it automated throw back (hands off) that would stop direct hits from nades and you may be onto something. In its current implementation its dumb.

THROWING KNIFES - Not been able to use them yet, not had them used against me. I assume no one is all that excited about the idea.

TRY HARD - 30HP is not going to save you. I suppose its a decent addition but it should continue stacking. Problem is by burning this onto a loadout card you are basically accepting death.

EXTRA AMMO - Feels pointless…

EXTRA SUPPLIES - Feels more of a valid option than EXTRA AMMO at least. Seems fair.

GET UP - Fair but not great. Personally I would have the revive auto trigger the default player health regen.

HEALING REACH - Seems fair for an ability buff. Would not personally take it…

POTENT PACKS - Quite strong when it comes to Healing Station. Packs seem fair.

QUICK CHARGE - Seems like the most desirable Sparks perk. Especially if that revive gun still does damage to the enemy.

There you go.

(Humate) #39

They don’t appear to be imbalanced, but not sure if it’s simply because the impact is so low that it’s hard to tell they are even there to begin with.

I agree with this… as well as the point made on picking cards based on weapon, instead of augments.
None of the augments dictate or compel me to alter the way I would normally play the game.
Having said that the idea of augments and the potential of them (reworked) still interests me.

(Anti) #40

Question for Humate and Inferno based on your feedback then.

Our expectation is that these cards will be used in ranked play in the game but that you wont be able to enter ranked play until you’ve reached a minimum level, a bit like LoL (to ensure you have enough Mercs and load-out choice to be competitive). My question is, would you still be want augments to be more impactful in these circumstances?

We have a fine line to tread in this regard, we want load-outs to be desirable and as a F2P game we obviously need to have people pay for some micro-transactions to make any money (so we don’t really want mechanics and rules that then ban or award stuff people are buying). At the same time we want to avoid pay-to-win and support ranked play, as well as have augments be impactful despite most FPS players default stance to any sort of progression or side-grade being “this is not for comp play!”.

It’s a lot to be considering and balancing at once so getting your point of view would be interesting.